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No parking in estates for non residents

  • 19-07-2024 3:02pm
    #1
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,276 ✭✭✭


    Was passing Inchagoill Road recently and noticed a sign on a house wall saying No Parking Residents Only.

    I can imagine this being an issue for the residents what with the hospital and town so walkable from there. Does anyone know of other such signs around the city?



Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 812 ✭✭✭CreadanLady


    Is it a private estate i.e roads are not taken in charge by the council?

    If not taken in charge then it's not enforceable by traffic warden or Gardai.

    Even if a private estate have a rule of no non resident parking, then unless they have the likes of apcoa in to enforce it, it's meaningless.

    The MFV Creadan Lady is a mussel dredger from Dunmore East.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 78,580 ✭✭✭✭Victor


    Half of the housing estates in Galway City were never taken in charge by Galway City Council and hence are not public roads. Expect parking restrictions.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,276 ✭✭✭bobbyss


    I don't know if it is a private estate or not. I would imagine it is as it has been there for a mighty long time.

    But just to be clear. What specifically does 'taken in charge' mean?

    Who would put up such a notice? The Residents' Association? I am surprised that more estates have no such sign up if it would be beneficial for residents.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,292 ✭✭✭✭Mrs OBumble


    If an estate has not been taken in charge, then it's the Management Company who put up such signs - abd yes they are in a few estates in the east of the city. Some are enforced by Apcoa or similar.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,718 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    One of two things happen when a new estate of homes is built.

    1. The City or County Council takes them "in charge", which means every item is finished to code by the builder and then the maintenance and overheads such as grass cutting, street lighting and parking control, become a matter for said Council

    OR

    2. The estate is NOT taken over by the Council, but is managed by the residents, the owners among which, are shareholders in an Owner Management Company under the Multi Unit Development Act. The builder may also remain represented on this OMC for a number of years.

    In the former case, the roads are public, and can be parked on by any person, subject to the usual restrictions and due care.

    In the latter case, the OMC may do whatever it wishes to control parking in the estate, such as issuing residents permits and clamping or towing anyone who is not there by permission of a resident or agent.

    They do not have to post a sign saying that the estate is not in charge, and many public estates do chance their arm and erect "residents parking only" signs, which have zero validity.

    Finding out which sort of estate it is, is entirely up to you.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,748 ✭✭✭kabakuyu


    I've seen them near ATU,students/staff had invaded local estates due to shortage of parking at ATU and some wouldn't pay the 10e annual fee for extra parking at galwegians ground.Driveways were blocked and larger vehicles couldn't access some areas.

    IIRC the council put down single yellow lines and parking signage in some areas.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 78,580 ✭✭✭✭Victor


    Substantially, but not quite.

    Councils often refuse to take green areas in charge and / or refuse to pay for their maintenance. They may arrange maintenance if the residents pay for it.

    In some places, they will take the roads, etc. in charge, but not the parking spaces.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 28,039 ✭✭✭✭zell12


    City centre

    Salthill



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,718 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    Older streets like these are generally "in charge" of the Council.

    But to be certain, a phone call to the Roads Maintenance Office of whatever Council area you are in will answer the question for you.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 673 ✭✭✭csirl


    Council may also have a parking permit system where only residents can apply for a permit.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,161 ✭✭✭what_traffic


    Pretty sure this ONLY occurs where P&D is in place.

    We should really have 'Residents Only car parking' streets like is common in many European City's.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,276 ✭✭✭bobbyss


    Let's say a new estate is completed and all houses are occupied for the last 12 months.

    When does the council take it over?

    Could estates be 20-30 years old before they are taken in charge? (Why does it take them such a long time to do that?)

    Who is responsible for pot holes and the like before they are?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 274 ✭✭Magilla Gorilla


    The council will only take an estate in charge when requested to do so. Until then, it’s the developer’s to maintain. It won’t be taken in charge until all aspects are up to standard, which is why you often see footpath repairs or similar in older estates etc. There is no time limit, some estates are never taken in charge.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,292 ✭✭✭✭Mrs OBumble


    Who is responsible for pot holes and the like before they are?

