Beef AI/Bulls MEGATHREAD

Future Farmer · 30-11-2015 12:30pm

Kovu wrote: »

Strange, it's taken by Maria Kelly who's normally an excellent photographer of livestock and usually gets them looking their best.

Farmers have got used to seeing bulls used to being fed for photos.....

ICBF got the photo taken of him, if you look at their gene ireland catalogue, they don't really care....

That's what I was told....

bogman_bass · 30-11-2015 1:11pm

A bull that's fed for showing wont do the business when it comes to jumping. Any of those show bulls that go into AI normally have to go on a diet for a few months

tismesoitis · 30-11-2015 1:37pm

I have found powerful genetics to promise a lot based on very low reliability figures. Dancer comes to mind he was sold as being suitable for heifers in the beginning now he in or around 9% difficulty. Royalty fees are excessive on top of pricey straws .

Salerchamp · 30-11-2015 2:03pm

tismesoitis wrote: »

I have found powerful genetics to promise a lot based on very low reliability figures. Dancer comes to mind he was sold as being suitable for heifers in the beginning now he in or around 9% difficulty. Royalty fees are excessive on top of pricey straws .

Don't Powerful Genetics have the ownership of straws off that LM bull Sympa? Last I heard his straws were over 150 quid a pop! Is he still being used much or is the price a big deterrent?

ALANC81 · 01-12-2015 10:29am

Sympa is €250 a straw now and only being used for embryo work.

Salerchamp · 01-12-2015 12:47pm

Big money there! Speaking of prices of straws.....

What's the most you've seen going for straws? I remember hearing the CH bull TEXAN-GIE had straws hitting the hundreds of euros mark too, don't know of his straws still being available either

ALANC81 · 01-12-2015 3:00pm

Vantastic straws were going for €1000 - €1200 per straw at one stage. I was at a sale once we're his straws were up for auction and unsold at €900.

bogman_bass · 01-12-2015 3:15pm

and no guarantee of quality not to mention the risk of an inspection!

tanko · 01-12-2015 4:03pm

ALANC81 wrote: »

Vantastic straws were going for €1000 - €1200 per straw at one stage. I was at a sale once we're his straws were up for auction and unsold at €900.

Maybe I'm wrong but I think they were available from Powerful Genetics for €25 a few years ago.

patsy_mccabe · 01-12-2015 5:31pm

ALANC81 wrote: »

Vantastic straws were going for €1000 - €1200 per straw at one stage. I was at a sale once we're his straws were up for auction and unsold at €900.

Vantastic is in the bottom 1% for calving, within the breed. Guys chasing rosettes rather than profit.

ALANC81 · 01-12-2015 6:24pm

tanko wrote: »

Maybe I'm wrong but I think they were available from Powerful Genetics for €25 a few years ago.

When he died the prices of his straws went through the roof. He did breed some of the best cattle I ever saw.

ALANC81 · 01-12-2015 6:28pm

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

Vantastic is in the bottom 1% for calving, within the breed. Guys chasing rosettes rather than profit.

Yes guys chasing rosettes but they were also chasing profits. Vantastic sons brought big money no matter how bad there calving scores were. A lot of his sons went across the water.

ALANC81 · 01-12-2015 6:32pm

Double post.

ALANC81 · 01-12-2015 6:33pm

Fecken triple post.

tanko · 01-12-2015 6:36pm

Anyway Alan, what do you think of Vantastic?:D

ALANC81 · 01-12-2015 6:46pm

I wouldn't use him if I got the straws for free.
Never mind the hard calving you could get around that with good management but his heifers hadn't a drop of milk and no matter how good an animal looks if she can't rare her calf she's no good to me.

tanko · 01-12-2015 7:06pm

ALANC81 wrote: »

I wouldn't use him if I got the straws for free.
Never mind the hard calving you could get around that with good management but his heifers hadn't a drop of milk and no matter how good an animal looks if she can't rare her calf she's no good to me.

True, i used Milbrook Dartagnan one year and kept a few heifers off him. Super looking heifers but they hadn't a drop of milk between them even though they were of milky cows.

