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Random Renewables Thread

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  • Registered Users Posts: 20,050 ✭✭✭✭cnocbui


    Will you ever stop peddling this Irish low temperature advantage making Ireland one of the best countries for PV nonsense? The very slight improvement in PV output due to low temperatures in Ireland doesn't make solar energy in Ireland economic or sensible as it does not remotely compensate for the overall apalling lack of direct sunlight.

    PV capacity factor in Ireland is 11%, a solar farm in WA had a capacity factor of 30% in 2022. Those panels would absolutely bake in summer, You could probably boil water on them some days. Their efficiency might be terrible at such times, but it doesn't matter, because the vastly greater amount of direct sunlight more than compensates.



  • Registered Users Posts: 65,382 ✭✭✭✭unkel
    Chauffe, Marcel, chauffe!


    Just correcting the poster, pal. They posted something that was factually incorrect.

    I have no illusions PV in Ireland is better than in the likes of Spain or your native Australia. I have never said it was, do not put words into my mouth. Your figure of a load factor of around 11% is spot on (considerably worse in the western half of the country). Compare that to offshore wind on the west coast which is 50%, about the highest in the world. We should concentrate on wind as it is far cheaper per kWh than solar PV in Ireland at massive scale.



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,372 ✭✭✭✭the_amazing_raisin


    EV sales are still growing worldwide, the rates of growth had slowed and in some countries it has dropped (e.g. Germany) often due to a reduction in grants

    "The internet never fails to misremember" - Sebastian Ruiz, aka Frost



  • Registered Users Posts: 20,050 ✭✭✭✭cnocbui


    I gave the numbers and workings in another post. I'll try and hunt it down and link if you would like.

    The 11% capacity factor is calculated from the actual anergy generated in a year vs the theoretical amount that could be generated based on a PV capacity rating.

    Where nuclear knocks it out of the park is in it's high capacity factor. I was assuming the OL-3 reactor would likely manage 93% in this regard. The Korean nuclear energy sector manages a stunning 96.4% capacity factor.

    What makes the OL-3 reactor comparrison so astonishing is that it wasn't cheap and I would never advocate building one of that design due to the long construction time and high cost. Despite this it's still cheaper than Irish solar.

    The S korean company KHNP has so far recently built 6 1.4 GW nuclear reactors of it's APR-1400 design. They are on an absolute roll and this is the reactor type Ireland or any other country should consider. They consistently built each in 8 years from ground breaking to commissioning and the cost was far lower than OL-3. KHNP recently commissioned one in SK - Shin Hanul 1 and the cost was €2.97 billion per GW. They recently offered to build 6 for Poland at the same price - end of last year - so I'd call that price current. Poland is only taking them up on 2 so the price might end up increasing slightly.

    I don't know the decommissioning cost situation, but that's something for people to worry about in 60 years time.



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,372 ✭✭✭✭the_amazing_raisin


    Seems last year's consumption for me was 7.4MWh, although that's from end of February onwards so likely closer to 10MWh

    Based on that I'm 30% more efficient than the EAB usage even with transportation added on top 😁

    "The internet never fails to misremember" - Sebastian Ruiz, aka Frost



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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,434 ✭✭✭orangerhyme


    It's just a minor blip anyway.

    EVs are predicted to reach price parity with ICEs in 2026/2027 without grants.

    Price parity for total cost of ownership has already happened.

    It's game over for ICEs. They'll be more expensive to buy and run in a couple of years.

    The next gen of affordable EVs are just arriving on the market now.



  • Registered Users Posts: 4,947 ✭✭✭paulbok


    It's Norway going for 100% renewables by 2030, already in the high 90's.

    They're using their massive sovereign wealth fund (ironically generated from sales of fossil fuels) to develop further hydro and wind projects to go far beyond their own needs, and are aiming to be a leading seller of renewable electricity instead of oil / gas.their geography lends itself massively to both sources of renewables as well as a bit of geothermal.

    Long but good video on it.

    1/3 of cars are already electric and 80% of car sales on 2022 were EV's.

    2/3 of houses use heat pumps already.

    It must be added that their government have (as they can easily afford it) huge incentives for domestic EV and heat pump adoption.



  • Registered Users Posts: 65,382 ✭✭✭✭unkel
    Chauffe, Marcel, chauffe!


    We should have started to do the same many years ago, but with wind. It is relatively very cheap to install wind, apart from the interconnectors needed to sell it, but still hugely profitable at scale because Ireland has the highest load factor in the world at 50%.