    The owners, ie the management company.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 78,580 ✭✭✭✭Victor


    Many housing estates don't have a management company and the developer went bust a long time ago.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,718 ✭✭✭Former Former Former


    I’d be willing to bet it was an individual resident fed up with randomers taking parking spaces that he considers “his”.

    As such, no legal weight and no consequences for ignoring



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,276 ✭✭✭bobbyss


    I see.

    What does the developer/owner/ management company maintain exactly?

    Maintaining the green areas? (Yet I know of residents and not the owner having to pitch in to get grass cut) The lighting -if there is an issue with it?

    Why wouldn't same company want to hand estate over (and accompanying costs of maintenance) as soon as possible?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 274 ✭✭Magilla Gorilla


    In my council (former employee), typically taking in charge referred to roads and services only. This meant roads, footpaths, water and sewer pipes and street lighting. Whilst the green areas also transferred, in reality it was left up to the residents to maintain them and the council might give a small grant to assist.
    Usually any delays related to the the estate not being finished to the required standards i.e. no council is going to take on a basket case development with problems.
    Aldo, developers might be charging management fees which it might suit them to retain.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,398 ✭✭✭inisboffin


    So in a council-held estate, where people park on the pavement all the time (which is technically breaking the law, right?) can residents then ring the council to have the car ticketed? There's common sense right (where it is safer to partially park on a path so vehicle can pass on a very narrow road) but there's downright gobsh*tery where people block the path entirely so no wheelchair, walker, stroller can pass without being forced on a road, usually where there is no ramp.

    And nobody owns the space in front of their house, but when neighbours constantly take parking space when they have space in front of their own, it's fairly annoying when you have visitors. If they block you getting out of a driveway it is illegal though.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 30,282 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    It depends on the Council policy and the ownership of the estate common areas. DLR parking wardens will only deal with paid parking infringements and won't deal with safety issues like this.

    Any pavement parking is dangerous for pedestrians including people with visual impairments. It's far from common sense.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,398 ✭✭✭inisboffin


    I don't agree with pavement parking, but in some small streets and estates in Galway, it's the difference between access or no access for emergency vehicles if there's fully compliant cars parked on both sides of the road! The streets were not designed with larger cars in mind.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 30,282 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    No, it's the difference between using public space outside your front door to store your private property or finding safe and legal parking nearby.

    The problem here is the assumption that people are entitled to take public space outside their front door for storage of private property.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,222 ✭✭✭Tow


    They ring the Garda who will arrive and ticked all the cars parked on the footpath.

    When is the money (including lost growth) Michael Noonan took in the Pension Levy going to be paid back?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 30,282 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,276 ✭✭✭bobbyss


    It's good to hear from someone with experience in an actual council.

    What specific management fees are we talking about?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,222 ✭✭✭Tow


    I have seen it several times but years apart outside my house.

    When is the money (including lost growth) Michael Noonan took in the Pension Levy going to be paid back?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 274 ✭✭Magilla Gorilla


    Not an expert on this, but management fees would normally be billed for upkeep of common areas. So roads, paths, lights, block insurance if applicable etc. Owners of individual properties are responsible for upkeep of their own properties otherwise.
    The risk is say a major sewer leak or problem- if not in charge, the owners are responsible for repairs etc. The council/Irish Water have no liability.
    Edited to add, if the developer is gone AWOL or not interested, the owners are stuck with the problem. It happens.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,276 ✭✭✭bobbyss


    Thanks and I appreciate you not being an expert on this. I am just posing questions to get to the heart of the matter.

    So a resident would get a bill from the management company of an estate for the upkeep of the roads, paths and lights? What upkeep is involved in that? Roads, paths and street lights don't get damaged very often in an estate nor need frequent repair. I can't see much of an income for a company coming from that source. The common areas include the green yet it's usually the residents who pay for that item.