Sligo Ai have a bull called Wilodge Enrico (WLZ) which is a son of Sympa and the mother is a full sister of Vantastic. He seems easy calved on cows and has a muscle score of 143.
Anyone ever used him?

ALANC81 · 01-12-2015 7:16pm

We sold an Enrico bull a few weeks ago for €4000 the lad who bought him never even tried to bargen down the price. He was a super bull.
Enrico could be dodgy for milk though, when Sympa died his daughters milk score vanished and we all know about Vantastic.

Some people say Sympa was a great bull for milk but I saw Sympa daughters that could barley rare there calves.

pure breed · 15-12-2015 1:32pm

Hi Lads
Selling this Weanling Heifer privately
Approx 300kg 1st May 2015
what be good price €900 ???

patsy_mccabe · 15-12-2015 2:53pm

I sold an LGL heifer similar to her a few weeks back, 275Kg made €880.

pure breed · 15-12-2015 3:29pm

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

I sold an LGL heifer similar to her a few weeks back, 275Kg made €880.

Sounds about right so Patsy thanks. She is off Stock Bull, Does LGL heifers bring milk?

limo_100 · 15-12-2015 8:43pm

pure breed wrote: »

Sounds about right so Patsy thanks. She is off Stock Bull, Does LGL heifers bring milk?

Id say LGL bulls have more milk than the heifers, but hes a great bull all the same

patsy_mccabe · 15-12-2015 8:48pm

LGL heifer -
I was 50/50 whether I'd keep mine as a replacement as she was out of a Simmental cow. ICBF have her as one star for replacement so that made up my mind. She was lovely and quiet too.

limo_100 · 15-12-2015 8:53pm

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

I was 50/50 whether I'd keep mine as a replacement as she was out of a Simmental cow. ICBF have her as one star for replacement so that made up my mind. She was lovely and quiet too.

I often chanced them heifers from the good maternal side and lot of them work out the finessed. I wouldn't let icbf tell me which heifer to bull, I use it as a guideline only. I bulled heifers the last few weeks that are one stars I think they will work out and if they don't they will go to the mart as a pair.

pure breed · 15-12-2015 10:49pm

limo_100 wrote: »

I often chanced them heifers from the good maternal side and lot of them work out the finessed. I wouldn't let icbf tell me which heifer to bull, I use it as a guideline only. I bulled heifers the last few weeks that are one stars I think they will work out and if they don't they will go to the mart as a pair.

We sold a CH Springer this year that we'd kept from our stock bull just chanced her to see what she come like when she'd be close to calving and not a sign of a udder/milk upto a wk before calving when we sold her for €1640, Honestly don't know why your man bought her except for her golden colour and she was in good nick.

patsy_mccabe · 15-12-2015 10:53pm

I've always found the char cows I've had here to be very lacking in milk. They tend to be big framed too and so not easily kept. Having wettish land doesn't help either.

pure breed · 15-12-2015 11:00pm

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

I've always found the char cows I've had here to be very lacking in milk. They tend to be big framed too and so not easily kept. Having wettish land doesn't help either.

Agree with ya shorter grazing time in our lovely rushy land too, All our CH can be traced back to when we were milking and further we get into that breed the worse for milk. Suppose there is a milky bull out there somewhere?????
SI and LM now are way were going, although hoping AI FSZ might produce a few heifers for replacements next year.

Kovu · 15-12-2015 11:04pm

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

I've always found the char cows I've had here to be very lacking in milk. They tend to be big framed too and so not easily kept. Having wettish land doesn't help either.

Amputate them at the knees

Have to say I'm mightily impressed with my KCE blonde heifer that calved last month. She has a great pot of milk and he's thriving like mad. Had great craic chasing him round the shed to get him into the skulling gate for dehorning the other day :rolleyes: Only have one CH animal here now, a weaning off Alwent Hitman, her mother was a great milker so we'll see how she fares out considering she's only one star.

limo_100 · 15-12-2015 11:32pm

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

I've always found the char cows I've had here to be very lacking in milk. They tend to be big framed too and so not easily kept. Having wettish land doesn't help either.

