Hamas strike on Israel - Threadbans in op - mod warning in OP updated 19/10/23

Jesus, talk about missing the point. Why didn’t you include Brian Boru and Strongbow while you were at it?

Will right wing settlers in Israel look to take advantage of course they will. The chaos and confusion of this war will have all sorts of groups trying to take advantage but it does not detract from the core issue at hand which is Iranian aggression towards Israel to destabilize Israel and the region. Great diplomacy and problem solving is about recognizing the immediate danger and threat and the 'biggest problem' and focusing on solving that. It isn't always very obvious but it apparently clear to me and many others that the 'clear and present danger' here is Iran and their extremist regime. Today the Irish Government has done nothing but help the Iranian regime and it's clear Harris hasn't actually identified the clear and present danger here and is misguided.

Fair game according to some on here as they are doing their mandatory military service and therefore not civilians. Sadly I'd say most are probably either dead or pregnant at this stage and unlikely to ever be released alive. Can't have people seeing what Hamas really are, it might put a dent in the propaganda campaign which is going swimmingly, although I doubt it would matter to some of the most fervent Israel haters

Still none the wiser, not seeing the benefit/reason

They obviously have a right to retaliate, but as usual they are completely disproportionate with their retaliation. You are probably aware of this, but this article includes numbers of respective casualties year on year since 2008. As you can see, the Israeli casualties are dwarfed by the number of casualties on the Palestinian side, for both fatalities and injuries.

https://www.cnbc.com/2023/11/12/israel-hamas-war-data-shows-human-cost-of-conflict-through-the-years.html

The vast number of casualties is the very thing that is maintaining any support for Hamas and many commentators are saying that the current episode will fuel Hamas recruits for decades, especially as many Palestinians don't see any other future for themselves, so they are willing to become martyrs for their cause.

An option that Israel has not tried for the past 75 years has been to show the Palestinians that they have a future, to live normal lives with self determination, as opposed to being trapped in a concentration camp. What's the definition of madness again?

So Israel intends to isolate the diplomats of 146 countries and counting.

Has anybody in the thread written anything in support of Hamas or suggested they were anything but regressive Islamic extremists? If they have I want them outed for everyone to see.

You still are continuing to confuse two separate issues. Yes there of course is an intractable and ever running Palestinian / Israeli issue and honestly we could talk all night on this and like many before make little progress. Fundamentally you have two tribes who both want to live in the same place. It's really little more complicated than that but entirely intractable. Yes you then have outside influences who will take advantage of the situation to promote their own agenda.

But the problem today is not a Palestinian / Israeli problem, it is an Israeli / Iranian problem and to even begin to understand what to do next you have to accept and understand this. Hamas following it's move away from Saudi funding (due to US pressure on Saudi) is entirely in the pocket of Iran. (With funds coming from Syria and around the gulf as well but it's Iran who pulls the strings and provides the cash, resources and weapons).

I have no doubt the attacks of 7th October were at best 'encouraged' by Iran, at worst actually 'ordered and planned' by Iran and it has shattered any progress that had been made between Israel and Egypt and Saudi, isolating Israel and disrupting the entire Middle East with ripples beyond no doubt helping the Russians as splits occur in the west and it's clear how close Russia and Iran are. The Iranian regime benefits just like they have done by supporting the Houthis, another proxy war force.

Hamas yes may have risen from the ashes of Israeli and Palestinian tensions but even they are being used to a degree by Iran to 'get at' Israel. The Palestinians are being used by Iran as well.

Would love to think this will end soon for the sake of all but without regime change in Iran I can't see it.

I'd see Hamas as the lesser of two evils, with Israel being the greater evil but do not support Hamas.

What astonishes me is that certain posters here support Israel. Israel are currently racing to exceed the atrocities committed by the Nazis in a per capita by basis. What the British did in the North is almost nothing compared to the scale of atrocities committed by the Israelis.

To me the posters supporting Israel are incomprehensible. How could you as an Irish person support a nation that has been torturing, robbing, raping, imprisoning and murdering the native population for 75 years?

I knew a Gazan very well and maybe that's the difference. I di not consider them human animals.

That does not mean Palalestinians don’t have a right to their own state. Vast majority of whom do not live in Hamas controlled areas. In reality the reason Hamas gained control of Gaza is because they were facilitated by Netanyahu to undermine the PA.

The mantra of the violent thug "Why did you have to make me do this to you?"

This doesn't change anything. Just virtue signalling by our out of touch gov, nothing new. Stupid twats should be more concerned about domestic issues.

I completely agree.

My thoughts on this is I support a 2 state solution however it's dreadful timing by the government and feels like grandstanding.

I don't know did you watch The Tonight Show but Dan O'Brien made some good points on this. I particularly loved the part where he said the minister would be better off doing stuff that actual has an impact on the Irish citizens