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HEO post HAS to go lateral before panel?

  • 24-07-2024 8:36pm
    #1
    BlueTaba
    Registered Users Posts: 21 ✭


    Hi,

    Does anyone know the details of the union agreement that any heo post that becomes available outside Dublin HAS to be advertised laterally and not be offered to anyone on a internal promotion panel? Last 2 positions in my department went lateral. There may be another coming up soon but again it will be going lateral rather than the panel. Feels like unless I'm willing to travel to Dublin on promotion then I'm effectively blocked from ever moving up.

    Many thanks to anyone able to shed light on the logic of this



Comments

  • #2
    dat6
    Registered Users Posts: 45 ✭dat6


    When you say lateral, are you referring that the last two roles went to internal transfers/mobility?



  • #3
    BlueTaba
    Registered Users Posts: 21 ✭BlueTaba


    Yes, last 2 HEOs were advertised laterally internally within the department and filled this way.



  • #4
    doc22
    Registered Users Posts: 889 ✭✭✭doc22


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122422882#Comment_122422882

    Whole department or to other HEOs in region, mobility SHOULD mean that vacancies would be advertised to all HEOs in civil service………….



  • #5
    BlueTaba
    Registered Users Posts: 21 ✭BlueTaba


    But it's not mobility. The department advertise them within the department only on a lateral transfer basis. Only if no one applies would the department then offer to the next panelist on the internal heo promotion panel. Because its such a popular location, the union agreement has effectively blocked anyone from being promoted unless they take a position in Dublin then go lateral if a post becomes vacant.



  • #6
    doc22
    Registered Users Posts: 889 ✭✭✭doc22


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122423101#Comment_122423101

    The department would still owe mobility and inter places too, perhaps using dublin for these. I taking that the location is relatively close to Dublin and a smallish department



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  • #7
    BlueTaba
    Registered Users Posts: 21 ✭BlueTaba


    Are you familiar with the union agreement to which HR are referring to? That's what I'm trying to establish, see what the agreement actually is.



  • #8
    doc22
    Registered Users Posts: 889 ✭✭✭doc22


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122425700#Comment_122425700

    No, an agreement like that wouldn't be standard but I'm aware of location specific agreements were staff served there time in one specfic location before transfering to another location within the same dep (ahead of other candidates).I'm guessing internal promotions can be filled by however the department likes. You'd need to contact your union to see details and/or raise concerns



  • #9
    Kirbi
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 194 ✭✭Kirbi


    If it's the civil service, this could relate to the appointment sequence agreed under the Conciliation and Arbitration arrangements.

    I can't get onto it from my phone, but I'm pretty sure the mobility documents specify the sequenceing agreement for the relevant grade - either the document for HEO terms and conditions or the FAQ.

    Essentially, the sequence arrangements ensure that in general, each civil service organisation is making appointments through all of the relevant mechanisms (internal transfer, internal promotion, Inter/D promotion - and open competition for non-HEO grades).

    The sequences are applied nationally, so abiding by it can involve different approaches in different areas. For example, if there are no eligible people left on a mobility panels for Dublin, they may have to rely on promotion competitions to fill vacancies there; at the same time, other areas may have more appointments from mobility (or other transfer mechanisms), so that the organisation is still abiding by the sequence as best they can.



  • #10
    BlueTaba
    Registered Users Posts: 21 ✭BlueTaba


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122425756#Comment_122425756

    Hi doc22, thanks very much for replying back to me. Probably best thing I can do will be to contact the union, see if I can get a definite answer from them.



  • #11
    BlueTaba
    Registered Users Posts: 21 ✭BlueTaba


    Hi Kirbi, wow, that is a very informative answer! Yes, it's civil service and the heo has ALWAYS gone to internal transfer so it means that I'll never be promoted in my home department unless I take a post in Dublin which I can't! Would you have access to that agreement you refer to? Where could I get hold of it in relation to the heo? I would love to see it in writing!!



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  • #12
    Kirbi
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 194 ✭✭Kirbi


    I've never seen the original documentation (although it could be in the General Council Reports on circulars.gov.ie).

    The mobility documents are the place I've seen the arrangement referenced in writing.



  • #13
    BlueTaba
    Registered Users Posts: 21 ✭BlueTaba


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122426816#Comment_122426816

    Hi Kirbi,

    Once again thank you very much for taking the time to reply. I'll contact Forsa to get official clarification as to the sequence.



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