    Thanks again.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 78,580 ✭✭✭✭Victor


    While such things don't necessarily need constant care, over a period of years the costs do add up. For example, light bulbs blow. Traditionally, it was cheaper to systematically replace all the light bulbs on a street every X years, as call-out charges every time a single bulb blew were disproportionate. However, modern LEDs last much longer, so the economics will have changed.

    Meanwhile, roads and paths occasionally suffer from potholes, subsidence, etc. and drainage gets blocked.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,292 ✭✭✭✭Mrs OBumble


    Not residents.

    Owners, ie members of the management company, are required to pay the fees that are levied by the company.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 274 ✭✭Magilla Gorilla


    As above. Typically fees are levied in apartment type developments rather than housing estates, but I’m just pointing out that the developers retain ownership and can bill owners, subject to the small print being in order. There are still a lot of neglected estates all over the country where developers have walked away and there is no one taking responsibility for the common areas. Again, not a problem until something goes wrong.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,276 ✭✭✭bobbyss


    Thank you.

    To be clear. A building company (eg John Doe & Sons) builds an estate of lets say 30 houses. All the houses have been bought and the owners are either living in them or have them rented out. But they are all occupied. All the roads, lights sewage etc -all done. The owners/occupiers of the houses pitch together (usually through a residents' association) to pay for grass cutting. That's the only bill the people would have to pay surely?

    I used to live in an estate and that's the only time I had to pay for anything-and some houses did not even pitch in for the grass cutting. It was a new estate so no road, light or sewage issues whatsoever. So I don't know how it could be in a builders interest not to hand the estate over to the council

    Where does a management company enter the scene? Who is the management company? John Does & Sons?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,718 ✭✭✭Former Former Former


    if the OP just posts a picture of the sign, it will be immediately apparent what the situation is.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,276 ✭✭✭bobbyss


    Yes indeed you are right.

    Apartment life is different. From my experience of that , yes there was a management company which looked after the green areas, the parking lot, the painting of apartments exteriors and stairwells, the upkeep of the place in general, maybe security cameras too if I am not mistaken. Insurance also I think. It acted like a residents' association who you could contact about non residents parking in your slot and so on. A yearly fee was applicable.

    But all of that does not apply in a typical housing estate. Thanks for your input.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,276 ✭✭✭bobbyss


    That's not possible I am afraid but it's exactly the same kind of sign that someone posted in the first picture of post number 9.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,718 ✭✭✭Former Former Former


    Ah yes, that is 100% an unofficial sign put by a resident on his own steam and can be completely ignored



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,707 ✭✭✭blackbox


    It's a pretty sh***y practice to use a housing estate as your work car park, even if it's legal.

    Employers claim to be being "green" and encouraging the use of public transport by not providing enough parking spaces.

    This BS leads to the problem of parking in housing estates.

    Post edited by blackbox on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,106 ✭✭✭✭elperello


    There is increasing pressure on car parking spaces in estates these days.

    Between houses rented out to multiple occupants and children living at home more than in the past there are often not enough spaces.

    If you add to that inconsiderate people parking to go to nearby businesses or suchlike it's easy to see why residents might get frustrated.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,398 ✭✭✭inisboffin


    I don't disagree with anything you say here. But it needs a big shift in social norms. Not only 'The Authorities' have the opinion of your graphic, but the majority of neighbours. And you are right, nobody gives a s**t when you ring the guards to complain. There is no other safe and legal parking nearby in some cases, so people sometimes choose between blocking the road or blocking the path. Is it right, nope, but just saying that's why people do it, weird social norm that it's become.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 30,282 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    Fully agree. I suppose it depends on your definition of 'nearby'. There's always parking available, it's just a matter of how far away you're going to have to go.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,398 ✭✭✭inisboffin


    Definitely a neighbour who doesn't "quite have a "Blue Badge" (he's from the North LOL!) but it's tiring for him to walk a half mile to park. And he's one of the most considerate of the 'wild parkers'.



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