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I drive 40,000 km/year: Is an EV a bad idea

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  • 03-07-2024 8:44pm
    #1
    Registered Users Posts: 497 ✭✭


    I drive ~40,000 km/year. I have always bought used diesel cars up to now.

    I am considering buying a new Kia EV6 ~€48,500.

    When looking at second hand EVs, i see very few with high mileage.

    As an example, on the whole of carzone.ie, there are 4335 EVs. If i put in a filter for at least 80,000 Kms, that goes down to 267. So only 6% of second hand EV cars for sale have mileage >80,000 Km.

    This gives me the feeling that most EV drivers, tend to have relatively low mileage.

    If i bought a new car tomorrow, i could expect to have 80,000km done in 2 years.

    I have some questions and would appreciate your expertise:

    1. Is high mileage much more devaluing of a used EV than of an ICE car?
    2. In terms of loss of value (i.e., difference in price i buy, Vs what i can sell for in 2 years time), would i be better to buy a new car or a 2-year old EV?
    3. Will a 2-year old EV6 with 80,000 Km have a big loss from base price when it comes to trade in?

    Thanks. Obviously i know that none of you has a crystal ball and this is still a relatively new area.



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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 7,531 ✭✭✭Gusser09


    Stick to a decent diesel for the moment. EVs are a cod.



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,509 ✭✭✭✭the_amazing_raisin


    Most EVs come with a battery warranty that is limited to age and mileage

    8 years and 160,000km seems to be fairly common, once one of those is passed then your battery is out of warranty

    Is this a problem? Not necessarily, it isn't like the battery will be immediately toasty after the limit. However it will likely hurt resale value with half the warranty used up

    I think a lot of EV owners are lower mileage drivers, but it's also worth bearing in mind that EVs that could realistically do 40,000km per year have only been generally available for less than 5 years

    Personally I'd take a look at a 1-2 year old one, or even a pre reg model as opposed to buying new. There's some excellent bargains available at the moment which will make the potential depreciation less risky IMO

    I'm going to assume you can get a home charger and you've looked at chargers along your commute?

    Sounds like you drive around 200km per day which should be fine for an EV6, but never hurts to have a backup

    "The internet never fails to misremember" - Sebastian Ruiz, aka Frost



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,351 ✭✭✭joe1303l


    Yes, absolutely go EV. Significant fuel savings if you can charge at home on night rate. With such annual mileage thought, I wouldn’t recommend buying any new car, depreciation will be massive. Something like a €25K big battery ID.4 with low mileage from 2021 should do the same job as a €48K EV6.



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,783 ✭✭✭CMOTDibbler


    If you're afraid of depreciation, then buy an ex-demo. It will have small mileage and have the biggest chunk of depreciation taken off it. Average 20% in the first year. And I've seen up to 25%.



  • Registered Users Posts: 13,513 ✭✭✭✭fits


    yeah I agree with above. Buy a 1-2 year old car with low mileage so then your mileage won’t look as bad when you trade.

    I put 80k km up on an ID.3 in under three years. Saved a lot on fuel. Well Over €6k I’d say.



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  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 39,434 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo


    155km every working day (Mon-Fri) will be a doddle for any modern EV. Charge back up over night and off you go again tomorrow.

    If you’re worried about depreciation while doing 40k a year then a new car is not for you.



  • Registered Users Posts: 424 ✭✭Cuauhtemoc


    I do 30k a year and just traded in my diesel to get a 3 year old iD3. Suits me very well. Fuel/ Electric is a fraction of what I used to pay. But then the majority of my driving is on 80k roads which is ideal. Would rarely need to use public charging.

    The previous owner tho did similar Kms and visited the 4 corners of Ireland. Known as the previous destinations were still in the Sat Nav when I bought.



  • Registered Users Posts: 403 ✭✭Roger the cabin boy


    It's the ideal solution.



  • Registered Users Posts: 28,200 ✭✭✭✭drunkmonkey


    Are you going to be paying BIK?

    I'm on targert to do around 50k this year in a eqe, if the complete arse falls out of the value i'll buy it off the business and keep it. The battery warranty is 250,000km or 10yrs. It'll still have a fair bit of that warranty left with I decide to move it on. Seriously comfortable if you're clocking up big mileage.



