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The future of RTE after Tubsgate.

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 603 ✭✭✭Shan Doras


    It's also highly questionable that the TV licence collection has never been put out to tender, An Post getting a Tenner from every licence looks like appalling value for money, Richard Bruton flew a kite about putting it out to tender when he was the Minister in the previous government but it was never spoken about again, it's likely that there was very strong resistance from postmasters about any change



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 37,946 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    RTE has long been at the mercy of government regarding the level the licence fee is set at (and because it's long been a politically toxic subject, it's been frozen for years) so direct exchequer funding doesn't really change the picture all that much.

    Huge levels of backdoor taxpayer funding with ads (20% of which are incomprensible to nearly all of the people paying for them), this government is just kicking the can down the road.

    What's really needed IMHO is a much downsized RTE as a pure PSB with no advertising, so no conflict of interest between PSB and commercial interests. Sell off RTE2 and 2FM as they serve no PSB purpose.

    I'm partial to your abracadabra,

    I'm raptured by the joy of it all.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,777 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    It doesn't have to have no advertising, but it should be greatly downsized.

    Close 2FM, sell-off Lyric FM, cut any remaining links with RnaG and TnaG, as they are better run on their own anyway.

    I'd also consider closing RTÉ2 TV and investing much more in streaming and online content, such that RTÉ could attract PPV for some of the big global sporting contests that aren't FTA. and also offer new movies to TV and increased homemade movie and TV commissions, like Film4 and BBC Drama do



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,500 ✭✭✭RoTelly


    It was frozen largely because the first minister after Ryan decided he couldn't increase it, then it end up that none would increase.

    Also the government moved some of the licence fee over to TG4 in their final budget in 2011 this lasted until 2018, something few people are aware of, and should have been questioned by both RTÉ and TG4 in 2011, the BAI as regulator should have also been asking question about this cut to TG4 and it being filled by the licence fee. Yet it all seemed to not be up for discussion. I don't understand how under the act the Department could make that decision.

    From 1996 up to 2011 there had been steady increases, why they stopped it during the down turn makes little sense. It seems that the only increase available was a €2 increase, rather then smaller increases, 10c on year 25c another and so on.

    From 2018 the government made some moves, TG4 portion of the licence fee was return to RTÉ with it funding being brought back to 2010 levels from the exchequer, RTÉ was given an extra 10m in funding from the government between 2020 and 2024, RTÉ's music groups except the CO were moved to the NCH in 2023 (a year late) and much of that saving when to RTÉ ONE.

    I don't believe RTÉ and TG4 will not continue to ask for more money year on year.

    I don't believe that removing ads or selling RTÉ2 or 2FM will help. Advertising would move out of the country, failing to help local Irish media. (Certainly TVs share of the ad revenue would move across to UK opt-outs and not to VMTV, which itself is just an opt-out at this point). While RTÉ2 and 2FM have been massively neglected by RTÉ and are worth little at this point.

    Regardless of the funding model RTÉ was badly mismanaged, I'd argue that much of what was happening under Dee Forbes tenure was happening during her predecessors tenures also. RTÉ allowed their own buildings not to maintained, this has little to do with the commercial aspects of RTÉ.

    What would you save by closing down 2FM and RTÉ2 as broadcast services? 2FM's budget should be cut back. Are you not just bring them back to the GAA GO controversy? How much would RTÉ earn from PPV?

    RTÉ have failed on Drama and Film commission, their Head of Drama is the Acting Head of Drama.


    ______

    Just one more thing .... when did they return that car

    Yesterday



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,500 ✭✭✭RoTelly


    So that is it done and dusted.

    Licence fee to remain for the next few year (I assume to help An Post more than RTÉ), and slowly they amount of the Top Up becomes the main fund for the RTÉ.

    They use the excuse pop growing older and new devices for this change, but you could still have a fee that is not related to the equipment in your house or that could be added on to a current bill.

    I look forward to the increased production and the high quality shows to come in the next few years.

    Don't mention the Mismanagement of RTÉ, forget about it, they were under pressure.


    ______

    Just one more thing .... when did they return that car

    Yesterday



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 812 ✭✭✭Mickey Mike


    There should be NO selling off RTE2 or 2FM, it would no longer be RTE, we will be back in the days of Telefis Eireann and Radio Eireann.

    I'd be more inclined to get rid of RTE Jr and RTE News, all the important stuff can be packed into the two main channels instead of repeats, like the rubbish we see on VM.

    As for radio, 2fm it can be the modern and oldies music station, get rid of RTE Gold along with the rest of them, and finally put RTE Lyric online. Now there's a tidy RTE for you.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,500 ✭✭✭RoTelly


    I would not be for selling either RTÉ2 or 2FM, but in fairness to anyone suggesting this, can you show how RTÉ have developed either over the last 10 years. I'd argue that both should have seen cuts to funding in line with the cuts that RTÉ saw. Instead RTÉ still seem to think think 2FM is important for that Yuff connection.


