Kilkenny GAA Thread

Never thought of that! I'm sure JP would pass a hat around the dressing room for him.

Think everyone was delighted to see Cork win bar Limerick people, it was a super performance and to beat them twice in one year was some achievement. Fair play to Pat Ryan and the players, particularly with all the guff coming out of Limerick after the first game, videoing Corks celebrations etc and what Limerick weren't going to do to ye if ye met again. Savage display by Cork..

I'll still be roaring the banner on in the final though!

Unfortunately I was away and missed the minor in the park and could only get to watch the semi final in town when I got back. It was a really bad week for the county and incredibly frustrating as both teams could have won. Fair dues to Clare and even more so Cork on getting to the finals and for Tipp for digging it out when down to 13 men. I've read all the comments on here since I got back and there as been much guessing and wondering what went wrong and I'll mainly focus on the senior game.

1.Were lads injured?

2. Are we fit enough?

3. Why do we revert to type when under pressure?

4. Kind of related to the above, are we tactically savvy enough?

5. We kept introducing the same old players with no youth or newness.

1 We all know Donnelly was injured in the Wexford game and he hasn't been right since but played ok on Saturday. I saw Adrian Mullen (looked like him anyway) with a cast on his left wrist yesterday, perhaps he picked it up in the game but he was definitely sub par for most of the first half and should have been replaced earlier. This would seem to be an error on the managements part and something we still don't seem to have learned from since 2010.

2 I think we are fit enough and I think our inability to play well for 70 minutes is not a physical thing. I do think we left it too long to make changes. The management seem to have no faith in their panel otherwise they would make changes earlier. From a bit I've heard the communication is very poor to non-existent a lot of the time. I had hoped we'd moved on from that BS after Cody but these guys all seemed to learned this and think it's an effective approach to man management. If you look at our matches against Limerick particularly in 2022 but even last year we were as fit, we lost those games in other ways which I will address next.

3 & 4 I think the reason we revert to type (ie longball from the fullback line) is that the whole of Kilkenny hurling or huge parts of it's coaching are infected with Cody's mantras and style at both intercounty and club, players/coaches and managers who looked up to him with good reason. Unfortunately there seems to be no leadership at the top of the pile from the County board through to team managements to lead a change in this. There is no charismatic leader there that lads would run through a brick wall for or that people want to follow. There is very little passion at all levels down through our county set up all the way to the fans hence the lower numbers I believe. So before a match we devise a smart way of playing an opposition and by an large it works well and we burst out into a lead. The opposition usually see what we're doing and devise a counter strategy to negate our good work and this is when we fall apart. We seem to have coached them to play one certain way and when that stops working our lads seem to panic and revert to what they and their coaches have known all their lives lump it long and get it out of my area so it's not my problem. We play as individuals and the whole thing falls apart we rely on individual brilliance to keep us in games and to withstand the come backs. I believe this makes it look like we're not fit enough as we're chasing shadows as we've lost our shape and purpose. Now that can happen any team on a day but what you need then is leaders on the sideline and field to pull things back together, make a few changes to allow us to counteract the changes the opposition made to deal with our first half dominance. I know for a fact that Corks coach, teaches at least 4 different setups of play to counteract what an opposition might do or change too. All the players are trained in these different styles/tactics so they can be implemented as and when needed depending on what an opposition team does or how they want to exploit them. If they bring back a sweeper how do you play? Well you know because you have practiced it. What if they flood the middle third and play one up front. Ok you might not have faced exactly that but you've seen something similar in practice so ye try that option and the sideline might make a few tweeks. It seems to me that KK go out with our setup and gameplan right most days it works well until the opposition counter it and then we're all at sea.

5 I had hoped this management team would be different but in reality they are a pale imitation of Cody. They have tried somethings but they've been far to conservative. In fact even more conservative I would suggest on player selection than Cody would have been the last few years. Young players get half a league game to make an impression and are dropped to the curb others impress all league and then are dropped to obscurity. I'm deliberately referring to the management team and not just Derek as I believe they're all culpable. Lots of players brought into the setup but very few given a real chance. For instance I would have loved to seen a J Molloy or a N Rowe given the league and championship at corner back. I would have persisted with Daragh Corcoran FB and tried H Lawlor CB. It seems like the management decided these lads just can't do it and there's no point even trying them for any length of time. Corcoran and S Murphy got games but they were messed around by filling gaps all over and never got a chance in one spot then seemingly punished for not performing when starters stayed in position and held their place.

