Time for a zero refugee policy? - *Read OP for mod warnings and threadbans - updated 11/5/24*

“Or we could talk about how many women and children are being raped and tortured because of the hard borders we already have?”

Your suggestion that people are being raped and tortured as a consequence of Ireland’s border policies is nothing short of outrageous.

Utter sensationalism, a dangerous and untruthful charge to lay at the feet of Ireland

I've already provided details. Figures show 40 adults and 8 children died trying to get here last year.

It will be more this year, and likely more again due to further visa restrictions.

After that there's plenty of evidence of children being raped and abused on migrant routes throughout Europe and in Ireland.

https://www.noteworthy.ie/kids-in-care-lost-in-europe-6365422-Apr2024/

https://reliefweb.int/report/italy/hundreds-migrant-children-face-abuse-european-borders

https://www.esri.ie/system/files/publications/BKMNEXT145.pdf

https://www.lenus.ie/bitstream/handle/10147/86601/SeparatedChildrenProjectReport.pdf?sequence=1&isAllowed=y

https://www.unicef.org/eca/emergencies/refugee-and-migrant-children-europe

https://www.savethechildren.net/news/children-migrating-europe-experience-horrific-rates-violence-abuse-and-trauma-report

If people can't fly here they have to come through these migrant routes.

We have a choice to allow people to come here safely and still process their asylum applications.

Further than that we can also use our voice within Europe to say enough to these false narratives that hard border controls are the answer, highlighting they've already failed, and look for solutions that tackle the push factors.

In fairness some in Europe are already advocating for this.

https://www.irishtimes.com/world/europe/2024/07/01/europe-cannot-build-a-wall-in-mediterranean-to-stop-migration-says-eu-commissioner/

Thats not what that link is about, bluesky .

Its about finding ways to stem the flow .

"The only way to really manage migration in a sustainable way is to address the root causes of migration, to provide opportunities for young people.” More development aid and investment was needed to improve things like education and health services, as well as transport and digital infrastructure in Africa" .

Well thats like saying "we can't stop them coming".

The answer is somewhere in between . Its no point throwing the hands up in despair .

To be fair I don't disagree with you about corruption , but certain safequards can be built in .

How about reducing/ restricting funds in line with the amount of that country's citizens seeking asylum ? Like , get your house in order .

I foresee this as not being country by country though . EU wide is my guess .

It just dawned on me, these are the cantankerous people on this thread day in day out repeating the same mantra…the zombified not worth reading let alone debating, only good for putting on ignore

Do you have anything to back up these claims about the effectiveness of the Japanese system?

As far as I'm aware people just just don't try to go there.

You typed all that out, yet you didn't answer the question

You see now we agree - I wrote 'reduce the flow' and you refer to 'stem the flow'. It is possible to see many various angles on these matters and then decide which ones need more emphasis than others. Personally I've donated money to self help charities over the years, on the principle that you help people learn skills and acquire stock so they can support themselves. I'm all for our government helping in same manner, to a given agreed budget, whilst keeping an eagle eye on local corruption.

That philosophy requires people to stay in their home states and help to build them up by actively contributing. So I don't think it's either helpful to those states or to us, to have people leaving these states, coming here to provide a cheap labour force and so they acquire in time the trappings of a western way of life.

We need a carrot & stick approach, both deployed together and at same time.

The problem with people from the far left is that they cannot see any flaws in their virtuous outlook of the world, they can only see issues through their own inflated sense of self righteousness and moral superiority. The glib reference to how dare they seek asylum from extreme poverty when you can't tell how many are coming here with genuine applications.