  • Registered Users Posts: 497 ✭✭CarPark2


    What would you consider to be low mileage in the context of an EV?



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  • Registered Users Posts: 422 ✭✭teediddlyeye


    If you can charge at home go for it.

    Serous value in 2ish year old cars at the min.

    I've 96k km up in 2.5 years in a nissan leaf! No real noticeable loss in range, still full bars on the dash.

    Roughly 11k euro saved in fuel.

    "I never thought I was normal, never tried to be normal."- Charlie Manson



  • Registered Users Posts: 497 ✭✭CarPark2


    Everybody saying that there is great value in 2 year old cars.

    For EV6, if i look at 2022 or newer, and no more than 35,000 km, there is no car less than €38,400.

    The brand new one can be had for €48,500.

    Is a €10K saving for a 2 year old car with 26,000 Km good value? I would have expected a bigger price drop for 2 years old.



  • Registered Users Posts: 2,351 ✭✭✭joe1303l


    No value to be had in a used EV6, not enough of them available hence my suggestion to consider an ID.4.

    Post edited by joe1303l on


  • Registered Users Posts: 3,679 ✭✭✭...Ghost...


    I do a little more than half your mileage per year, but would have no problem whatsoever doing 40k per year, or double that. My SIL drives an i4 2 years now with well over 100k on the odo, probably around 150k+…I lost track. The more you drive the EV, the more you save on costs relative to an ICE vehicle as long as you are charging from home.

    To give my opinion on your questions, as a full BEV driver since 2017:

    1. I would say no. If you can show a healthy battery and a well minded car when selling, the depreciation should be like for like as long as you don't cherry pick. Both sides can play at that game.
    2. Used is typically your best value proposition. An exception seems to be Tesla though, with the cost of buying new being not that much more than used for a 2 year old.
    3. The same principles will apply for ICE and EV. Generally speaking, the big hit is from new to 3 years. After that, the slope isn't as steep. The one thing to watch is warranty and if mileage has extinguished it. If you buy a car privately with warranty, you can save a packet, as there is no benefit to buying from a dealer IMO unless trading in is what you need.

    Stay Free



  • Registered Users Posts: 11,509 ✭✭✭✭the_amazing_raisin


    It's possible the EV6 is holding value a bit better because there aren't as many of them around

    I suspect that dealership is also dreaming at that price, you could likely knock a few thousand off with negotiation

    "The internet never fails to misremember" - Sebastian Ruiz, aka Frost



  • Registered Users Posts: 497 ✭✭CarPark2


    I think that Kia are bringing out a new model and they have cut the price of the current EV6 to get rid of the stock. So possibly more that the new one is at a low price than the used ones are expensive.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,991 ✭✭✭kirving


    I've said before that I think people are nuts buying a new car on anything but PCP - at least you're somewhat protected from unknown depreciation.

    At 40,000km per year though, you'd be killed on any PCP milage rates, and tbh I think you'd be nuts to buy a new car at all.

    Buy a 1-2-3 year old EV, with lowish milage. It'll have suffered a lot of depreciation already, and you can sell it in 2 years with average milage.



  • Registered Users Posts: 497 ✭✭CarPark2


    Looking at Ioniq, this is the best value in reasonable mileage, 2022 at €34,945.:

    https://www.carzone.ie/used-cars/hyundai/ioniq-5/fpa/3614970?journey=Search

    But at the time, these were sold for €44,995 new. So again, it is a 2 year old car, that is €10,000 cheaper than when it was new. The new specs of the Ioniq are more expensive.



  • Registered Users Posts: 10 boardjames


    With your high annual mileage, an EV could become costly down the road, depending on battery degradation. I'd suggest considering a hybrid instead of a fully electric vehicle. Something like the Kia Niro might suit your needs well.

    The hybrid system gives you an excellent electric-only range around town, with the gas engine extending your range for longer trips, so you're not worrying as much about charge availability. There is also less depreciation risk than a full EV.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 19,037 Mod ✭✭✭✭slave1


    Some deplorable suggestions from the anti EV crowd, if you want to drag a hybrid battery that's dead for that level of milage you'd be mad.

