General Premier League Thread 2023-24 Mod Note in op 27/6/23 And 21/05/24

He took over PSG halfway through the season and ended up with a 1 point difference from when he took over! In other news Terzic has left Dortmund so maybe heading to Chelsea.

He took over PSG when they were a point behind Lille at the midway point of the season.

I don't think it's unreasonable to expect a top level manager at PSG to overturn a 1 point difference with half a season to go

https://www.theguardian.com/football/2020/dec/24/paris-saint-germain-psg-thomas-tuchel-mauricio-pochettino

" Tuchel has paid the price for a slow start in Ligue 1, where PSG have four defeats in their first 17 games and are a point behind Lyon and Lille."

Yup, definitely unfair. The only team he's done less than very good at is PSG, which is about as unsuitable a club as one could imagine for a manager like him. He's a builder, and a guy who gets guys pulling together for a greater whole - PSG at that stage was galacticos-central. Still did fine, got his league (winning by 15 points) and cup there, so I'd forgive him for that bit of a blip in his first few months there (i'll forgive absolutely any manager not hitting the ground running in their first half-season, especially arriving into a club mid-season).

And that Leicester season isn't much of a stick to beat him with - he was only in a title race because other teams were rubbish, but Spurs got basically exactly the number of points you'd have expected, with a 5 point improvement on the previous season finishing with 69 points. Not really his fault that 69 points actually put him reasonably close to a title. And that was only his second season there, well short of the peak they went onto.

The following season they finished with a frankly incredible 86 points - that was their peak. To have achieved a points total like that with as little resources as he had was fantastic.

I think it's important to match the expectation with the achievement… like, had he been at United, or Liverpool, or Arsenal for years and didn't win a trophy, fair enough. But he wasn't. Sure, there was a possibility he could win something, and got close, but there wasn't an expectation that he would. Getting 86 points and a Champions League Final with an outsider team is really impressive. He's come closer to breaking Spurs into the top tier than any other manager in decades. And since Pep came to England 8 years ago, only 3 managers have ever finished above him - Klopp, Conte, and Pochettino.

And sure, not winning a French league in a season he arrived halfway during is a bit disappointing… but he did actually only arrive halfway through. Not sure it's all that fair to blame the fella who came in after someone else was sacked. In reality it takes any manager a bit of time to figure out their squad, get to know the lay of the land etc - putting the expectation to succeed arriving cold in mid-season, no prep, no preseason, no time, is unfair imo. When given the full season - as is more reasonable to base success on - he won the league comfortably.

And imo getting that rabble at Chelsea into the shape to finish the season with 5 months of top-4 form was a terrific job too. Clear obvious work vastly improving what was there. It's that sort of turnaround that would make me fear United if he went there.

He was still at Chelsea when Liverpool had a deal done with Slott. Given their form in the last few months I'd imagine most people thought he was safe for another year.

I like poch, did well at spurs, kept them very competitive, hasn't found the right club since. Not winning something in the klopp and pep era in no argument against him. I suppose losing a league to Leicester is a black mark. Wouldn't have had a problem him coming to Liverpool.

I have this vague sense that Slot is seen as a bit of a lower-risk shot to nothing - does a lot of things quite like Klopp, similar personality, likes similar players, uses a similar style, so if they can keep the good times rolling without major upheavel or rebuilding then it's all good. If it doesn't work, then they can take the bigger risk of someone who will need more new signings and system changes, like going for Alonso next season for instance.

We'll have to see - though I think it helps that Liverpool have wholly revamped the behind-the-scenes positions with highly rated staff, along with getting back Edwards and Ward. With the talent and strong age profile in the squad, and this rebuilt club structure, it's quite an exciting project - so as much as there's this feeling of an 'end' with Klopp, there's also the excitement of a promising beginning. Think it'll start with new contracts for Trent and VVD right away anyway, locking them in for another few years - and hopefully Mo too, but that one is probably a bit trickier.

I'm with the guys saying he hasn't won anything. Great at putting a squad together but I just think he is too nice of a guy and doesn't have the ruthlessness in him to get a team over the line.

I like him, like the style of football his teams play but he's just not a winner. He's just too nice of a guy.

If players don't perform, and I'm talking about more than one, then that's on the manager. He's not just responsible for putting out good formations and tactics.

Ex-Liverpool player is a bit of a stretch, the club got him on loan from Real Madrid for a short period and the manager at the time had no interest in playing him.

Jaysus, it only seems like yesterday that the Liverpool thread was ripping chunks out of each other on how useless this fellah was

Brighton appoint the St Pauli manager Hurzeler, at 31 the youngest manager ever in the PL, a good 7 years younger than Milner who he will be managing next year.

https://www.theguardian.com/football/article/2024/jun/15/brighton-confirm-fabian-hurzeler-31-new-head-coach

If you haven't been involved in coaching it's a lot harder to have a good idea about it.

Have you coached much?

Yes, but its some ssssssssssstttttttttttttttttttttrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrreeeeeeeeeeeeeeetttttttttttttttttccccccccccccccccchhhhhhhhhhhhh to define a player who played 7 games from a 350 game career (i.e. 2%) as an ex-player for that club!

OK. Sorry, 12 games from 350, practically a legend at the club. I'm waiting for the mural.

Here is what "This Is Anfield" said "Forgotten ex-Liverpool man announced as the new Dortmund manager". More accurate me-thinks, but yes, pedantic though it is he is an ex-player. Mea culpa, mea cupla, mea maxima culpa.

It just seemed strange based on how little of his career was at the club.

e.g. Here are two players in the England squad, both with equally valid descriptions.

"Ex-Norwich player selected by Southgate for Euros squad" and "Ex-Chelsea player starts for England vs. Serbia"

Both are 100% accurate but to me, not the most relevant description of the players I have in mind.

You do realise the more you talk about it the more of a Liverpool legend he becomes? 😁

A championship manager legend.

I can clearly see that I am in a minority here, with even less people on my side than Premier League appearances by Kim "the Gooner" Källström :) I will do my homework and study hard for the 2024-25 season!

4,776 players have made at least one Premier League appearance. James Milner has played against 2,277 of them.

From van Aanholt, Patrick to Zverotić, Elsad. I'll squeeze this in before the new fixtures are announced tomorrow.

Transfermarkt says he’s played with 274 of them (on the pitch at the same time). 0mins with Caulker, he came on in the 90th minute of the 5-4 away to Norwich, all the way up to 9275mins with Bobby Firminho