We once had a politician in ireland say the following " the patience of the Irish people would be very tested if they knew the ‘cock and bull’ stories being given by people looking for asylum. " our policy then changed to sending out tweets referencing our white paper to end direct provosion in multiple languages, which offered own door accomadation to applicants. A significant pull factor and a weak government which did nothing to stem the tide. We had an asylum refusal rate of up to 90% a decade ago which has flipped to 30% in 2022 and back up to 60% in 2023. We are known worldwide as a soft touch a fact acknowledged by the Israeli minister who said Palestinians "can go to Ireland or the desert". Ukranian refugees are down over 40% since the government changed the social welfare payments in early 2024. https://www.newstalk.com/news/social-welfare-is-too-generous-to-refugees-ukrainian-mother-1395919

It has been claimed in the Dail that the vast majority of Georgians coming here are economic migrants by this far right agitator.. https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/varadkars-remarks-on-asylum-seekers-branded-gas-lighting-and-dangerous/38657818.html

The UK took in an average of about 40,000 asylum applicants in the 3 years prior to brexit. Of course the number we take is relevant it impacts communities around the country our population is 5 million odd the UK population is 68 million that's X 14 of our population. Facilities, housing, health care, education are all needed when you parachute 100s of people into towns and villages inorganically. If you land 100s of men from many different cultures with many different values, with nothing to do integration and social cohesion will suffer.

Asylum seekers cannot seek asylum for reasons of "extreme poverty" Nigeria a country that has seen a huge influx of asylum seekers here has 80 million people living in extreme poverty, there are nearly a billion people worldwide living in extreme poverty. How many should come to ireland? Can ireland solve poverty worldwide with billions living in poverty? How many millions of poverty stricken people should we house in ireland annually and how do we pay for them?

Tell me how much of it did you understand?

In two posts you have stated absurd far left meandering such as

" Yet there are people shxxng on here about and thanking videos from racists ,white supremavist posts about UK , and anything that mentions adult males in tents . "

" Discussion about dilution of culture and theories about plantation are beyond comment at this stage . They are conspiracy theories put forward by far right groups from the KKK to the BNP ."

I suggest that the conspiracy theory comments are actually " a call that is coming from inside the house ".

That Indigenous White Populations of Europe will become minority populations in their historic homelands is not a conspiracy theory put forward by the BNP or the mythical Far Right ( no doubt hiding behind every tree and under the bed, possibly in the room with us right now ).

The populations statistic are provided by official government figures. The predictions have been made by official sources. For example in the UK, by the Office Of National Statistics, a UK government office. The numbers and predictions are official, the are not coming from the KKK, they are coming from offical UK government sources and publications.

In the last two millenium, populations have been replaced, outbred, had their cultures diluted. As far as I know neither the KKK or the BNP were around at the time. The leftists will point to the white European colonialists, in the Americas, Australia and New Zealand, along with parts of Africa and Asia, but are silent about the similar impact of Islam, the agression expansionism of which continues unabated. Unlike White Europeans, wracked with guilt for their sins, considering repatriations, Islam continues unopolgetically.. In 700 Islam existed in a small area of Arabia. Thanks to some very particular aspects of it's ideology, it has spread throughout Asia, Africa and further afield, with an agressive policy of populations replacement, actual genocide by using rape as a weapon of war, and cultural dilution, by imposing it's culture over the culture of the existing populations These are observable facts. Mohammed himself suggested to his followers that they could engage in rape as a tool of domination and submission of his enemies ( simply put, non muslims ). Where Islam conquered, the existing populations became Dhimmis.

That cultures are being diluted as the demographcs change is an observable fact. The White British population of London had

a culture. The were famously known for queuing for a bus. They would let ladies on first. They would never dream of pusing in front of other public transport users who had been patiently waiting before them. When riding their public transport, the seats reserved for the elderly and disabled were strictly off limits, they would not dream of sitting in those seats with their children and placing their bags on the seats, depriving the old and disabled of the seats. They would consider spitting in the street disgusting. And as for using public wastebins on major high streets to publically defacate in …. So yes, British culture has been diluted, and the British people will be replaced, and these things are not conspiracy theories, they are observable facts.

And Ireland, in it's delusion, having seen the evidence that " multiculturalism " does not work when some of the cultures involved don't actually subscribe to the ideology, yet have been alloowed to benefit from, is following the UK down the same path.

The actual realities of what is happening in Europe are not conspiracy theories are not coming " the far right ". It's all real, observable and quantifiable through official statistics. Shame the far left are so investing in their delusions that they would deny the grass is green or the sky is blue, but eventually reality with hit with a great impact.