Leinster Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread XII (The Byrne Supremacy)

Irfu have never looked kindly on players who refused to move.

The evidence still isn't there to convince me that it will improve their international prospects. And clearly Leinster players feel the same.

I guess from an IRFU pov they'd probably argue that the sample size is too small because players so rarely move. If more players move then more players would improve their chances.

We have discussed it ad nauseam over the last while but the high profile Leinster players who've moved directly to another province have hardly had glittering careers since.

Jeremy Loughman is probably the best example of current players. And even then he has 5 Ireland caps with 1 start (against Fiji) and has most recently been dropped in favour of a player who has never professionally played Loosehead. But to give him credit where it's due. He's won a URC and started in the final.

Other senior capped Leinster players who moved would be Aungier with no international caps and no camp involvement

Salanoa has been given opportunities whenever fit. But this is his biggest crutch.

Jordi Murphy and Jack McGrath were both capped internationally when they moved to Ulster. But I would hardly say it reignited their careers - indeed both had been involved in both finals of Leinster double before they moved

Same could be said about Sheehan and Kelleher.

How?

Leinster might encourage it with the medium term future in mind. Can't expect a coach on a one-year contract to encourage it though.

If I was leinster then I'd want him to play a lot of good quality minutes next year, either with connacht or leinster. Ideally with leinster, which they appear to have agreed.

Ah, you don't need me to say the obvious advantage to the lender is the player gets first team experience against the URC and European opposition. That's the advantage over sitting as 3rd or 4th choice and getting 2nd or 3rd team starts against dragons and Lions.

As a loan, it can be advantageous to the club as they get back a player with a year or 2 of experience.

La Rochelle away? What..

Probably going against the grain but I think Harry was mismanaged last season. He was in great form coming into the European knockouts and was dropped for an out of form Ross Byrne, then brought back in weeks later to play with the second string. Doesn't excuse bad performances but I really don't understand why he didn't start against Leicester after his performance against the Bulls

This is an IRFU problem not a player problem. The IRFU is the only entity that can create an environment that encourages intra-province moves which it has simply not achieved. When you don't let provinces meaningfully compete on money terms*, then you have very few strings to your bow. The Irish team has also consistently shown that it will select non-starters so another major push/pull factor is gone. If IRFU seriously want to encourage more movement then it needs to give players a reason to do so. Alternatively, the IRFU needs to discourage teams from holding on to players.

** - I'm not trying to get into a discussion on the merit of this policy but this is clearly one of the outcomes of such a policy.

I agree, Harry was playing well, done well all season, done what was asked of him, played well away in La Rochelle and then was dumped out quickly

Personally I hate the 6-2 bench, I know it's a Bok thing but I don't like it for Leinster. In reality that bench is hurting Harry because he isn't given a chance on bench because Frawley is picked as he can cover more positions.

I do hope, Im a huge Harry fan as people might have guessed, he kicks on again next year. To me I think he did this year make huge progress. No big injuries, played games in Europe, won a 6 nations with ireland. Not sure if that can be put down as a bad year for him? Maybe I am wrong

I've been a pretty strong defender of Leo and the near misses on silverware but some of his selection calls have been really shown up by Farrell.

Luke McGrath over Gibson park for years

Using frawley and Jimmy at 15 and never considering Osborne (who was super today)

Selecting Maloney over Joe McCarthy in past seasons

Persisting with the Byrnes at 10

I don't expect Leo to be as good a coach as Farrell, he's in the top job for a reason but you think the coach working with the players regularly would spot talent quickly

Luke was playing better than JGP right up to covid, after that it swapped. The agenda that Ireland picked JGP before Leinster did is questionable because it was over covid. The first few squads of Farrell it was Murray and Cooney. I remember JGP became Ireland qualified just before the 2019 WC and I mentioned, people laughed and said he would never become an Ireland player.

Frawley was tested years ago at 10, circa 2019 and it didn't work out well. Leinster decided to switch him to 12 and that was a success and Frawley went on the NZ tour as a 12. Due to injury he played 10 as Farrell done his "all in this, adversity" and it worked. They moved him to 15 mainly because they had a gap in that slot at 15 with Keenan. Osbourne was playing well at 12 so not sure why they didn't try him, I guess it was based on requirements at the time with Ngatai out injured etc

Joe was injured, last season he was due to breakout but spent most of it injured, if you remember they gave him a start in the Bulls semi, the year after the injury problems made it impossible for Leinster to pick him, he got fit at end of season but Maloney was MOM v Toulouse wasn't he? it was losing Ryan was the problem in final

Both Harry and Ross have played well, if Frawley able to run a team from start to finish in a game as the 10? the games I seen when he start he hasn't really blown me over. As I said they tested him years ago as well.

Leo works with the players, so did Lancaster and Contepomi. Lancaster an international coach and Conetpomi is now. They also have Nienaber as well coaching now with Goodman who is going into Ireland. All of these coachs are working with Leo.

farrell is a good coach, no doubts about that but I think you are picking situations, some outside the control of Leinster which resulted in changes. I have no idea on Osbourne but his performances at centre this year for Leinster have been great so not sure why they would have switched him. It was last minute the loss of Keenen to 7s

Apart from it's not all the same players.

Also don't know how you can't be excited by squad and potential of next season. Stop being spoilt it could be far worse as you could be a fan of another province.