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Rapist sentenced to 8 years

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,754 ✭✭✭aero2k


    You'd probably need to tell us more, though you probably have good reasons for not doing so. I reckon each case is different, though the conditioning would be a common factor. In some cases the victim may be too worn down to escape (physically or by making a complaint) and the abuse is discovered by some other means. In other cases a victim may decide they have nothing left to lose, so they are willing to take the necessary risks in seeking help.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,754 ✭✭✭aero2k


    Also, a horrible thought I had - are the cases we see reported just the tip of a huge iceberg?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 56,525 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    Hardly. For every awful case like this there are so many more run a the mill happy normal marriages/families



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,754 ✭✭✭aero2k


    You're right, I shouldn't have said huge. There is a lot of evidence though that the majority of rape/sexual asault cases are never reported. I was wondering would the same be true for domestic abuse (which may or may not involve rape/sexual asault). I think we both agree that one case is one too many.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,412 ✭✭✭Jequ0n


    I don’t think that any additional information is necessary because I know that my assertions are correct for the majority of cases like this. That’s why I find them so interesting.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,754 ✭✭✭aero2k


    Well, we don't know what you know, so we can't be sure what points you're trying to make. Your post made it sound that you are familiar with a case or cases to a greater extent than just someone reading newspaper reports. (I mentioned being in court recently, and I subsequently read several newspaper reports which while substantially accurate were incomplete and in some cases missed the most significant points presented in court completely). Telling us you know your assertions are correct would be more helpful if you provided some information to support those assertions, or even a clarification of what you are asserting. Then we could agree, disagree, or discuss as appropriate.

    I realise that these cases are sensitive which is perhaps why you weren't more forthcoming - that's fine if that's the case.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,205 ✭✭✭Ezeoul


    https://www.rte.ie/news/2024/0718/1460617-derry-orourke-coach-rape/

    Third time this sick fcuker has been convicted of rape and sexual assault of young girls, 60 charges, including these latest ones.

    They should throw away the key this time. I don't care if he is 78 and in ill health. Let him die in the Joy.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 56,525 ✭✭✭✭walshb




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 657 ✭✭✭Babyreignbow


    Caught this yesterday, its harrowing listening to it.

    https://www.rte.ie/radio/radio1/clips/22416266/

    (rte's superior quality broadcast service isn't working right now) same interview at 30mins here

    https://www.rte.ie/radio/radio1/clips/11643946/

    Use your mighty arms to slay the fierce enemy that is selfish desire




  • Registered Users Posts: 6,412 ✭✭✭Jequ0n


    I grew up in a family like that and learned early how illogical people can be, especially when they are clinging on to the faintest hope that things will change for the better. The slower the burn the longer they stay, and subsequently get used to the abuse being the norm. I can’t share my personal view on this because I’ll just be accused of victim blaming again but I hope this clarifies things for you.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,754 ✭✭✭aero2k


    I guessed as much. But logic often isn't much help in these situations especially when people are worn down psychologically and emotionally and probably physically abused as well. Also, like the woman in the horrible case where the perpetrator thankfully got a life sentence, sometimes the abused stay in the situation in a misguided attempt to protect others, usually children.

    The extraordinary thing for me (or interesting if you prefer) about that case is how the woman was able to get herself together enough to cooperate sufficiently with the authorities to secure a guilty plea.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,412 ✭✭✭Jequ0n


    They are not protecting anyone by staying, but it’s a popular argument because it gains sympathy. In reality both parties are dysfunctional and enabling the worst in the each other, often without fully realising it. I think it’s strange when others don’t see this the same way but maybe I was just lucky.

    The victim will have had medical records to support her accounts, as well as her children’s and possibly other witness accounts to back things up. The unknown factor is what made her speak up in the fire place but we’ll never know.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 657 ✭✭✭Babyreignbow


    Children are the silent victims of domestic abuse, they are equally affected and have the same requirements for support. Hope you're doing ok Jeqon.

    Use your mighty arms to slay the fierce enemy that is selfish desire




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,754 ✭✭✭aero2k


    But there you go again with your logic - it's not what's true, it's what the abused person thinks is true.

    Not talking specifically about this case, but can you not imagine a "doctor I walked into a door" scenario? There are lots of cases where the abuser is a well connected and respected member of a small community, and outsiders who are aware of the situation are afraid to intervene. Shame plays a huge part too. I have heard of a woman turning up at the parish priest's house, sporting a fresh black eye, and being told to go home to her husband.

    Our legal system is different to yours as well, it's adversarial rather than inquisitorial. It's not enough for a jury to believe the dependent commited the alleged offence - they have to believe that the prosecution proved that beyond reasonable doubt.



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,412 ✭✭✭Jequ0n


    The abused person’s logic makes no sense to me though. I have cognitive empathy and know why they behave the way they do, but it is like a moth flying into an open flame. I can understand why people stay if they have no means to physically escape, and maybe that was the case in this case though doubtful.



