Irish Property Market chat II - *read mod note post #1 before posting*

I think you are overthinking a bit to be fair.

If this were true, we would not need ftb grants, shared ownership etc

As you say there is no shortage of demand, but what you saw was the tip of the iceberg. Those that are priced out are not going to waste there time looking there probably working longer hours or 2nd jobs to afford the rent

on point 2 the new units are probably A rated homes versus a G rate old 3 bed. If this is the case then theirs is an incentive Just like there is an incentive to upgrade the old G rate home. The issue is that the payback period is to long for elderly people to actually end up saving money although saying that if it was an A rating house value would but that would only benefit whoever the house was left to.

yes guess it depends on your wages and where you work - some public sector workers would be lukcy to see 40 cent in a euro of an increase after pension levy about 10.5%, paye 40%, prsi 4%, usc 4-8%, and additional pension related deductions, guess higher paid private sector workers would get about half the pay rise after tax before cost of living changes

Over a year ago I had a conversation with someone on here, who held a negative opinion on the market and wasn't going to sway regardless, and asked the question "do you think it is possible that in 10-15 years time we could look back and think that people who bought property at the start of this inflationary event actually fluked the timing of their purchase perfectly".

I don't think there was much talk of wage rises on here up to that point but on the next page Data was talking about his wife getting something like 7% wage rise this year (2023) and 5% the next. Yet the guy still didn't understand the point I was making.

When you start compounding big increases like that it doesn't take long for your gross increases to be commensurate with your mortgage payment. If you bought just before covid you've also got an additional 6 figures of equity in your property, even if you bought a shed.

I used to think I'd give anything to be able to buy in 2014, I bet there are people who think the same about 2019, now.

We've had this debate a few times already but in my opinion. Older homes are better located, have proportionately larger rooms and bigger gardens (many of these characteristics can be a headache for those who wish to downsize) but from a valuation perspective should balance out with standard new builds if not give the edge to older homes.

More worryingly, the construction sector and there lobbyists seem to get away with pricing 1 and 2 bed apartments at a higher price to 3 bed homes. If the price of a 2 bed social and affordable apartment in Limerick is 630,000, we can forget about downsizing as a mechanism for more efficient use of existing housing stock

There are people now who wished they had bought in 2006. The people who bought then thought that they were financially ruined and stuck with an albatross. Now they are sitting in their houses and apartments with nearly 2/3rds of their mortgage paid off, probably on trackers and wondering what they were ever worried about in the first place.

I have one family member who we all felt very sorry for because he had 4 houses that he had bought from 2000 to 2006. We used to wish we were as wealthy as him, then from 2008 on we pitied him and thought he would be in debt for the rest of his life. Well, hes rich again.

are the banks really lending 4 times earning - had a family member public servant on good wages 85k, good savings and saving record, no loans, overdraft, not using credit cards - struggling to get approval for 200k loan from avant for 250k house - they are looking to reduce credit limit on un-used credit cards from about 14k down to 5k before approval

it looks like it is very tough for single buyers out there, maybe it is just avant are more stringent with lending than other providers - hard to see house prices going up much more if mortgage providers are that fussy.?

x4 is the limit (unless you have an exemption) not the norm.
Banks can choose to lend less.

Really need to act on this, severe deterrents need to be put in place immediately

Organised theft

Fine Gael's Marian Agrios entered into another agreement – separate from the two reported by The Ditch – that compelled a developer to increase a €100k+ package she got to withdraw her appeal.

This agreement added €26k worth of work to the package

they are 46 but can get loan for 23 years to 70 so while not now typical 35 year mortgage many are getting still historically a normal length of time for mortgage

they also will have pension lump sum and defined benefit pension so on just shy of 90k per year there won't be an issue paying back a 200k mortgage

may tell them to try AIB, credit union, MoCo or mortgage broker and see if they are any easier to deal with avant

if lenders are only lending about 2.5 times earnings single applications dont have much of a chance

You have a knack for grabbing a headline and beating it to death without actually seeing the entire economic landscape :)

What is catching him is there ability to repay matrix and Advant is borrowing money on the open market to fund mortgages.

If they are borrowing 4 times salary 340k repayments would be about 1800/ month over 23 years. There disposable income works be about 4.5k/ months so repayments are 40% of disposable income.

In reality they have to shop around. My son got 4 times off PTSB. BOI would have given him nearly 5 times his actual salary they were giving him 100% benefit for his shift and premium pay but he woukd havevto restarthis savings pattern at a higher rate. The CU's were giving him 4 time on basic pay only.

Different entities use different matrix. Affordability will be biggest issue for him

The buyers in 01, 06, 14 and 19 didn't know it was a good time to buy, and likely all evidence pointed to it being a poor time to buy.

People who bought in 2008 didn't know it was a terrible time to buy.

If there's one thing we learned, economists are constantly wrong in predicting Ireland's property market. As I said, you can only play the hand you're dealt and you only have the information available to you today.

Hindsight is 20/20.

Central Bank rules are 4 times salary, 4.5 times with an exemption. Maximum, cannot exceed this but can also offer less depending on people's circumstances.

The Central Bank's rules limit the maximum amount someone can borrow. This is four times your gross annual income if you're a first-time buyer and 3.5 times your gross annual income if you're a second-time or subsequent buyer. The same rules apply regardless of how much you earn. With an exemption a mortgage seeker can potentially borrow up to 4.5 times their income.  - https://www.bonkers.ie/guides/mortgage/what-are-the-central-banks-lending-rules/