Hamas strike on Israel - Threadbans in op - mod warning in OP updated 19/10/23

If you have any faith in international law, it's the only correct response. Anything else is cheering on genocide and we should call it out without fear of recrimination.

When all this washes out, the US, UK and German public are going to be mortified at what they enabled, encouraged and indeed, profited from financially.

It not like we are going it alone, a few countries appear to be recognising Palestine at the same time. The status quo cant continue in Israel/Palestine no matter how much Israel and the US want it to remain so.

The idea we could pressure the US or Israel to change the government in Israel is farcical.

Ireland have become the useful idiots for Iran and Hamas. Nothing more, nothing less.

A few things to unpack there, but Ireland has always been a believer in, and positive contributor to the UN. That's our backchannel and we support the two state solution and recent calls for ceasefire, which the US vetoed. We condemned IDF murders of UNRWA and UN staff. If we are to influence anyone, our major strength is our respect for the ICC and the institutions of international law in the cause of peace. We're showing real leadership here and I'm impressed with our government because they usually self interested jockstains.

As for the other stuff prior to Oct 7th, we all know this war didn't start on that date. But I fully agree that Hamas anticipated Israels reaction, and Israel is playing into their hands daily. The analogy I've been drawing is the Algerian wars and deGaulle's hysterically brutal response vs the FLN, which brought down the fourth Republic.

wow,there is very likely to be a refugee outflow from Gaza in the future and our Government in the midst of a current immigration/housing crisis puts its hand up as a friendly destination,Roderick's message part 2.

You're essentially arguing that the genocide in Gaza should be ignored by the institutions charged with prosecuting it on the grounds of geopolitics. If anything, we should be more supportive of the ICC that they be given the teeth to prosecute both Hamas and the Israeli government.

Yes absolutely Iran did not like or want to allow improving relationships between Israel and Saudi etc. But don't expect Harris to even begin to understand the Shia Sunni conflict far too nuanced for him. Yes of course there is an ongoing Arab / Israeli conflict but this isn't the issue at hand here. The root cause of this is Iran and Russian meddling and support not the long running and historical Arab / Israeli issue. I suppose this is fundamentally why so many people have gone down the rabbit hole. The attack on 7th October and hostage taking was so extreme they knew Israel would have to react. Putin is very closely aligning to and supporting Iran and this isn't without a price and Iran due to international isolation is very happy to embrace Putin. Iran, Islamic terror groups (HHH etc) and Russia are all gaining here as the West splits and argues. Ask yourself is it any surprise right now as the west is so distracted that Russia has over 500,000 troops inside Ukraine and is pushing forward.

Your figures are based on what, Hamas press releases ?? Seriously ?? How many of the supposed 40,000 are Hamas combatants? How many aid trucks and food supply trucks have been seized and taken by Hamas ? Israel has allowed vast quantites of aid into Gaza after inspection. What are Israel supposed to do with Hamas rocket launchers being used from within civilian areas in Gaza, just leave them alone or destroy them ? The cause is Hamas firing and fighting from within densely populated civilian areas. Aid truck bombings were accidents as has happened in every war. That horrible phrase 'friendly fire' and the fog of war will cause mistakes. War is hell its chaos, it horrendous and it is to be deplored but this isn't genocide. The holocaust or Rwanda or Cambodia was genocide. This is a war in a densely populated civilian area which is going to kill and maime many more people until Hamas stop fighting and release all the hostages. Are the IDF and Israel angels, hell no but in war no one is. I have studied and read about endless conflicts and wars and nothing that is going on here is vaguely genocidal or nefarious, it's war and its deeply unpleasant.

So Ireland will recognise Palestine as an independent state great, could have done it years ago ,but no ,there's an election coming, chancers.

Israel has been the aggresor since 1967.

as if war criminal Bibi Netanyahu is committing war crimes in the name of women’s rights as he bombs women by the thousands and starves them to death by the hundreds of thousands.

🤣

You should read the thread. Oh brother. I’ve been saying for how long? 7 months? That if Israel was serious about destroying Hamas it should go assassinate its leadership in Qatar. Hell there’s the US to do that too. Seal Team Six etc., that covers Haniyeh and everyone else hiding in Qatar. Hamas condemnation is already baked in, it’s foundational to the topic, it started on page 1. What’s more controversial and hence garners more conversation is western support and condoning and alliance with Israel and its violent overkill agenda that has amounted to genocide. The options to end the war are right there, in Qatar, but that’s clearly not Israel’s goal, they want more settlements they want more land they want, as many of their officials have openly said in as many months, a second Nakba, ethnic cleansing, “between the sea and Jordan there shall only be Israeli sovereignty” “go and smite Amalek” etc. - they are engaged in western backed genocide in lieu of cutting the head off the snake. That’s very interesting don’t you think?