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Emmanuel Macron dissolves French parliament and calls snap elections

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  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 26,991 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    The last President to get significantly more than Macron in the first round of voting was Mitterand in 1988. Hollande got slightly more. His first round numbers were not disappointing, they were pretty decent.

    He increased his share in the first round in his second term is what I said.

    Has any French President ever not had protests in the street?



  • Registered Users Posts: 500 ✭✭✭Marcos


    When most of us say "social justice" we mean equality under the law opposition to prejudice, discrimination and equal opportunities for all. When Social Justice Activists say "social justice" they mean an emphasis on group identity over the rights of the individual, a rejection of social liberalism, and the assumption that unequal outcomes are always evidence of structural inequalities.

    Andrew Doyle, The New Puritans.



  • Registered Users Posts: 54,391 ✭✭✭✭Headshot


    When it comes to France if there's no protests, then you should be worried lol



  • Registered Users Posts: 862 ✭✭✭lumphammer2


    I remember a time when Jean Marie Le Pen was considered a total joke … a relic of the Nazi era and more in tune with Vichy France than modern France …. Marine Le Pen has channelled her father's rhetoric and toned down some of it …. but if I was French I would not vote for her or trust her … surely there are other people to vote for if one was not to vote for Macron ….

    Putin's Russia has moved very much to the far right in recent years too … Putin himself yes … but more notable in others …. and in Medvedev in particular ….. the current Russian regime can do business with far right regimes in Europe …. and will support them …. this is a more likely situation than the much touted verge of WW3 …. there are more than 1 way to take over your enemies !! ….

    But while Putin/Medvedev/Russia can desire and support far right …. it is also true that not everything can be blamed on Russia …. electorates misguided want them or think they do …. far right populists are well able to market themselves and make promises they cannot keep …. and voter apathy has allowed far right regimes into power all over Europe, as well as the US and Iran …. because while others do not vote the far right voters will very much vote !! ….

    It is possible … very likely … we could see far right politicians like Le Pen, Jalili and Trump do very well in upcoming elections and become presidents/prime ministers of their countries …. less likely is a Farage win in the UK but who knows? Anything is now possible !! …

    Georgia Meloni has moderated her stance for now …. and Wilders too …. but I cannot help but feel they will be emboldened if more of them come into prominence and then they will begin their real agenda …. the only good thing is they become unpopular the more they gain power and the people turn against them ….

    By right though the US people should by now be 100% against Trump …. sadly the whole system over there cannot move past this candidate despite how mad and bad he is …. I only hope that common sense prevails ….



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,161 ✭✭✭zerosquared


    You might find that most Europeans in wide band of countries from Norway to Turkey very much do care about living as slaves in yet another Russian occupation

    As for the French they just celebrated 80th anniversary of a bunch of other countries coming to their rescue and liberating them from Nazis 1.0, you might be surprised how many of them are watching with disgust what Nazis 2.0 are doing now out east



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  • Registered Users Posts: 1,770 ✭✭✭ArthurDayne


    The point you raise here is good one — i.e. the right wingers like Le Pen and Meloni softening over time in contrast to Putin who has consolidated hard power.

    The reason for that is that the closer you get to power in a liberal representative democracy the more you are forced to soften. That's because running a democratic country invariably means navigating competing interests and trying to find the right balance. That almost always means that your policies have to be churned through a machine which produces a very diluted version of what you might have sought.

    That exists in autocratic systems too, but there's more scope to browbeat and force your wishes upon others — to crush competing interests where you can rather than appease them. In the democratic world, it can make politicians look useless, foolish, deceitful and ineffective — giving room for populists to mock them when it's often the case that the effectiveness of mainstream politics is the victim of the necessary drawbacks of democracy and the Western model of individual rights.

    This is why modern populism, of the Trump / Brexit kind etc, has demonstrated that it is at its most potent outside of power — where you can make dramatic promises for radical change. Le Pen has softened because she has gotten closer to power, and if you talk Frexit you have to be seen to walk Frexit, so she has softened on that, and on other things — and likely will have to soften further if and when she gets power



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,246 ✭✭✭Jack Daw


    Hasn't the Polish economy grown massively in the last decade or so.Hardly a sign they've ruined the country.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,023 ✭✭✭JoChervil


    I have no idea, where are you taking this information from. Maybe from Polish propaganda TV.

    Where do you see this massive growth?

    But you can't imagine how much money they borrowed outside budget, which grand-grand children will pay for…

    Also how much public money they used for their private campaigns, increasing salaries, generally stealing them.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,197 ✭✭✭Mr. teddywinkles


    Going by that argument. The same can be said of this place.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,246 ✭✭✭Jack Daw


    I got the information from the world bank.

    GDP Per capita in 2015 dollars in Poland in 2014 was $12,024

    In 2022 that figure had grown to $17,117

    Pretty impressive growth in such a short period of time, a 42% rise.

    https://data.worldbank.org/indicator/NY.GDP.PCAP.KD?end=2022&locations=PL&start=1990&view=chart

    Figures for Czechia go from $16,951 in 2014 to $20,237 in 2022 (19% rise)

    Figures of Slovakia go from $15,600 in 2014 to $18,878 in 2022 (21% rise)

    So they've massively outperformed two of their neighbouring countries in that period



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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,023 ✭✭✭JoChervil


    GDP Per capita in Poland in 2006 was $9.084, so 32% to 2014.