    Unfortunately much of our target market, like Germany, have very rapidly increased their own renewables in the last few years, so have less need to buy it elsewhere

    Remember Micheal Martin stating "Wind is Ireland's oil" a few years ago? He was dead right and visionary enough plus open about it, which is rare for a prominent politician. But alas nothing came off it…



  • Registered Users Posts: 20,050 ✭✭✭✭cnocbui


    In the past, in other threads, you have made the claim that Ireland is one of the best countries in Europe for solar on account of the higher efficiency of PV panels at lower temperatures.

    You should take this 50% capacity factor off the west coast with a pinch of salt, and the cost even more so. The recently commissioned East Anglia one off scotland manages 46.8%. The highest capacity factor wind farms, exceeding 50% CF are the 2 commercial floaters. I think these would be best for comparrison when considering wind off the west coast, Hywind Scotland managing 52.6%, for example.

    All the turbines of the Hywind Scotland floater were shredded after just 7 years of operation, with all of them having to be towed back to Norway. At the Kincardine floater, one of the turbines was destroyed after just 2 years of operation, having to then be towed back to the Netherlands.

    In other words, the current generation of wind turbines can not hack the severe conditions off the west coast.

    Even fixed base offshore wind is a costly joke. East Anglia one cost €4.07 billion per GW - €5.21 billion if you add the massive 28% O&M costs. This is simply not cost competitive with S Korean nuclear costing €2.97 billion per GW, that has double the capacity factor and lasts twice as long as an OSW farm - 60 years vs 30. And lets not forget that this is before even considering the cost of needing around 2.? times as much OSW capacity plus batteries or hydrogen electrolysers storage and generation plant, to match an equivalent capacity for nuclear.

    There is no government costing for supplying the countries entire energy needs just using OSW or solar plus storage. You can get a fairly good ball-park idea of the cost using nuclear, but the entire renewables plan we are attempting is completely uncosted because it's unknowable.



  • Registered Users Posts: 20,050 ✭✭✭✭cnocbui


    Martin was an absolute spoofer with that oil comment. An Irish fantasy of epic proportions. We have been importing energy at scale, so far this year, because it's cheaper and allows the CO2 numbers to be fudged.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 65,382 ✭✭✭✭unkel
    Chauffe, Marcel, chauffe!


    "In the past, in other threads, you have made the claim that Ireland is
    one of the best countries in Europe for solar on account of the higher
    efficiency of PV panels at lower temperatures."

    False. I have never said that.



  • Registered Users Posts: 889 ✭✭✭Busman Paddy Lasty


    Everyone has their own agenda though. Unkel is obviously pro renewables but never made the claim being accused of.

    @cnocbui you are clearly pro nuclear. It's a bit rich calling out renewables zealots when you are too a zealot, but for another cause. You repeatedly reference France and ignore all the times when it is raised that France can go that high % nuclear because they have 1 continental Europe as spinning reserve. 2. Continental Europe as an overproduction export pathway. 3. Continental Europe interconnection for stabilisation.

    France has cheap electricity per kWh now because the exchequer and possibly the military also funded it decades ago. Her military Generals in the 70s would have seen first hand Hitler ruling the roots in Paris only 30 years prior. That's a whole different context and set of motives than an Atlantic island reducing it's CO2 intensity for climate change.

    I'm pragmatic pro nuclear myself but that seems to get lost in the nuclear threads.



  • Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 91,566 Mod ✭✭✭✭Capt'n Midnight


    We import from the UK. Cyan is Wind, Yellow is solar.

    Like us the UK must keep dispersed high inertial synchronous generators on load at all times for voltage control and grid stability. The UK imports from France and Norway. In both cases hydro's TWh alone has covered their exports for at least the last ten years.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,332 ✭✭✭SD_DRACULA


    Chinese Xmas is here 🤣



  • Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators Posts: 6,087 Mod ✭✭✭✭graememk


    Mine came last week, but I'm away for the week 😂

    Still haven't ordered cells either 😂



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,719 ✭✭✭deezell


    How does that Chinese original compare price wise to this German clone? The German copy is €4452. 🙂



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,332 ✭✭✭SD_DRACULA


    Divide by 10, since it's just the box and add those sweet nkon cells. So almost 3 times cheaper including the cells.

    Looks to be same box except mine has the breaker instead of the switch and the DE one maybe doesn't have the inverter jkbms? The screen looks different

    Only thing I would prefer is flexible bus bars instead of cables in between the bms and front plate and main +/- but at least it is 50mm2 which plenty as I plan to limit all 3 boxes to 100a each anyway



  • Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators Posts: 6,087 Mod ✭✭✭✭graememk


    35mm2 can handle 200 odd amps so 50mm² has plenty of head room.

