Time for a zero refugee policy? - *Read OP for mod warnings and threadbans - updated 11/5/24*

When you resort to making things up it isn't a good look. Ireland haven't taken in more Ukrainians per capita than any other EU nation.

I'm happy to change the term to anti-refugee sentiment. Or maybe anti-persons fleeing war sentiment? I'm comfortable using both terms.

I can't provide evidence of this thread influencing the government tbf. I accept that. So instead, we can agree that posters on this thread who've demended that Ukrainians be targeted with cuts and disincentives to stay in Ireland are no doubt delighted that the Government have done exactly that.

Happy?

Why, at a time when Government efficiency in the area is declining and abuse of the system has increased exponentially, would a person become interested in addressing the issue? I wonder indeed. McDowell is consistent on the issue, I commend him for that, but I won’t condemn McNamara or others for altering their opinion in light of recent developments in the area. McNamara is an intelligent, eloquent speaker which is valuable, whether he has altered his views because the reality of the policy space has changed, or because it is politically convenient, or out of some mixture of the two. And I suspect it’s his capability, rather than some drive to expose hypocrisy, that has you so exercised.

So anecdotal then, thanks.

Anti-persons fleeing war? Could we not agree on anti-persons gaming a system set up for people fleeing war in order to gain residency rights where they don't meet work visa criteria?

That's not even up for debate, I do not include them, I include Albanians, Georgians, Algerians, South Africans, Pakistanis, Nigerians, countries where it is possible for citizens to live a safe and peaceful life, yet we are inundated with IPAs from these countries and it is causing an unnecessary drain on resources trying to help persons fleeing an actual war, see the displacement of Ukrainians to accommodate unprocessed IPAs.

I notice the article you linked to is from October 2023 and only tells one part of the story. The OECD figures for 2023 show that Ireland had one of the highest rates per capita in the EU, and more than Germany, France or the UK. Only six countries in the EU took more per capita than we did.

In November 2023 EU published figures showed that between September 2022 and September 2023, Ireland had an increase in the number of Ukrainian refugees arriving, of around 72%, whereas across the EU the average figure was a 7.5% increase.

Jean-Christophe Dumont, head of the OECD International Migration Division, said the high numbers of Ukrainians fleeing to Ireland was “surprising”, due to Ireland’s location and the tiny Ukrainian diaspora in Ireland before the war.

Long speeches are an Irish tradition. We are a nation of orators, we're loquacious, long-winded, verbose, it's an Irish trait and long may it survive.

I don't know why you assume xenophobia just because some of us don't want Ireland to be flooded with hordes of dodgy men from Albania, Georgia, Nigeria etc. who can then spend years in the asylum system, lodging appeal after appeal. In what way is it a good thing for Ireland?

This discussion started with another poster asking for clarification about said politician being a " career politician " .

So yes @MegamanBoo has successfully shown that Michael McNamara is , a career politician and as such will do what it takes to get elected .

As long as people are aware of that no problem .

But you quote Pat Rabbitte whose smart answer completely decimated public trust in his party and lost them multiple seats

There are many voting next Friday who would not be happy if the person they voted for flipped in another direction purely because" thats what politicians do "!

He has not stated yet afaik which group in Europe he will ally with... said he wants to get to know them first ..fair enough.But those voting really should know because the groups in the European Parliament are crucial to the effectiveness of the MEP you are voting for .

I agree . Very insulting to be presumed to be Xenophobic because we see a serious problem arising

Most people are tolerant and accepting of genuine refugees and genuine asylum seekers and are happy to help and support them

Most people also know that allowing those in who are not fleeing war but are financial migrants in is making life more difficult for those in real need . Most people know that when resources are limited that you must prioritise those resources for those who need it most .
Our resources , shelter and support is of course limited we dont have a magic money tree or can magic up enough housing so we have to be selective where our resources go

If that is called Xenophobia then people naturally call it out and reply .

Fair enough. The article is clear but doesn't mention the comparatively high number of Ukrainian refugees in Ireland compared to most EU countries.

What's your opinion regarding the OECD's immigration head and his bewilderment as to why so many Ukrainians headed for Ireland? Why do you think they did?

Should be taken into account that one of the main reasons took in so many Ukrainians is that Ireland is not a member of NATO and was therefore in no position to help Ukraine militarily. We are virtually the only country in western Europe who is not a member.

tbh I'm on the fence at this point on McNamara myself.

On the one hand I find the views he's now pushing deplorable, and for my money he epitomizes the great anti-immigration swindle.

On the other hand if the electorate are to elect some anti-immigration candidates, McNamara is the ideal choice for those of us who oppose the lies put forward by this movement. He lacks credibility not just for his dramatic 180 political u-turn but also for his previous flirtations with the anti-vax, anti-mask brigades. More importantly his previous experience and statements effectively undermine an awful lot of the anti-immigration narratives around 'unvetted males', islamophobia and the O'Gorman tweets.

As an aside I find his behavior here quite fascinating. I think it takes some brass-neck to come from where he did and now jump on the anti-immigration bandwagon. I'd also think it quite a dangerous route. How desperately does this guy need to be re-elected that he'll put himself in a position where he can be, and essentially has been, accused of stealing votes from the Irish far-right movement, some of whom we know to be extremely dangerous and violent.

The only way to get a Danish approach to immigration is to force it at the ballot box.

All three of the government parties have made it extremely clear that having an open and friendly policy towards asylum seekers is an important policy.

I see a few people here who seem to be under this mistaken opinion that some of the people in government will somehow be persuaded to change their mind. This is the stuff of fantasy and is in direct contradiction to their words and actions.

He's not anti-vax but as I said he's flirted with anti-vax positions.

He's certainly seen here as an anti-immigration candidate, unless you lot are washing your hands of him now?

Well said - I feel the exact same. You captured the madness of it all so well.

Absolutely agree. Policies of deterrence consistent with the Danish model - increased thresholds for protection, reduced protection time-limits, reduced access to the labour market, reduced access to welfare, increased use of detention, reduced family reunification - are increasing in popularity throughout the EU. In Ireland, awareness of the Danish model has to be increased. Establishment politicians and the press are uninterested in entertaining it and right-wing candidates appear to have fairly limited understanding of it. As awareness of it increases, it’s popularity will increase. The key is to increase awareness.