Time for a zero refugee policy? - *Read OP for mod warnings and threadbans - updated 11/5/24*

But we also need unskilled workers - hospitality workers, cleaners, kitchen staff, agriculture, refuse collection, labourers, factory operatives, nursing home assistants and so on. We shouldn't necessarily get too hung on whether migrants are skilled or unskilled, just as long as they are fit and healthy and employable.

but they should still be coming via the proper channels. If the government encourage people to come here and they fraudulently claim asylum just to avoid the work visa system but then reward them with work anyway. You may as well just rip up the work visa system.

Every country needs unskilled workers to help an economy grow as by in large Irish workers wont pick fruit or hotel cleaners etc however you cannot just open the borders like what this government is doing but rather we should have a scheme in place that looks at the different areas in our economy and see what area's are we missing unskilled workers for seasonal or short term work and the employer would have to justify why they need these workers etc

I would also add that any migrant that comes here illegally should not be allowed in this scheme what so ever

The far left beleive none of our culture is being diluted, the ethnic irish people and their culture are irrelevant, national identity doesn't matter, sovereignty doesn't matter, borders don't matter, individual national culture (music, sports, religion, family values peoples attitudes to women,children, and each other how they treat each other none of that matters) traditions dont matter, shared history doesnt matter, historical societal values they don't matter. Judeao christian values dont matter. All humans are equal all religions and none are equal all societal values are equal all nations are equal all people are equal, tribalism doesn't exist we should accept people from any country in the world because that is the virtuous thing to do. Crime statistics from other countries are irrelevant, social unrest is irrelevant. All people will come here with virtuous goodwill and will be grateful for our generosity so much so that they will adapt to our culture they will speak our language within a year, know our history play our sports, sing our songs, adopt our values and integrate fully, they will become more irish than the Irish themselves. The best way to achieve this would be mass immigration to change the demographic from 3% foreign born to 22% foreign born within 25 years. 3% to 22% is not dilution its enrichment and all enrichment is good do not question it do not concern yourself with it, our politicians have it all under control, to question the merits and problems of any immigration policy is "far right,racist, and xenophobic".

Take the 2021 white paper on ending direct provision for international protection it assumed 3500 applicants for asylum annually at a capitol cost of building 6 centres holding 330 each of up to 741 million with an estimated annual cost of processing and welfare of 175 million.

That has since changed the new normal according to roderic was going to be 15,000 applicants this was in december 2023 https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/roderic-ogorman-says-15000-asylum-seekers-per-year-will-be-new-normal-1569905.html#:~:text=%E2%80%9COur%20department%2C%20for%20a%20year,is%20now%20between%2013%2C000%2D15%2C000

Now the new normal going forward appears to be 30,000 applicants according to the latest figures this year.

https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/around-30000-asylum-seekers-may-come-into-the-state-this-year-fianna-fail-parliamentary-party-meeting-hears/a1631074328.html

There will be homeless ghettos all over this country by the end of the year ifour politicians don't get a handle on this.

Our tourism sector will be decimated by years end all over this country.

It's not the fault of anyone coming here it's solely the fault of our politicians who have encouraged and enabled this.

Are they fit and healthy?

Since many are coming from third world countries where diseases are rife with no vaccines etc how do we know their health status?

The party's mentioned above are largely irrelevant to the Irish public along with Sinn Fein who will soon just disappear with their sitting on the fence politics and no answers to this issue.

"They therefore need to be subsidized by us, the taxpayer"

Never heard such BS in my life. What about the Croation staff member in my local Cafeand the tens of thousands like him, how does he manage without any subsidies by the irish state as he is a legal EU worker?But these other lads from pakistan need to be put up in hotels?

The Irish Times published a piece on Saturday that reported that developing world diseases were rife in the expanding, predominantly migrant homeless population - far from the image of health. Obviously these issues relate primarily to asylum seekers rather than the broader migrant population but this is the refugee thread, so I’m not sure why other forms of migration were raised in the first place.

This thread is primarily a refugee and asylum thread rather than an immigration thread, at least that was the impression I had based on the title and the majority of the discussion. At present between 50% - 70% of asylum applicants in the State are secondary movements from other EU Member States, in addition to that incredible statistic, the majority are from countries of origin with low acceptance rates, this is appalling and marginally less supportive language from the Taoiseach on immigration will have little practical impact. Policies of deterrence in line with the Danish model are required.

Reading the thread, it remains primarily a thread focused on asylum. Repeatedly commenters have recognised the value of skilled migration in in-demand areas of the economy. To say that certain types of migration add value is uncontroversial, a large percentage of the population believe that, a large percentage of the population equally believe that immigration is excessive and that asylum in particular is incredibly excessive, especially considering the circumstances. What the majority find unfathomable is the widespread manipulation and incompetence of the asylum system, not skilled migration, and it seems to me that the person your talking to has mentioned those points in relation to asylum, so focusing on skilled migration seems misguided.

I have no idea how many asylum seekers coming here are 'genuine' or merely fleeing extreme poverty (how dare they).

Nobody else on this thread has any kind of reliable figure either that I've seen.

If somehow our immigration system could magically determine who was 'genuine' every time, with no scope for error, we'd still have to deal with the people who will try to come here to escape poverty. If anything it could be more difficult if people came undocumented, with all the consequences that would bring.

How many should we take? I might as well say 7, for all the relevance it has. What I think will happen is that there'll be an attempt to step up deportations, and approx 90% of those arriving will still end up living here. They'll be working and living alongside us, their kids will go to school with our kids, and they will be part of our communities and lives.

If enough people are upset about this we could try going for more extreme solutions a la Denmark or Hungary. These come with a multitude or risks and no guarantees of effectiveness, despite what the people looking for your votes will tell you come the next election.

As for how it ends, I can't predict the future but I suppose the worst outcome probably ends with a dissolved EU. Maybe less immigration because we're no longer a top-tier destination, think Ireland in the 80's. We could also see security threats coming from the militias the EU are currently funding to stop immigration. Historically funding militia's to do the dirty work hasn't worked out so well.

https://apnews.com/article/united-nations-tripoli-ap-top-news-international-news-immigration-9d9e8d668ae4b73a336a636a86bdf27f

The more positive outlook sees the EU working with nations in the Global South, perhaps trade deals and common market entry in lieu of human rights improvements. According to the current MD of the IMF, tackling poverty in the Global South is actually key to our own economic growth in the next century. So to me this looks like the direction to go for a multitude or reasons.

https://www.imf.org/en/News/Articles/2024/03/08/sp031424-kings-college-cambridge-kristalina-georgieva

The difference being we have agreed as a nation to treat EU migrant workers same as irish, so they qualify for HAP just like Irish. I don't recall the agreement of the nation to subsidize the labour of Ahmed from Pakistan by putting him up in a hotel.

I am not sure what you are getting at.

Are you talking about Ahmed from Pakistan who is an international protection applicant, or are you talking about the Ahmed who has been granted residency?

If it's the first instance, then Ahmed is legally entitled to accommodation under the International Protection Act 2015. If it's the latter case and Ahmed is now a resident of this state, then he's entitled to HAP and any other entitlement that you and I qualify for.