The Official Cavan GAA Discussion thread.

I said the main reason I believe here previously and was told by a poster that it isn’t the job of clubs to develop players for the county team.

We’ve too many clubs. The best young players in age groups are often left having to play midfield because they are the outstanding talent in average sides so are needed there to get teams a foothold in games. It’s no wonder that our best forwards come from the likes of the Gaels, Killygarry and Lough because those are clubs with bigger numbers where a better player could actually develop as a forward because they can play there in juvenile club games.

It was said a decade ago by our “development manager”. The Cavan U21 teams had no outstanding forwards because they had teams full of lads that all played midfield for their clubs.

My club is doing all it can. If all were fit, the Lough would have had three of the starting six forwards yesterday, including one should be at midfield.

Go through the regular amalgamations in underage football - St Finbarrs, Blackwater, Dernacrieve - it’s alot more than two that need to go.

It's not the job of the clubs to develop players for the county team.

I don't think your theory holds water. Shehu and Lovett who we are discussing as lacking that top level shooting execution and decision making, neither played midfield for their club.

If you're suggesting all the top forwards in the country all played solely as inside forwards for their clubs at underage, that's simply not correct. Club teams want their best players on the ball and will often play them in areas of the field where they get on the ball the most, that's not a Cavan phenomenon.

I’d feel that it is the job of the clubs. The highest pinnacle for your club’s players is to play for the county team. Have you coached at any level?

Lovett and Shehu would be two examples supporting my theory. They are still novices at IC, give them time to adapt to the speed of it. That’s the difference at every level of the game, everything gets quicker. That’s why some lads are just good club footballers, they can’t adapt to the speed needed at the higher level of the game.

I’m saying a high percentage of the top forwards in my opinion came from clubs where they were allowed to develop as forwards and not expected to carry the rest of the team out the field. Even the lads from smaller clubs that were good forwards, a lot of the time they came from a very strong team that club had. For example, Quigley is coming from Denn’s first ever team to win a Division 1 title and has always been allowed play in the forwards and develop there. Had he been like the majority of Denn players of the past, he’d be out the field running his proverbials off, expected to be everywhere.

You can't use lads that are 17 as a example of what this discussion is about come back to Quigley if he ever becomes a top class Senior player for Cavan..

The top 5 teams in division one currently Croserlough, Ramor, Gowna, Cavan Gaels, and Kingscourt who would all have reasonable picks have one top class forward between them but some how it's the small clubs who are not developing them that is the problem and you would be happy to see them disbanded as it will help?

That’s a fair point re Quigley but he was an apt example for the point at the time.

As I said, Crosserlough would have had 3 starting forwards for Cavan yesterday had they been fit. In fairness to the Gaels, they previously provided the likes of Lyng, Johnston & Dunne. I always see it as a pity that more wasn’t made of Paul o’Connor too. Gowna provided Gerald Pierson. Others from there have been unfortunate with injury. Ramor provided countless forwards in the 80s and 90s and their best forward James Brady doesn’t opt to play for Cavan.

It's not going to happen anyway clubs might naturally fall away due to lack of numbers but no clubs are going to decide that there going to pack it in until that happens.

On your last point what do you suggest they should do?

That's good but it's County forwards that we are talking about.

For me the clubs job is to develop the players they have to be the best the can be. For some that will be county level, for others that will be a good club player, for others it might be playing on the junior team with his mates. No one of those groups should be more important than the other. However, it is on the club to make sure modern coaching is being used on all groups that keeps them challenged. I see where Cavan King is coming from and I am sure it can be a factor in not developing players, but is it really the biggest factor? I wouldn't think so. I am with a very small club in Sligo, the first player I pick is almost always the inside forward as for me they are the most important player on the pitch. I know there are people that put their best player in midfield, and then centre back and then Full Back. I tend to put them full forward!! So that option is still there for coaches.

County also have a responsibility but they will only pick up your player based on the work your club have done him to that point. Then it becomes a joint venture to develop the player.

No too young previously.

Whatever about underage, there should be a push to have 1 or 2 Amalgamations in the Senior Championship in the future. Ryan O Neill is playing with Kildallon and they have been struggling the last few years. They scored just 1pt against Arva in the Junior Quarter final last year. The Junior could be played as knockout and then let then prepare for the Senior Championship. There does be a long gap from the end of the league to the start of the championship. They could fit the Junior championship into that slot.

How many have 4 clubs involved?

I heard Corlough would not be allowed to partner up with another Junior team as its an amalgamation and that's not allowed in Junior so thats why that's not happening.

Some clubs have no problem with amaglamation at underage but they won't do it at Senior unless absolutely necessary and definitely not permanently..

Hear hear.

A club also isn't just about local success or player development. Clubs have a huge role in creating and maintaining a sense of community and connection. Getting kids involved in and maintaining their interest in sport is huge, and connecting them with their local club is vital.

There's a lot of things need to be addressed before the county team comes back (new defenders and finding an intercounty midfield duo from somewhere) but surely the easiest one to address is this. Can anyone honestly say we had a plan for the opposition kick outs?

Take Louth for example- they tend not to press but use the time to get into a really solid defensive shape. Or the Rossies, who put on a really impressive zonal press.

I've seen us in every game this year and I honestly don't know if we have a clue on how to press a kick out. Against Mayo it was farcical. It was neither a press or dropping off and it meant that time and time again Mayo were able to get scores off their own kick outs. (I am going to ignore Dublin as they are just too good).

Similary, our movement on our kick outs is woeful. There doesn't seem to be a drill or drills for O Rourke to aim for, other than the one that Ray used himself (get Faulkner on the sideline and ping one to him and hope he catches it). The lazy thing is to say that O Rourke is the issue but he has no Clarke, Smith, Gearoid or Thomas Galligan to aim for and Cluxton would look ordinary if the Dubs just lined up the middle and hoped for the best. That said, O Rourke could do with being a bit quicker at times to get a kick out away. But he did well and I have no doubt he will become a commanding number one for us, it was a good debut season given that he had no time at intercounty level and that the man he replaced is now the manager!!!