I know lad they can be the biggest disappointment at times, but for a good charolais can't be bet they breed the best in my opinion. But lm and si are more reliable for the milk. Im just addicted to the charolais I keep trying for them i'd say 1 in 3 work out

RD10 · 11-01-2016 7:18pm

Anyone using progressive genetics? Will be putting few heifers in calf hopefully early to mid march to limousin bull. Anyone have any reccomendations?

tanko · 11-01-2016 7:41pm

RD10 wrote: »

Anyone using progressive genetics? Will be putting few heifers in calf hopefully early to mid march to limousin bull. Anyone have any reccomendations?

I've used HCA a lot on heifers, he's a good easy calved bull but docility of his calves is poor. ZAG might be a better option, don't have any calves off him yet tho and only put him on young cows so far.

RD10 · 11-01-2016 8:59pm

tanko wrote: »

I've used HCA a lot on heifers, he's a good easy calved bull but docility of his calves is poor. ZAG might be a better option, don't have any calves off him yet tho and only put him on young cows so far.

Ya ive used HCA before and found him grand. Have a heifer and a 3rd calver in calf to ZAG this year so dont really know wat he's like yet. I know i had a look at the catalogue before and picked out a few i was thinking of using just dont have it to hand now and was wondering had anyone any experience of other limousin bulls.
I dont remember seeing HCA in this yrs catalogue though. Maybe i skipped over him.
I also have a purebred simmental heifer il be ai'ing in either may or june to a sim bull. Not a great choice in p.g though.

tanko · 11-01-2016 9:27pm

HCA straws were supposed to be getting scarce last year, maybe they're gone now? Lennon Frosty FTY was used a lot on heifers I think, never used him either. Think he might have docility issues, not certain about this tho.

Hopefully the new Sim bull, Curaheen Earp will turn out to be a good bull, don't know if he's suitable for heifers.

bogman_bass · 12-01-2016 12:58am

RD10 wrote: »

Anyone using progressive genetics? Will be putting few heifers in calf hopefully early to mid march to limousin bull. Anyone have any reccomendations?

Ask your AI man if he still has any REQ or FL22 straws left in his pot. The answer will probably be no but woth a shot. " excellent bulls for heifers.

ZAG if probably the pic of the bunch at the moment. At 4.9% I think they would want to be strong heifers. Does it have to be a Limo?

Nettleman · 12-01-2016 8:18am

pure breed wrote: »

We sold a CH Springer this year that we'd kept from our stock bull just chanced her to see what she come like when she'd be close to calving and not a sign of a udder/milk upto a wk before calving when we sold her for €1640, Honestly don't know why your man bought her except for her golden colour and she was in good nick.

Lads are taking calf out of them, then killing heifer for heifer prices and bucket rearing the calf.

TITANIUM. · 12-01-2016 10:46am

Nettleman wrote: »

Lads are taking calf out of them, then killing heifer for heifer prices and bucket rearing the calf.

Yep that calf won't be registered to that heifer anyway. He'll probably end up under some really quite fr cow with 3 other calf's.

RD10 · 12-01-2016 11:40am

bogman_bass wrote: »

Ask your AI man if he still has any REQ or FL22 straws left in his pot. The answer will probably be no but woth a shot. " excellent bulls for heifers.

ZAG if probably the pic of the bunch at the moment. At 4.9% I think they would want to be strong heifers. Does it have to be a Limo?

Ya ZAG was the bull in my head to use. Ive a heifer to calve to him next minth so we'll soon see how his calves are.
Just looking at last yrs catalogue, ZCH was 5* replacement at €246 and 4.7% calving difficulty and now he's at €101 and 7.10% calving difficulty.
I prefer to use the limo's. They usually calf ok with the odd bit of help. As long as their big enough at calving thats the main thing.

bogman_bass · 12-01-2016 12:22pm

RD10 wrote: »

Ya ZAG was the bull in my head to use. Ive a heifer to calve to him next minth so we'll soon see how his calves are.
Just looking at last yrs catalogue, ZCH was 5* replacement at €246 and 4.7% calving difficulty and now he's at €101 and 7.10% calving difficulty.
I prefer to use the limo's. They usually calf ok with the odd bit of help. As long as their big enough at calving thats the main thing.

are you selling as weanlings? The only reason I ask is that I've had good results using GJB but I'm finishing them. Maybe not as fancy as a LM but by God do they grow!

