Tesla Talk

No, you didn’t upset me at all. I think you are very odd though.

I was hoping posting a link about Tesla’s sales contracting would prompt some discussion about their share price and future plans, but no. We are on about rav4s being thirsty. Again, you seem to debase every thread you comment on.

Tesla’s sales are the more interesting and on topic issue here. It seems like a company that the walls are closing in on it.

You might find some Tesla share price discussion over at

I think you should go back to posting memes with foul language.

Blast you anyway, I've got that song in my head now🤣

^^^ it’s this stuff directed to me and others that don’t agree with you that’s problematic. Anyway, trying to steer back, I just do think it’s a pity Tesla seem to be going down the path they are. All the cool news about gigacasting, new cells, and engineering breakthroughs are being replaced by silly robotaxi stuff and getting rid of wipe stalks and it actually is sad to see a very conservative car like an elderly model rav overtaking Tesla rather than constant new stuff.

One possible reason (and I'd give it a lot of weight) the MY has been overtaken by the RAV4 is that it has a lot more competition in the EV market. Only this week a report came out showing Tesla's EV market share in the US dipped below 50% for the first time. While EV sales are below forecast, American, European and Asian manufacturers have seen strong sales in their EV's which has eaten into Tesla market share.

FTR Q1 broke the US record for the most EV's sold in a quarter.

A bit of an extreme view to say "game over". Everyone can, and should, have a view but not all views align. The collective "views" are best expressed by the market reflecting the sum of all views and in the last month Tesla share price is up 45% (last 3 months something similar). Am purposely choosing comparative periods to align with the stats that you circulated re Toyoto. So I guess the view you expressed is not commonly held.

The Model Y (which is due a refresh) was the worlds best selling car for 2023. One swallow doesn't make a summer!

The robotaxi is sounding more and more like vapourware. It would seem self driving is an irresolvable conundrum, so it’s hard to see how they can leverage a second product on top of it.

They're operating in a very limited area afaik. And only Waymo are being allowed to continue after a very tragic incident involving Cruise robotaxis. And Waymo recalled all their robotaxis for the second time in June after one of them hit a telephone pole.

So they may work in cities and other closed areas but the problems seem to still pop up even in these limited tests.

Fair enough. Teslas L2 Vs waymo's L4. Tesla must be betting heavily on AI and making advantage of data all of their cars on the road. Yep, risky, yep, hype. Let them at it, better than not making any progress.

Truth to be told, if it wasn't for Tesla we would all be still he driving Passats and listening to radio debates on diesel Vs CNG Vs chipper-waste etc

its looking like ev is in trouble, with many countries now experiencing a fall off in up take, some significantly so, yes its been great to see companies such as tesla enter the market, giving traditional companies a run for it, but it also seems many of these companies are now quickly catching up with tesla. we may have jumped the gun here, and we ve seriously underestimated how critical support infrastructure is for ev's, chargers etc, and have been completely unable to provide it, its gonna take a miracle to move us off ice towards alternatives…..

im aware of this, but this completely pales in comparison to traditional fuel pumps, effectively, its too little too late, the vast majority simply arent changing, and probably wont until certain conditions occur, mainly, when we re forced to change when ice cars simply become too difficult to source. theres too much uncertainty surrounding ev's, charge time, range, battery life, resale value etc etc, this is simply too much for many drivers, so we re just defaulting to what we know, i.e ice, and thats the way its gonna stay until…..

Comparison with fuel pumps is not in any way valid since 90% of charging is done at home. And there are still an estimated 1.5 million+ homes that can install chargers which is 1.425 million more than the current EV fleet.

And how is charge time uncertain? It's very simple maths. A 150kW charger is going to charge 50kWh in a third of an hour or 20 minutes. People put their phones on charge and know how long it's going to take. It's not hard.

Battery life is much less of an unknown now since the technology is mature and improving all the time. I'll grant resale value is all over the place due to factors that (in the main) have less to do with EVs and more to do with the post Covid shortages and manufacturers getting greedy and then dropping prices to encourage demand. The same uncertainty will hit ICE cars in the not too distant future as manufacturers stop bringing new models to the market. Audi have stated that this (for them) will be as early as 2026.

…take a look at ev purchasing figures, and not just from ireland, theres clearly a falling trend with ev's, we have failed to convince the public to change over, and its completely understandable why, due to the uncertainties it presents, manufacturers will continue to create ice cars for sometime, therefore purchasers know that resale values will remain reasonable, therefore supports will remain in place as long as this dynamic remains…..

…im actually all for ev's, i think many look stunning, including most teslas, and the tech is impressive, and the rate of advancement in the tech has been incredible, but……

…again, its the overall uncertainties with ev's thats actually preventing significant change over, yes theres enormous 'potential', but only a relative small proportion of drivers have actually truly changed, with now some even changing back to ice

…again, yes, there will be another surge in ev when manufactures end ice production, but that actually wont be for some time, so that probably wont occur well into next decade, or beyond, by that stage many of the issues with ev's presented will be ironed out, so the ev market more than likely will remain fairly stagnant for a few years

i take great offence to that, again, many ev's are truly stunning, filled with great advancement in technology, i spend a lot of my time around people that are extremely environmentally aware, and have been their whole lives, this actually includes myself, ive actually studied environmental matters for some time at third level, most of these individuals have not converted to ev, most have very little intention of, i.e. theres a serious problem in regards conversion…..

…policy makers also dont seem to understand why people are not converting, their projections of conversion are not realistic, they are unable to understand why, i.e. there is a significant disconnect on why so…..

Thinking of getting this for my Tesla. Slots into the cup holder. Only 31 euro. Stops the car being boring to drive...5 stars..

has there ever been a brand new car the price of an M3 that so many owners want to give the Halfords/China treatment to right from delivery?

I can’t think of any.

It usually happens with the 3rd or 4th owner or whatever - cheap cars. I’ve never seen happen with a brand new €40-60k car before, and let’s face it the Tesla doesn’t need fake speed stuff, and the standard spec is already fantastic.

Yep - common enough in Asia to accessorize your ride from the go-get. Just look on Aliexpress to see what you can for the likes of the Asian brands.

4680 cells giving trouble. headline is clickbaity but scaling production is obviously challenging.

https://electrek.co/2024/07/17/elon-musk-might-give-up-tesla-4680-battery-cell-end-of-the-year/

even in China self-driving is taking time.

https://carnewschina.com/2024/07/18/robotaxis-make-friends-and-enemies-on-the-streets-of-wuhan/

the fares of the self-driving taxis is attractive though.

economics in China of self-driving taxis aren't looking great. this report and the comments suggest it is a low profit business unless someone corners the market and can prevent competition.

https://cleantechnica.com/2024/07/18/will-baidu-apollo-be-the-1st-profitable-robotaxi-service/

Elon appears to have got bored of being in Automotive industry which is capital intensive and low margin. He'd prefer to re-position Tesla as a Tech Company where retail Investors can over*estimate the future value of the company.

A fleet manager for a blue chip company was invited to talk to employees of our company about their sustainable goals with regard to fleet management.

They refuse to supply Tesla cars to employees of their company as the aftersales is lacking and sales strategy of dictating when cars are delivered along with yo-yo pricing make it impossible for the fleet to manage their risks.

Our company don't supply Tesla either for similar reasons.