  • Registered Users Posts: 433 ✭✭Sponge25


    Is there no sentencing guidelines in Ireland like they have in the states? The sentences seem to be all over the place. Judges have far too much discretion in handing out sentences it seems. There should be a sliding scale for each crime, mitigating factors downgrade the length of your sentence, aggravating factors enhance the length of your sentence. I know judges often take mitigation/aggravation into account but they shouldn't have so much leeway.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,205 ✭✭✭Ezeoul


    So according to your logic, a woman who stays in a relationship where she is raped and physically and/or sexually assaulted repeatedly, is an enabler?

    Your logic is twisted. This is pure victim blaming.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 56,525 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    That's not fair. Jequon is making some cogent and rational points. Sometimes points can be tough, harsh, cruel. But such is the emotional dynamics of people and their relationships.

    Not specific to this case: It’s human nature to wonder/question how some people stay in clearly abusive relationships, or how’s one people hop from one abusive partner to another to another. It’s not victim-blaming. It’s wondering why..



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 56,525 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    I think a big issue is the over-emphasis in trying to make men stop being men (nasty men). You cannot. The focus should be on trying to educate women on how to stop picking these scumbags..



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,205 ✭✭✭Ezeoul


    If you have a problem with my post, report it.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,205 ✭✭✭Ezeoul


    Did you read what the wife in this case said to her rapist and abuser about their wedding day in Court?

    Maybe she should have been "more educated" about how not to pick a scumbag who was going to rape and abuse her over the next two decades, and threaten to withold money for food for their children.

    How many abused women report that the abuse only begins after they're married or even when they become pregnant?

    This line of thinking that "men are going to be men" and "women need to learn to be more careful in picking them" is giving rapists and abusers a pass on their behaviour and putting the responsibility back on women to avoid them.

    And now according to some fcuked up twisted logic, they are being called enablers for not leaving their abusers.

    Jesus H Christ.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,754 ✭✭✭aero2k


    Colour me old fashioned, but it's possible to have all the stereotypical qualities of a real man including willingness to be aggressive if attacked or threatened, without needing to validate masculinity by repeatedly abusing another weaker human being.

    It doesn't have to be either/or, we could try to teach people to avoid assholes, teach assholes not to be assholes, have laws requiring people not to behave like assholes, and deal firmly and promptly with those who for whatever reason decide to transgress.

    Jequ0n probably won't like this link, and no doubt some of the commenters were damaged before they met their abusers, but what about the woman who got a protection order and was followed and murdered by her abuser on the way home frome court?

    https://www.linkedin.com/posts/dr-jessica-taylor-5667351b2_i-bet-every-time-youve-victim-blamed-a-woman-activity-7217444350710968320-ZJEx



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 56,525 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    Relax. Nobody needs to report anything. I just disagreed with you.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 56,525 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    You’re far too emotional here. We’re all on same team as regards not wanting anyone to be hurt and abused. There is no magic bullet to fix, and there never will be. It’s about collaboration and flexibility and compromise



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,412 ✭✭✭Jequ0n


    I was elaborating why I found cases that involve decades of abuse interesting, and you only picked out one sentence without full context.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,056 ✭✭✭suvigirl


    Yeah, those dumb stoopid B's, picking nasty men. They probably deserve whatever they get, being stupid enough to pick those guys........



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 56,525 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    I’m talking about men who are nasty, dangerous, violent. Not ordinary decent men (who yes, can be all things masculine as well). Educate women on how to avoid scumbags. No amount talking etc will stop nasty men being nasty.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,205 ✭✭✭Ezeoul


    Also, Jequon has openly admitted to manipulating women on this site, on more than one occasion.

    If you're accepting his logic, you're in dangerous territory.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 657 ✭✭✭Babyreignbow


    Or knowing how to report abusers and ways to get away. There's no one size fits all but education about what makes a healthy relationship can be an ongoing process. Many people are 'locked in' in situations and more than just a case of being worn down or giving in there are all the elements of coercive control, so a woman may fear that her children will be taken from her or she might be financially abused (as is the case in this situation where she was only provided for when she became his sex slave essentially).

    There's just too many variables to mention in one post but every case is different. Blaming a woman for not being able to get out of an abusive situation is a bit simplified and lacks any qualified understanding of how domestic abuse occurs. It was legal to rape your wife in Ireland 30 years ago.

    Use your mighty arms to slay the fierce enemy that is selfish desire




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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 56,525 ✭✭✭✭walshb


    I wasn’t aware of this. I never said I accepted his logic. I simply said he has made some cogent and rational points. Plenty times I have disagreed with him. You can also disagree with someone and think they are talking sense and making good points. Without jumping on the victim-blaming nonsense. You’re reading too much into this.



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