Canaryblue · 12-01-2016 1:22pm

RD10 wrote: »

I also have a purebred simmental heifer il be ai'ing in either may or june to a sim bull. Not a great choice in p.g though.

Personally I think Anatrim Bodybuilder is the nicest bull they have, not sure if I'd use him on a heifer though. Whats her breeding do you mind me asking?

tismesoitis · 12-01-2016 1:23pm

Strongly thinking of using RIO saler on our heifers that will calve at 2 year old. Any thoughts??

Future Farmer · 12-01-2016 1:39pm

RD10 wrote: »

Ya ZAG was the bull in my head to use. Ive a heifer to calve to him next minth so we'll soon see how his calves are.
Just looking at last yrs catalogue, ZCH was 5* replacement at €246 and 4.7% calving difficulty and now he's at €101 and 7.10% calving difficulty.
I prefer to use the limo's. They usually calf ok with the odd bit of help. As long as their big enough at calving thats the main thing.

Replacement Index has been calibrated in that time too...

Kovu · 12-01-2016 1:41pm

tismesoitis wrote: »

Strongly thinking of using RIO saler on our heifers that will calve at 2 year old. Any thoughts??

Tanko is the man to ask there! Think he used him a good bit on heifers.

Nettleman · 12-01-2016 2:15pm

tanko wrote: »

I've used HCA a lot on heifers, he's a good easy calved bull but docility of his calves is poor. ZAG might be a better option, don't have any calves off him yet tho and only put him on young cows so far.

how bad in the temper on hca progeny. I have a few straws in the flash and might use them this year?

patsy_mccabe · 12-01-2016 2:23pm

tismesoitis wrote: »

Strongly thinking of using RIO saler on our heifers that will calve at 2 year old. Any thoughts??

I used him twice. You'd want to be keeping the bulls to sell at 18 months or so as they can be a big leggy early on. As with all Salers, using on the not so quiet cows might not be a good idea.

welton john · 12-01-2016 2:56pm

tismesoitis wrote: »

Strongly thinking of using RIO saler on our heifers that will calve at 2 year old. Any thoughts??

had calves off their other saler bull pzb this year. Two 23/24 month lm x fr heifers calved him very easily.they sold well at a month old with their mothers.had him on 5 dairy cows two. they all spat out the liveliest calves we ever got. awful scrawney looking yokes but they shaped up as good as any lm or aa off similar cows

tanko · 12-01-2016 4:04pm

Nettleman wrote: »

how bad in the temper on hca progeny. I have a few straws in the flash and might use them this year?

I'd say it's worse than average for Lims and I see he has a poor docility figure on ICBF so farmers must be giving his calves poor scores for it. Id put him on quiet heifers/cows if i could. I see from my ICBF profiles that all the weanlings I've sold off him killed out as R+ or U grades, even a couple of U+ Bulls off him at good weights.
I've no calves off RIO yet, will have four by the end of March off OZS heifers hopefully.

patsy_mccabe · 12-01-2016 6:43pm

Anyone have weanlings from Fiston (fsz) ? Seeing that he is so easy calving, would be interesting to see a few of the older offspring.

Limestone Cowboy · 12-01-2016 6:49pm

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

Anyone have weanlings from Fiston (fsz) ? Seeing that he is so easy calving, would be interesting to see a few of the older offspring.

Have one here. Not overly impressed with him but the cow hadn't much milk. Have a few ai'd to him calving in feburary too.

bogman_bass · 12-01-2016 6:58pm

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

Anyone have weanlings from Fiston (fsz) ? Seeing that he is so easy calving, would be interesting to see a few of the older offspring.

Have a 3 month old calf by him. nice shape but not huge

sonnybill · 12-01-2016 7:53pm

patsy_mccabe wrote: »

Anyone have weanlings from Fiston (fsz) ? Seeing that he is so easy calving, would be interesting to see a few of the older offspring.

Add your reply here.

He is a super bull .. I got e1125 for a 6.5 month white bull out of him . A smasher he was . Loads of Fiston and Gurka this year

Beef AI/Bulls MEGATHREAD

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