Inheriting the family farm

i transferrred in 2011,stamp duty/inheritiance tax of 10% if your not a young trained farmer ie have the green cert. if you are a young trained farmer its 1%, so a farm of 100 acres valued at 10k/acre is 1 million, 10% of that , 100,000 in tax would be due compared to 1,000 with 1% of a young trained farmer. also start getting the transfer set in motion, because you need to be plus 5 years farm transferred to avail of the Fair Deal scheme for nursing homes. it basically means the government will use your parents pension to pay for their nursing home costs. a lot can happen in 5 years so you should try to set that in motion. 400-500 an acre going for spuds and carrots in north leinster area at minute

also start getting the transfer set in motion

How would the OP do that? They think they "might" inherit it in future? How would they bring up the conversation at home about transferring it in <2 years so the OP isn't rode by revenue?

I tried that move about 7 years ago and was told in no uncertain terms, it's the fathers till the day he dies. His accountant and solicitor both told him to transfer it as it's more tax efficient all round but no bite. It's a very hard conversation to bring up about transferring.

id say the OP would want to be having that conversation especially about fair deal, it would be some disaster to have to sell land to pay for the nursing home costs. no harm in bringing it up. but thats easy to say for me, my father was going on about "getting it out of my name" for 10 years before we got around to it. for years afterwards he would give out if he spotted a bill like esb or eircom coming with his name on it.

dead right just depends on each circumstance though. family farms in my area are dropping like flies most are leased out now around here to huge tillage operators or massive dairy companies and pig companies growing feed for the farms. i think land prices will cool around here anyway with derogation and SFP capped on tillage farmers , isnt there a big reduction coming? a lot of the operations that have the family farms leased around here are 150- 200k sfp. they will take some hit

Sure when you're at it you could maybe ask them for their thoughts on a preferred home.

Maybe you could even bring them to see a few a bit like they might have brought you to different secondary schools 🤣.

I think you're being a bit hard on landowners, There's a huge percentage of marriages failing, Probably a reflection of children being spoiled and having unreasonable expectation when they grow up and get married.

Parents take it very badly in most cases when the son/daughter gives away their hard earned assts

I'd be slow to give anyone anything until I'm finished with it. No regrets then

The daft thing is if you asked the older generation most would say they want it kept in the family and farmed by their children. But their own poor planning is a major reason why this won't happen. It must be a lonely place for people slogging around in their 70s and 80s, seeing the place fall down around them because they can't manage it

Have been very lucky with succession here, as it was handed over just after I was 30 and got to make loads of decisions good/bad in my 20s. My parents never forced the farm on me or stood in my way when I wanted to developed it.

My father says the greatest enjoyment he ever got from the farm is doing small jobs with the grandkids. If people only look at the worst outcome it will stop them doing things that have massive benefits for them aswell

That's all very well in theory, but how many children have decided on their career path before they go to secondary school? If there are multiple children, how many (if any) will be interested in working the farm?

As a contractor it’s crazy the amount of places you go where there’s farmers in their 40’s and even 50’s but the parents name is still on the chequebook and they in their 70’s or more. The funny part about it is they’re nearly all people who’s own parents have them the farm when they were in their 20’s and 50+ years later they’re still trying to hang on to it.

I have a four month old son, he'll be getting everything and it'll be up to him what he wants to do with it. I only got the farm in my name recently and got caught with the assets not being in my name for long enough as I have a father that's in care so no qualifying for fair deal.

It was a dumb move on my part not pushing for the transfer sooner and as a result paying for their cost of care has put a massive financial and emotional cost on my family. This financial burden will last for another 18 months until the three year cap is up.

I implore anyone with semi elderly parents that are thinking about getting a transfer done to do it ASAP.

IIn fairness its easy to spot who wont be a farmer. Hard to spot who would stick with it. A farm cannot be divided like you cleave a watermelon, two (or more) parts. Then you neither have peace in the family nor two functioning farms. How do you split a 200 acre farm and still have two families living off it? I socialise with both CoI and Catholics. CoI are more one farm one heir. Catholic families are more divide amongs the heirs.

I have similar friends in large scale b usiness and they want to be semi retired at 60 and sons finished sales and operations at 35 and onto management in the family businesses. Those are healthy family businesses.

CoI - church of Ireland

But will conditions ever be right? You seem to be worried what will happen, most likely long after yer gone. As the years pass will the identified heirs even want it by then? I think owners need to make a decision and hand it over to the younger generation when they are young and allow them do what they like with it in the same way the owners did.

(this is a subject which cuts very close to the bone and is causing awful strife for me)

I think those tax breaks will be for the chop in the coming years.

Nevertheless, why don't you initiate the transfer now or soon? Those same concerns of a failed marriage will be there regardless

At this stage I'd expect them to sell it, at the worst they'll end up with 60% of the value of it.

I'd advise any young fellow/girl against farming

Surely as an only child the odds of getting your parents farm rank closer to a certainty, and on that basis it should be transferred post haste. There are ways and means to look after their interests, but as a matter of simple financial prudence (for the reasons as set out above) it should be done now.

I'm wearing my hat as a managing partner of a law firm and as a part time farmer here.

I never understand why older farmers are advising young people away from farming.

If it's something they are interested in and enjoy you are giving them terrible advice from your own biased experience. Most farming is part time but if you can make a decent living from it, it's a brilliant way of life. Kids are still young here and I am always near if they need me.

Likewise if they have no interest you can't force them to do it.

I think alot of older lads were forced into farming and resent that. I often heard my father say he would have liked to have tried something else but the choice wasn't there for him. Today most lads that take over the farm have a love for it.

There's no doubt that up to 2015, There had been 25 of the best years of farming, but with the reduction of viable schemes and biss I don't know what would attract young people to farming apart from dairying.

And even dairying, there's easier ways to make a living.

Farmers always moan so nothing new there, I remember one of our national beef commitee chairman pleading poverty and discovered his SFP was 90000

I am not sure it’s that they advise to stay away; it’s more that very few farms are viable such that you could be full time and rear a family.

Therefore you need an education (or trade or what ever) first; and farming has to be the after thought.

A farm is a wonderful place to rear a family. Kids love animals and machinery. They get to learn stuff with out even knowing they are.