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General British politics discussion thread

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    #12812
    ancapailldorcha
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,708 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122209051#Comment_122209051

    What's the point of them, now? Their brand's in the bin and nobody knows who their current leader is.

    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



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    #12813
    Danzy
    Registered Users Posts: 13,826 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122209503#Comment_122209503

    Their cause is still Scottish independence just because there last 2 leaders were working against that, doesn't mean that the membership is.

    That they have made Labour electable once more shows how damaged their brand is.



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    #12814
    Danzy
    Registered Users Posts: 13,826 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122205250#Comment_122205250

    Starmer is pushing out the lunatic fringe of bigots and cranks that flooded in to the party.

    You can't a functional organization with people like them in it.



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    #12815
    silverharp
    Registered Users Posts: 18,274 ✭✭✭✭silverharp


    Id hope Labour win in a landslide just to make uk politics comical again, full wokist, trans loving, anti white racist, it will be great craic

    A belief in gender identity involves a level of faith as there is nothing tangible to prove its existence which, as something divorced from the physical body, is similar to the idea of a soul. - Colette Colfer



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    #12816
    rock22
    Registered Users Posts: 1,612 ✭✭✭rock22


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122209503#Comment_122209503

    Support for Scottish Independence is still over 40% so their brand is not in the bin. There are unfortunate in having had an incompetent leader and possibly a fraudulent one.

    John Swinney is the leader btw



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    #12817
    ancapailldorcha
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,708 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122209578#Comment_122209578

    I know who the leader is. I meant that the British/Scottish public may not.

    The brand is kind of in the bin in fairness. Sure, they may be strong in Holyrood but if they lose a lot of their MPs in July, as may be likely, they'll be much weaker.

    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



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    #12818
    pixelburp
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 36,457 CMod ✭✭✭✭pixelburp


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122209503#Comment_122209503

    Outside of Scotland maybe but from what I understand Swinney is a longstanding figure of Scottish politics; chosen because he was a stable pair of hands from the first days of Hollyrood.

    Their brand is in the bin, but support for independence still sits in that 40+ range. If the SNP can clear house and go back to formula, no reason they can't arrest their decline. And much will also depend on how Labour is perceived, after they romp home.



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    #12819
    breezy1985
    Registered Users Posts: 25,955 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122209503#Comment_122209503

    The point of them is the amount of seats they will get usually outstrips the Lib Dems.

    Is it not important how many seats they get or how many themselves and Labour battle for.

    Its Just the typical ignorance and exceptionalism of the English media and public to ignore the "lesser subjects" of the Union.



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    #12820
    ancapailldorcha
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,708 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122209648#Comment_122209648

    I'm afraid I just don't see it. Their rise was similar to the Lib Dems'. Both major parties were toxic so people plumped for the third option. Now that one party is electable, it creates serious problems for them. Usually, clearing house and going back to formula happens when in opposition.

    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



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    #12821
    breezy1985
    Registered Users Posts: 25,955 ✭✭✭✭breezy1985


    They are currently looking at 16/17 which is a big drop from 48 and will go from 3rd to 4th largest party in the UK



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    #12822
    pixelburp
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 36,457 CMod ✭✭✭✭pixelburp


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122209684#Comment_122209684

    We'll see soon enough of course. The difference here though is the main alternatives can read as slightly contemptuous for Scotland and Scottish issues; for sure the Tories who have been non existent north of Berwick, but the Labour government would want to remember to keep its narratives as that of British ones, not English.

    An alternative to the SNP exists re. independence with Alba but has been functionally dead outside of Alex Salmond, so the SNP lack credible rivals for now.



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    #12823
    A Dub in Glasgo
    Registered Users Posts: 17,189 ✭✭✭✭A Dub in Glasgo


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122209503#Comment_122209503

    John Swinney is very well known in Scotland



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    #12824
    ancapailldorcha
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 38,708 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122209704#Comment_122209704

    Of course. I may well be wrong. They won't be wiped out in Scotland but I don't think they'll be in a position to obtain another IndyRef for a very long time, if ever. Starmer will know that Scotland is winnable for Labour. I don't see him showing anything like the level of contempt the Conservatives have for the Scots.

    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



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    #12825
    A Dub in Glasgo
    Registered Users Posts: 17,189 ✭✭✭✭A Dub in Glasgo


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122209121#Comment_122209121

    So a Labour hardliner is somebody who calls Starmer a soft Tory? Your idea of what is hardline is not the same as mine (or most people I suspect).



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    #12826
    Tony EH
    Registered Users Posts: 19,272 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122209532#Comment_122209532

    More worthless blather from you.

