Russia-Ukraine War

When will governments in the West ever f***in realise: telling Ukraine not to cross certain lines that would provoke Russia does not earn respect and goodwill from Russia, but only contempt. Every single day Russia pushes boundaries, not just in Ukraine but in all of Europe, with sabotage, spying, election meddling, physical violence, etc etc, and it will keep doing so as long as the only response from Europe is impotent expressions of "outrage" rather than hitting back in the same form.

Perhaps there has been a longterm (secret) agreement between Western governments and Russia along those lines.

Whether that was right or wrong it may be that those governments have to respect such an agreement.

Don't forget there must be a hope that some of those around Putin may be amenable to forceful but honest language and may be able to twist Putin's arm(a euphemism I hope) when the time is right.

So Trumps plan to end the war in one day is to bomb Moscow... well that might end a lot of things in one day alright.

Of course it is all lies / playing to the gallery in front of him whatever will get a reaction.

jake sullivan quinched that very fast

I note that Putin has threatened UKr - with severe consequences- if the ‘West ‘ allows it to use its weapons to bomb/attack targets on Russian land.

So to continue the ‘war of words’ strategy , why not the following words from the UKr side - for whatever reason !!!!!!!!!
(1). Tell Ru that if it bombs civilian targets again that it can expect severe consequences at a TIME OF OUR CHOOSING

(2) we note that you are buying/ getting arms from China, North Korea and Iran and using them on our sacred soil. You, Putin , and these supporters will suffer the consequences in due course

Make it so

if that happens then should China North Korea and Iran , for starters, experience the same fate. Re Serbia, Hungry and Turkey helping Russia in any way - militarywise

Seriously, that's just not our gig. Ever. We did supply medical and de-mining equipment though, which is fair enough.

What happens? Hopefully Russia starts to see many more mysterious explosions in locations that they are attacking from. Things that go "BOOOOOOM" in the night (and daytime) !!

I'd say Kadyrov looks alright for someone who was rumoured to have died last year.

But there's been something 'not right' in Russia for a long time. I'd say Putin almost thrives on this kind of political intrigue. How long have people been falling out of windows while gardening or playing golf etc. ?

@TheValeyard If you look at this map and particularly russia above kharkiv, thats russia. There are about 3 russia oblasts there along in a line toward russia occupied areas in east ukraine ( the red ) inc belgorad area where russia all along has used as an untouchable staging area for troops and for firing weapons into ukraine. Putin knowing they remain untouched by the blocks put on ukraine.

So, I am hearing the US and others will allow use of there weapons ONLY for those oblasts in russia. This then pushes staging areas and russia weapons platforms firing into ukraine further north into russia.

@Wolf359f I would doubt Belarus would be used TBH. I would say if they were firing in from Belarus to Ukraine that might create a legit situ where Luka is then a legit target I would say?

"Ridiculous situation where Ukraine has to sit there waiting until the Russians cross the border before they can fire on them."

Yip, always thought that right from Feb 24th 22 ( my birthday :D .. for ever marked )

When there's been talk of a negotiated settlement including a demilitarised zone, the bothsiders always say that it should be on the occupied territory. Effectively making a demilitarised zone of these four oblasts on the Russian side of the border would be a far better long-term solution for Ukraine (and Europe) - and a clear signal to Putin that making a move on any other country's territory (e.g. Georgia) was more than likely to result in his USSR v2.0 getting progressively smaller.

UK Storm Shadows…same missile.

Or a few SCALPS with "Le Storm Shadow" and a few Union Jacks stickered on

Just the missile launch sites. But not other military targets? Why not concentrations of troops? What about airfields that bombers are taking off from? Ammo dumps? Radars? AA installations? Command posts.

What he said wasn't quite as restrictive as that - he said (translated) "sites from which missiles are fired, military sites from which Ukraine is attacked" which I would take to include any bases where troops are massed with an apparently obvious intention to invade (i.e. close to the border) and airfields from which the bomb-launching aircraft take off. The "not other military targets" would seem to exclude, say, training grounds in the Moscow region or airfields in the far east of the country.

Sounds to me like a politically sensible compromise - a very clear "get the fk out of Ukraine, Putin, and we'll leave you salvage what dignity you can; but we're the ones drawing lines on the map now."