    Mine was €436 DDP with jk BMS and screen.

    Under 1200 delivered for 315ah cells on Nkon.



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,372 ✭✭✭✭the_amazing_raisin


    Where'd you get it, and what cells does it fit? Looks similar to the Gobel power kit

    "The internet never fails to misremember" - Sebastian Ruiz, aka Frost



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,332 ✭✭✭SD_DRACULA




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  • Registered Users Posts: 6,719 ✭✭✭deezell


    Did you get the cells from Ali also? Great video tutorial on their ad, and Respect, a great leap of faith to knock all that together and trust it to all work without a glitch or a big bang.

    Does the configuration give a choice of inverter brands to communicate with?, the German look alike comes configured for the Victron brand it says, (whatever they're like), and other brands are 'available'. Is this similarly set up, or is it manually matched when installing.

    I'm also curious about the " Men seed Storage" that's in that link. The mind boggles...



  • Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators Posts: 6,087 Mod ✭✭✭✭graememk


    Nkon for cells.

    It's the JK inverter BMS, so it just works with the inverters that are on the market (they all share the same protocol) maybe some slight variation in some of the settings but having worked with the communication code myself, inverters don't need much.

    Mainly

    SoC, max charge voltage, max charge amps, min voltage, alarms(so it can stop gracefully, without the BMS having to pull the power), some inverters want a name ..



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,332 ✭✭✭SD_DRACULA


    What you don't have a seed box with a BMS and tomato seeds? 🤣

    And yeah it is the jk inverter BMS and you can also specify whatever config you want to buy 100a, 150a, 200a

    It's the one Andy from the offgrid garage keeps testing for us and should work with most inverters.



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,372 ✭✭✭✭the_amazing_raisin


    That was confusing me as well, I decided not to dwell on the possibilities 😂

    "The internet never fails to misremember" - Sebastian Ruiz, aka Frost



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,372 ✭✭✭✭the_amazing_raisin


    Looking for some advice on discharging the battery to the grid

    I've noticed with the good weather the battery is sitting at a high SoC some evenings

    I've a rule to charge it to 40% on the night rate so there's something there for cloudy days. I'm thinking I'll raise it to 80%

    I'm thinking of setting a rule on my inverter to discharge down to 50% from 9pm onwards since my consumption is pretty low after that

    Anyone got any thoughts on this idea?

    "The internet never fails to misremember" - Sebastian Ruiz, aka Frost



  • Registered Users Posts: 120 ✭✭mjatkey


    Hi, I asked similar question the other week and was told by the guys on here to work that battery hard, ie charge it right up on EV rate then come what ever time (in our case 10.30pm) discharge it all back to the grid right down to a safe soc for whatever battery you have. So we are dumping between 5-8Kw at 24cent per Kw FIT on top of what ever PV excess has been exported during day light hours, then charging batteries back to 100% at 7.5cent per Kw.

    🌞 6.96kWp PV System. West Dublin🌞



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,372 ✭✭✭✭the_amazing_raisin


    My rate is a bit closer with Flogas, I'm importing for 13c and exporting for 20c

    I'm probably close to the point where losses will erode any profits I'm making per kWh

    Having said that, maybe I'll give it a go and see what happens

    "The internet never fails to misremember" - Sebastian Ruiz, aka Frost



  • Registered Users Posts: 65,382 ✭✭✭✭unkel
    Chauffe, Marcel, chauffe!


    Depends on your rates really. For me I'm with Pinergy with their 5c night rate. It is very profitable for me to maximise buying every night, 3 hours at 15kW draw, always. Most of it and most of my PV production gets dumped into the grid and they pay me 25c



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,372 ✭✭✭✭the_amazing_raisin


    Yeah with a 20c profit margin it definitely makes sense, with 7c it's a bit more shaky

    Mostly I don't want the battery sitting for days at 100% when we're away for a weekend

    I know I'll be adding cycles by discharging to the grid, but I'm of the opinion that sitting at high SoC for days is as bad if not worse for battery health

    "The internet never fails to misremember" - Sebastian Ruiz, aka Frost



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  • Registered Users Posts: 65,382 ✭✭✭✭unkel
    Chauffe, Marcel, chauffe!


    There really is no reason to worry about batteries. The only rule is to make them work as much as possible to your advantage.



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