    I suppose we shouldn't expect anything more at this stage.



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    #12827
    Tony EH
    Registered Users Posts: 19,272 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    Had to laugh at Sunak's remark today that Starmer's decision on Abbott shows that it's actually Angela Rayner who's "in charge" of the Labour Party.



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    #12828
    pixelburp
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 36,457 CMod ✭✭✭✭pixelburp


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122209728#Comment_122209728

    As might I; as to Labour's attitude, we'll just have to see. It seems to be a dead cert the SNP are gonna lose a lot of seats regardless of what Swinney does or says - the critical part will be how many.



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    #12829
    A Dub in Glasgo
    Registered Users Posts: 17,189 ✭✭✭✭A Dub in Glasgo


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122209728#Comment_122209728

    How do the people in Scotland get a mandate to decide on another referendum?



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    #12830
    Water John
    Registered Users Posts: 21,389 ✭✭✭✭Water John


    If Labour conduct themselves in Scotland as they do in Wales, when Mark Drakeford was leader, they should do well in Scotland and hold those seats in future. A good block of seats in Scotland, are really important to Labour, not just this election but into the future. BTW, if you're passionate about Indy and don't want to support SNP, one can always vote Green.



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    #12831
    PommieBast
    Registered Users Posts: 2,741 ✭✭✭PommieBast


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122210125#Comment_122210125

    In 2014 it was down to Salmond having a majority whereas Cameron didn't. There isn't any solid criteria, just circumstances.



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    #12832
    A Dub in Glasgo
    Registered Users Posts: 17,189 ✭✭✭✭A Dub in Glasgo


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122211055#Comment_122211055

    So it is a voluntary union?



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    #12833
    PommieBast
    Registered Users Posts: 2,741 ✭✭✭PommieBast


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122211141#Comment_122211141

    I take the simplistic view that the 2014 No vote removed any doubt about the legitimacy of the union.



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    #12834
    A Dub in Glasgo
    Registered Users Posts: 17,189 ✭✭✭✭A Dub in Glasgo


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122211307#Comment_122211307

    So is the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland a voluntary union?



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    #12835
    Randycove
    Registered Users Posts: 219 ✭✭Randycove


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122209611#Comment_122209611

    they, like the Tories, have proven the analogy between governments and nappies.



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    #12836
    PommieBast
    Registered Users Posts: 2,741 ✭✭✭PommieBast


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122211390#Comment_122211390

    The Scottish populace voted to accept the status-quo, so I will say yes.



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    #12837
    lumphammer2
    Registered Users Posts: 862 ✭✭✭lumphammer2


    Sunak needs to go …. and never come back …. the conservatives need a makeover and need to return to the centre …. under Sunak they have drifted very far to the right …. and god knows what Sunak could suggest next …. compulsory military service being one of his latest 'gems' …. but keep on talking like that boyo and you will do the UK and the world a favour by turning off 99% of your electorate …..

    This particular boyo needs to be removed from high office as he is not fit to govern a democracy in 2024 …. he has dictatorial and warmongering tendencies and is dangerous to British and European democracy …. get him out and out for good …. the Tories need to have a long spell in opposition to allow them to reconsider their recent moves to the hard right ….

    Sunak is your typical way too young way too inexperienced idiot who thinks he is god …. dangerous person with v little experience of politics becomes PM …. these guys are not qualified to manage a shop …..



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    #12838
    Shoog
    Registered Users Posts: 5,012 ✭✭✭Shoog


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122212110#Comment_122212110

    Sunak is now considered a moderate Tory, the party has drifted to the hard right and Sunak was elected as a boat ankor to attempt to stop the drift to the more fascistic extreme elements of the party taking over. It has failed because after Johnson's purge of moderates the party is chocked full of extremists. The election of Truss shows that the party membership are even more extreme than the parliamentary party.

    I wonder if there is a path back to the centre for the Tory party.



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    #12839
    rock22
    Registered Users Posts: 1,612 ✭✭✭rock22


    @Shoog "I wonder if there is a path back to the centre for the Tory party."

    It may require a change in the election process for their leader. As long as the general member ship decide on the leader there will always be a danger of someone from the far right of the party being elected .

    I never understood what was wrong with the idea of parliamentary members electing the party leader for any party



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    #12840
    A Dub in Glasgo
    Registered Users Posts: 17,189 ✭✭✭✭A Dub in Glasgo


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122212040#Comment_122212040

    The people in the UK voted to have the Tories govern them so why are we allowing an election?



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    #12841
    Seth Brundle
    Moderators, Politics Moderators Posts: 39,714 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    Mod: some posts deleted. Any more goading and I'll be banning people!



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