    But at what cost? Check how much debt they created in that time per capita….



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,246 ✭✭✭Jack Daw


    Poland's External Debt per capita is $9,500

    Less than Ireland at $63,000

    And less than Czechia at €19282 and Slovakia at €15,900

    Polands Government Debt per capita is $14,829

    Less than Ireland at $47,822

    And Less than Slovakia at $16,798 , but more than Czechia which is at $12,208

    Again looks like Poland is doing very well.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,023 ✭✭✭JoChervil




  • Registered Users Posts: 23,742 ✭✭✭✭Kermit.de.frog




  • Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 11,515 Mod ✭✭✭✭igCorcaigh


    When will we know the results? Do they have electronic voting?



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,059 ✭✭✭gym_imposter




  • Registered Users Posts: 422 ✭✭sliabh 1956


    Next weekend will be the the real test when the run offs take will the left leaning groups come together and vote on bloc to thwart Le Penns National Rally



  • Registered Users Posts: 54,391 ✭✭✭✭Headshot


    Is there any good in-dept write up on why the French have drifted to the Far Right? Just be interesting to know has something like Immigration pushed people over the edge?



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,976 ✭✭✭.Donegal.


    5% ahead of the left alliance, 34% of the vote.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 26,991 Mod ✭✭✭✭Podge_irl


    I have zero expertise, but I think it's partly just that it's "their turn" in terms of various different opposition groupings fighting against the "mainstream" have had their turn and people are still dissatisfied. Ensemble/En Marche were themselves essentially a protest movement that came from nowhere. I suspect RN will ultimately go the same way if and when they get into power.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 26,511 ✭✭✭✭Peregrinus


    France has limited use of electronic voting — only citizens resident abroad vote electronically, and then only in voting for the National Assembly. In presidential and EU elections they vote on paper.

    It's absolutely not true that "almost every country" has electronic voting. Countries that don't have electronic voting include Canada, Australia, the UK, Germany, Norway, Sweden, Denmark, Finland, Spain, Italy, the Netherlands, Austria, Poland and Japan. Some of these countries used to have some degree of electronic voting but have abandoned it (e.g. Germany, the Netherlands) or trialled it and rejected it (Finland,, Italy and, of course, Ireland). Some other countries have very limited electronic voting, e.g. for expatriate voters only — France (already mentioned) and Switzerland.

    I think only three EU countries use electronic voting for national parliamentary elections - Belgium, Bulgaria and Estonia.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,589 ✭✭✭20silkcut


    France is a country that still has a low key 18th century attitude to colonialism. The Russians have threatened and damaged their colonial empire in Africa. Macron talking tough on Ukraine was little to do with concern for Ukraine and more about him tapping into his inner Napoleon.



  • Registered Users Posts: 18,430 ✭✭✭✭silverharp


    if the US is anything to go by, paper ballots and counting arent a disadvantage and create more certainty , a discussion along American lines would make no sense in Ireland

    A belief in gender identity involves a level of faith as there is nothing tangible to prove its existence which, as something divorced from the physical body, is similar to the idea of a soul. - Colette Colfer



  • Registered Users Posts: 18,430 ✭✭✭✭silverharp


    if its true that France exploit their trading relationship with some African countries, they deserve everything coming their way

    A belief in gender identity involves a level of faith as there is nothing tangible to prove its existence which, as something divorced from the physical body, is similar to the idea of a soul. - Colette Colfer



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,327 ✭✭✭Potatoeman


    The last election was close:

    Le Penn is not far right, she moved the party towards the middle. The party is very against migration from Islamic countries which is not surprising giving the problems they have with Islamic terror attacks.



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,618 ✭✭✭volchitsa


    This is complete nonsense. where is the evidence that Macron has ever had any designs on invading eastern Europe, never mind that he would start with Ukraine of all places?

    As for their "colonial empire" in Africa, what you mean is that Russia sent in Wagner troops to exploit African resources. In SOME of those cases France had - at the request of the governments concerned - previously sent in some units of the French army to shore up the existing government from mostly islamist threats, but to protray that as France's "empire" is ridiculous.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,683 ✭✭✭brickster69


    It does not matter really. Macron has created a gigantic mess calling this election. His party is finished and he basically has to support one of the two groups he detests and both equally detest him likewise.But he wont support Le Penn, so if they win it would a coalition of everything from communists to Macron and everything in between.

    “The earth is littered with the ruins of empires that believed they were eternal.”

    - Camille Paglia



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,248 ✭✭✭combat14


    he certainly has created a mess technically he didnt have to call an election till 2027

    now le pen's party have gone from about 4 million votes 2 years ago to

    7 million votes at EU elections 3 weeks ago to

    10 million votes in the latest election

    its clear the french voters want change and have enough of macron's party



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,683 ✭✭✭brickster69


    Yes and he will become more detested than he is now. Can you imagine a coallition of all those different views, total chaos guaranteed or Le Penn, that is it. France is split down the middle either way. Bravo !

    “The earth is littered with the ruins of empires that believed they were eternal.”

    - Camille Paglia



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  • Registered Users Posts: 40,229 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    Macron again proving he a a gigantic dope.

    His sense of himself is off the scales.



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