Enoch Burke turns up to school again despite sacking - read OP before posting

Apologies, bumping because the thread is sticking without showing the last page again.

So annoying when it does that.

The kids and staff at the school were destressed.

 It shall be an offence for a person, without reasonable excuse, to trespass on any building or the curtilage thereof in such a manner as causes or is likely to cause fear in another person.

It's criminal trespass 101.

Arrest him and prosecute him when he arrives back in September.

It immediately takes it away from the school who are spending an absolute fortune in civil court dealing with the bollíx, not to mention the stress.

It is exactly what Burke wants, because he knows there is unease in our justice system over our archaic contempt laws.

Did you read the story you linked? There was an aggravating circumstance: “However, Mr McElwee received a summons accusing him of trespassing “in such a manner as caused or was likely to cause fear in another person”.

Have the staff or pupils made a complaint to Gardai that they are in fear? If they have the DPP quite rightly have to assess whether to prosecute.

Trespass is not usually criminal unless there is some element of force or other aggravating circumstance. It is a civil matter, that is why WHS got an injunction against him, it it is for breaking that injunction that he has received the severest of penalties, imprisonment. He hasn’t received lenient treatment, he has spent the best part of two years locked up, lest we forget, people who do commit more serious, criminal offences have been known to spend no time in prison.

If Burke had been working in a state school and not a private school how would this have differed i wonder? Would a state school be able to afford the various legal challenges? Or would the state cover them?

it is a state school.

has been for years.

Boarders pay boarding fees, not tuition

non boarders don’t pay fees

But surely the money from the boarders helps?

They're doing the right thing, seems like all the onus is put on them to move the law forward too which seems unfair on the school..

In Ireland, State school = ETB school.

All other schools are private.

People say private meaning fee paying. But you are correct.

You would think if he was allowed stand at the gates indefinitely that eventually someone would crack and have a pop off him. Nobody wants the school their child attends having this publicity or have a strange man hanging around outside.

Just blare a Right Said Fred/Village People playlist from a pair of speakers near the gate. Enoch flight response would trigger and he would have to flee the gay or burst into flame and be sucked into hell.

What are the chances of the school collecting the costs they were awarded? Not at all good, would be my impression.

the contempt of court ruling was easier to obtain

That is complete nonsense, the school has been put through the absolute ringer in terms of cost and time dealing with this cretin and will still be dealing with him for some time to come.

How do you think this ends? Or do you think the civil route is working?

The only route that will work is if his criminality is treated as criminal, the same as everyone else in this country.

If Burke had been prosecuted for trespass in a manner likely to cause fear, and if he had been conficted (which is by no means certain), the maximum sentence he could have been given would be 12 months plus a fine of €1,270. And, as a first offender, he would not have received the maximum sentence, or anything close to it.

As it is, he has been subject to much longer imprisonment and much heavier fines. Contempt of court is a much more serious matter than criminal trespass.

I'm puzzled as to why you think that giving him a shorter term of imprisonment, and a lower fine, than in fact he received would have been a more effective way of dealing with the problem he presented.

You seem to be struggling with this.

On the one hand, the DPP have said the circumstances do not exist for them to succeed in a prosecution, using your logic, a criminal case should proceed where there is a poor chance of success. End result? Probable acquittal, Enoch feels vindicated and emboldened, and he goes back to WHS confident in the knowledge the Courts have said he is doing nothing criminally wrong.

Is that what you are saying should happen?

On the other, yes WHS went through the wringer, but a positive civil result in getting Burke away from their property is better than a failed criminal prosecution which means he can stand where he likes without fear of prosecution.

You can make something that isn’t criminal, criminal just because it annoys you. The DPP decides what cases go forward, they have deemed this not sufficiently provable to succeed.

How do I think this ends?, God knows, I suspect Burke’s resolve will be stronger than WHS given that they fought the University in Galway for 7 years, and I doubt even the Judges don’t know what to do if this persists . But as long as he stays on the right side of criminal law, you, or your ilk spitting the dummy isn’t going to change anything.

If that was an all boys schools someone would have climbed the wall and pissed down on his head after about the third day. That’d move him on!