I could go on about the county board and I will at some stage but we will see no change at county board level until our treasurer and a many of the other long term residence who have been on the circuit, go. They won't go of their own accord and unless we have a Duignan style figure to lead a campaign to replace them all it won't happen. We saw what Duignan brought to Offaly, a new vigour, ideas and enthusiasm to the setup. I fear we could be in for another 10+ years of mediocrity. An All Ireland Semi Final is kind of the minimum a KK manager should be achieving with the current health of Leinster hurling and the players we have.

We need some innovative coaching and passion. We don't have to follow what Cork or Limerick do or play like them. We have to give our players the tools to be able to recognise and counteract styles of play with our own. We don't have to proscribe every movement far from it but we need to know where to be when we're defending and how get around the opposition defence when attacking using our own styles. The players have to be comfortable with that and the more clubs do to start playing in different ways the more the players are exposed to it and are more comfortable playing in different setups.

Totally agree with everything you say. I have said the current management team seem to be a poor mans Cody.

As you said nothing has really changed. Young players brought in and discarded like a deck of cards if they make the slightest mistake. We need to have more patience and give these players a good chance. Young players need to have confidence that they will be given a fair chance.

Management need to have a long hard look in the mirror as I blame them for this defeat. No disrepect to Fogarty and Walsh but i dont think any KK supporter thought on Sat that they would change the direction of that game. I honestly said to myself thats game over. Clare must have being delighted to see the 2 of them come on as they knew exactly what KK were going to do. If he had sprung 2 young players off the bench they probably would have to second guess.

The county board needs a massive shake up and someone to come in and drive change. I feel it will turn into a long famine if there is no change there.

Lyng has a year left on his contract and IMO he will have to swing massive changes if he wants to stay longer. He will need to end careers if they decide not to themselves.

Great job that teaching.

if not blowing the whistle for frees makes an excellent ref then he was the best ever :)

I wouldn't let me near a team, it's easy from the sidelines.

Dalton alluded to the ferocity of their A v B internal matches, I’d say Pat Ryan has adopted the Cody internal match method, you fight like a dog to win a jersey and you won’t be getting any frees.

Cork hurling had a niceness to it since 2005, but Ryan has these lads wired up and fighting like dogs.

Both Clare and Cork will genuinely feel they can win this final, which hopefully means it will be a cracked of a final.

The ball into our forwards has being poor a long time now,not a weighted pass or backs and forwards on the same page. Some of the ball from defence last Saturday was scandalous. We feared what might happen when the pressure came on and unfortunately this is what came to fruition. Nothing wrong with route one at times but route one after retreating is shocking. In summary it wasn't a step forward so next year is a huge year for lyng. Has he brought anything new to the table? That's debatable. He has kept Cody's team and discarded new lads quickly. He failed to find or look for a number 4 and 6. To be fair cian Kenny has stepped up and donnelly has had a good season along with billy ryan He will have to look hard at trying to find a few forwards. I don't know if looking for browne,leahy and Alan Murphy to come back is the awnser. I think lyng should freshen his backroom team and this includes a high profile s&c coach. He simply can't go back with the same squad and expect different results next year. I wonder if fionn macekssey goes well for olg could he be a option for kk at 6. It's a long time away now but david fogarty,niall Rowe, Jeff neary and clifford should definitely be tried in defence. Blanchfield should be tried and left at 6. Billy drennan needs a huge championship with his club but to me it looks like he needs to be put on a individual training plan. Marty Murphy,Harry shine,Stephen donnelly,geroid dunne could all do with a good club campaign. Last Saturday will hurt management for a while.What would molloy,Shane Murphy and Owen Wall be thinking after that?regarding the county board getting credit for the purchase of land this is 20 years over due. The red light has being flashing a long time now it's 10 years without a minor and senior and one u21 In twenty years that's absolutely very poor I'm anyones language. Kk aren't judged on winning leinsters or losing by one point to the u20 winners. Mindsets have to change. Eddie brennan,Tom mullally and Brian dowling should be sought after and get them involved because theres plenty of vacancies or there definitely should be.

A member of the panel, non playing I would suggest and unnamed? An unnamed source, now where have I heard that before? It certainly doesn't render anything loosely suggested i.e gossip as being "absolute fact".

Reading about our supporters in the mirror and their nasty behaviour on the kilkenny gaa supporters facebook page I have to say our supporters are really a disgrace and up their with the English soccer supporters. Very disappointing.

why do RTE let that gulping clown free rein on defending the throwing with no counter argument? For those sake of hurling the rule needs to be enforced. Clear separation or else it’s a free.