Transgender man wins women's 100 yd and 400 yd freestyle races.

In a sporting environment…yes, the only thing that matters is performance, which in turn equals results.

That’s only reiterating what Hamsterchops said already? It wasn’t true then and simply repeating it doesn’t make it any more true than it wasn’t already.

If identity is what really matters for people who compete in sports (never have I heard such nonsense), they can do that elsewhere.

And they can do it in sports too, they have been, for some time now, or do you imagine competitive rivalries based on identity are not a thing in sports?

When males compete against females, it is not about identity, it is about the biological advantages they carry over the rest of the competition.

Says you, other people disagree with your opinion. Male and female are identities in themselves, so the idea that identities in sports is nonsense clearly just isn’t borne out by reality.

If they are focused on identity, then why not do it against the same sex? Might it be because they wouldn't have those advantages over the same sex?

They do? There’s plenty of intense competition in sports between members of the same sex, could be based on another identity which has nothing to do with biology like their national identity. You’re very clearly mistaken if you imagine that sex is the only identity that matters in sports.

Funding the development of women’s sports has never come at the expense of funding the development of men’s sports? That’s what budgets are for - to determine where and how to invest in resources and development. It’s why this image went viral as it did when the discrepancy was pointed out and the NCAA tried to defend their position, only for their position to be shown to have no merit:

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/sports/women-ncaa-tournament-allege-weight-room-disparities-n1261600

If an organisation which claims to be a non-profit organisation is focused on profitability, they might reasonably offer the excuse that because resources are finite and it’s a zero-sum game, this justifies the lack of investment in women’s sports, and be exposed for that too:

https://www.npr.org/2021/10/27/1049530975/ncaa-spends-more-on-mens-sports-report-reveals#:~:text=Hourly%20News-,The%20NCAA%20spends%20more%20on%20men's%20sports%20than%20women's%2C%20says,in%20the%202018%2D19%20season.

I don’t remember saying that taking part is the only thing that matters? You made the point that in a sporting environment the only thing that matters is performance, which in turn equals results. I countered your statement by pointing out that while that is true as far as you’re concerned, for many other people who aren’t you, it simply isn’t true. Talking to as many athletes as we could won’t change that fact, nor will ignoring the fact that world class athletes have already expressed opinions to the contrary, let alone the numbers of athletes who will never make it to world class or Olympic level competitions or enjoy massive sponsorship opportunities.

It’s an obvious point to make that sports rivalries wouldn’t exist without sports, but your point was that they could express their identities elsewhere, and I was making the point that they do already, and they do it in sports too. There’s no impediment to them doing so other than the rules of the competition which prohibit athletes using the event to promote their political or religious views (regularly ignored by the athletes themselves).

I’ve not ignored the physiological differences between male and female bodies at all, nor am I ignoring the reality of the physiological differences between individual athletes which endow them with advantages over their competition. It’s but one single factor among numerous factors in determining fairness in sports. It’s why categories and classes exist, and rules exist for the safety of the athletes both on and off the field, or track, or court, or whatever the case may be.

Dogmatic beliefs aren’t weird either, you’re equally adept at ignoring facts which don’t suit you. Nothing whatsoever weird about that.

You are essentially redefining the whole point of sport, which is competition, against other athletes, to win. Please provide some evidence about these world class athletes who have expressed opinion to the contrary. Any top level athlete worth their salt competes to win, you saying otherwise or trying to claim that is pretty laughable.

I’ve not attempted to redefine anything. You are though by adding in all sorts of criteria that weren’t there before, like an athlete worth their salt is an entirely subjective metric based entirely upon your own standards, and your original claim was that performance is what matters, so I don’t know whether by your definition he’s worth his salt or not, but Noah Lyles has his eye on more than just winning competitions -

“Whether the time is fast or not, it doesn’t matter because they know when they come to a track event I’m at, it’s going to be electric.”

https://olympics.com/en/news/noah-lyles-exclusive-on-how-he-wants-to-reinvent-track-field-i-m-unlimited

He does have a point, to be fair 😂

This point makes no sense at all. Are you claiming that trans athletes need their sport for their identity? Considering that most of this thread has been able biological males using female sports to make their point, seems pretty evident that they are craving the attention on that front. I am sure the biological advantage they have has no bearing at all in their endeavours…no, not at all.

Well that’s what they claim, and without any evidence to the contrary, all you’re doing is engaging in supposition and speculation based upon your own beliefs. There’s a word for that kind of belief 🤨

Oh now, don't try drag me into your game of ignoring science. You have provided no facts, nor have you actually ever acknowledged that males are more powerful, stronger etc than females. Ever. Provide some scientific peer reviewed studies, and then get back to me. 😀

Well generally speaking they are, but that has little to do with whether or not transgender athletes as individuals have any advantage or none over their competitors which is why a blanket ban cannot be justified. Scientific peer reviewed studies aren’t going to tell you much, other than the few that exist are too small-scale be considered of any use whatsoever precisely because of the sparsity of people who are transgender in any given population, let alone those who are athletes who make up an even smaller percentage again of that number. That’s not ignoring science btw, I’m saying that the science just isn’t there, because of the lack of volunteers willing to submit themselves to be studied for the purposes of supporting a ban on their inclusion in sports.