    My wife has done that mileage in a 2019 Hyundai Kona (may not suit you but the comment is moreso EV related) without any issue.

    Your driving pattern is also relevant, will you be commuting for that mileage in which case over night charging at home will cover you, or will it be sporadic long days in which case I'd look at your typical routes and what charging is available.

    If you do not have the facility for home charging I would not recommend an EV for you.

    You mention an EV6 (beautiful car) but a Tesla Model Y is cheaper and with that mileage will save you a lot versus the EV6 as it is a more efficient car, also the Tesla Model 3 is ten grand cheaper and even more efficient so will save you even more, I realise a lot of folk have become anti Tesla but I would at least give them a test drive as guts of €50k is a lot.

    Good luck with you, when I started driving EVs in 2017 there was but two realistic choices

    My stuff for sale on Adverts inc. EDDI, hot water cylinder, roof rails...

    Public Profile active ads for slave1 (adverts.ie)



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  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 39,434 Mod ✭✭✭✭Gumbo




  • Registered Users Posts: 7,870 ✭✭✭Grumpypants


    Rather than worry about annual mileage think about daily mileage. Using an EV is more like your phone. You want it to last all day, but you don't mind it being at 10% when you are going to bed as you can plug it in and it's fully charged every morning.

    You never hear people saying a phone can do 6000 hours of uptime a year. You care if it will last the day.

    So unless your daily mileage is regularly over 400km then an EV is going to serve you well.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,581 ✭✭✭celtic_oz


    These have better range (WLTP of 625KM) than an EV6

    Better warranty also - 250,000 KM or 10 years on the battery, so should be an easier sell when you rack up some miles

    start at €59K here



  • Registered Users Posts: 23,538 ✭✭✭✭ted1


    the EV 6 is a much nicer car. I’ve the ID4 and my dad has the EV6. If doing 40km a year the EV6 will be more comfortable. And has 800V charging



  • Registered Users Posts: 23,538 ✭✭✭✭ted1


    ^^ ignore this guy. He sounds like he works for Toyota.



  • Registered Users Posts: 28 ddcluracan


    I do 52,000 km a year. I have saved €4,000 in fuel costs after one year by going electric. I went with a new model 3 which was €44,000 at the time. One of the reasons I went for a new Model 3 is the LFP battery and the warranty (which in my case would be 3 years). I tend to keep cars for 7 years on average so depreciation is not an issue for me so I cannot comment on that. The LFP battery isn't great in the cold but it has better cycle life which means it will last a lot longer than NMC batteries. I typically use 40% of my battery every day. The battery would have to degrade by 50% for it to have an effect on my daily routine. By that time the rest of the car will probably fall apart first.

    So yes an EV is suitable for your mileage provided you can charge at home overnight on a decent night rate tariff.



  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 19,037 Mod ✭✭✭✭slave1


    ..also look at servicing costs of whatever EV you go with, some are silly high

    My stuff for sale on Adverts inc. EDDI, hot water cylinder, roof rails...

    Public Profile active ads for slave1 (adverts.ie)



  • Registered Users Posts: 7,783 ✭✭✭CMOTDibbler


    Just on the mileage of second hand EVs. If I use the same filter on DD, I get almost twice what you came up with on Carzone. Around 10% of the total. Also need to factor in the fact that a lot of sellers of high mileage cars leave the mileage out, so it's not really indicative. And since the vast majority of second hand EVs are from 2021 onwards (4,000 out of 4,700 on DD) high mileage examples would be rare enough.



  • Registered Users Posts: 679 ✭✭✭Happy_Harry


    What servicing costs are you referring to ? I have my M3 now 4.5 yrs and the only "service" I got was to replace air filter.

    I would say there is a slightly higher wear on tyres, but that is it, no ?



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  • Registered Users Posts: 10,519 ✭✭✭✭tom1ie


    Firstly when you say you bought used diesels- was that with a loan or outright?
    If you bought your diesel cars without a loan, bear in mind you may need a loan to buy an EV that will do your long length trips.

    If you need to pay back a loan, all your fuel savings by going EV will be wiped out.

    It all depends on if you don’t have a loan to repay on your current diesel vs needing a loan to get a new EV that has good range.



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