    ______

    Just one more thing .... when did they return that car

    Yesterday



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 623 ✭✭✭TAFKAlawhec


    There's little value today in suggesting the privatisation of RTÉ 2 TV - 20+ years ago in a somewhat analogue world (with its scarcity of available frequencies albeit with fledgling digital services), selling off the channel would probably have had international buyers lining up with a ready terrestrial network set to be available from day one, but today the only thing going for it is an LCN of 2 or 102 and that's it - anyone seriously thinking of setting up a new TV channel to broadcast in at least terrestrial form just has to approach Saorview these days to hammer out costs for capacity. Not to mention that RTÉ 2's primacy on Saorview will be limited to homes that are viewing the platform and nothing else, which is a small percentage of viewers these days. Besides, no one of note is looking at launching a new TV channel aimed at broad Irish audiences other than possibly the Virgin Media group, in an era where television viewing is slowly becoming delinearised. It would simply be far better to take the channel in as part of a larger overhaul of RTÉ's TV output IMO.

    2FM is a slightly different kettle of fish - it has a national FM network and could be of interest to a broadcaster looking to break into the national Irish radio market given the scarcity of available national frequencies (essentially 6.5 networks - four RTÉ stations, Today FM & 0.5 for Newstalk's network) and no sign of being able to expand on this, but there are two issues I see at stake - one being the clear licence conditions such a privatised station would be subject to, (depending on wherever an RTÉ sell off would be enough or wherever RTÉ would have to "surrender" 2FM's broadcasting licence and CnaM would put a licence out to tender - a clone of Today FM isn't likely to fly well for either a new broadcaster or Today FM themselves, for example), while the second being questions over RTÉ's general commitment to broadcasting content to teens & young adults. The majority of PSBs in the EU let alone wider Europe have a full-time station broadcasting either (mostly) popular chart music and/or a station focused on a youth audience and if audience figures are to be believed neither RTÉ Pulse or RTÉ 2XM are adequately filling gaps for such an audience that aren't listening to 2FM. Perhaps a significant refocus is needed for 2FM before any sell off should be seriously suggested, or maybe RTÉ's youth audience would be better served online in a similar way to what the BBC did with BBC Three TV (prior to the channel returning to linear broadcasting)? The only problem I see is that I don't trust RTÉ in its current form to take on such a task that terribly well.



  • Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 12,392 Mod ✭✭✭✭icdg


    Plan is to be announced tomorrow after approval by the Government.

    However we know the general shape. No change to the license fee whatsoever. Some money for the Post Office to improve their collection systems (unlikely to yield significant results). €725m direct exchequer funding over three years to make up the shortfall.

    https://www.rte.ie/news/ireland/2024/0723/1461464-rte-funding-cabinet/



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 37,946 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    That's a shocking amount of taxpayers' money and still no accountability at RTE or credible plans to make it sustainable. RTE is becoming increasingly irrelevant to the audience. It seems the only real plan is to soak the taxpayer more and more as its viewership and commercial income continue to tank.

    I'm partial to your abracadabra,

    I'm raptured by the joy of it all.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,777 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    Yeah, this plan is a mistake. They obviously didn't want to rock the boat too much ahead of the election, so they would have been better off waiting until 2025 to deal with it properly.

    I mean the optics are weak and they are bad. It amounts to 'you're going to keep paying your €160, and we're going to give them €242 million more every year, without any concrete adoption of radical reform and refocusing'.

    I foresee the licence fee compliance going from bad, to catastrophic.

    The people of this generation have seen off Water Charges when as a population they wouldn't stomach them. They know the consequences for mass non-compliance are basically nothing, especially for a charge which will continue not to be connected to Revenue in any way.

    Also I'd say the independent media sector is going to be livid as well. And rightly so.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,982 ✭✭✭✭Loafing Oaf


    €725m direct exchequer funding

    is the €725m not the guaranteed combined licence fee and exchequer funding?

    So if this materialises

    I foresee the licence fee compliance going from bad, to catastrophic.

    The next government will make up whatever the shortfall is. Even if there's mass evasion, it's peanuts in the context of overall public spending…



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,954 ✭✭✭lertsnim


    Tax payer now paying twice for this circus of an organisation.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,181 ✭✭✭Jinglejangle69


    So they get rewarded after the Tuberty fiasco with an even bigger budget!???

    Ah Ireland.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 975 ✭✭✭decor58


    Thats the way it was explained today, e725m for 3 years, made up of licence revenue and state funding making up the shortfall.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,156 ✭✭✭MrMusician18


    Only a fool would pay the license fee now, since the government will come in and top up the fund regardless.

    Those that comply with the law will in effect be double taxed.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,500 ✭✭✭RoTelly


    The idea is that An Post will continue to collect (btw this is the bigger issue for the government), lets say An Post get to 100% the government will only top-up to 255m, the top-up is not actually about those that don't pay it is about not increasing the licence fee to the consumer with the remainder coming from the government. They view it as away of increasing funding to RTÉ without increasing the price of the licence fee.

    I am not sure how this works for the sound and vision fund, it looks to me like RTÉ will now receive 100% of the licence fee. With An Post and CnaM paid out of the exchequre?


    ______

    Just one more thing .... when did they return that car

    Yesterday



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 603 ✭✭✭Shan Doras


    It's a safe bet that the 400 redundancies will never happen



  • Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators Posts: 12,392 Mod ✭✭✭✭icdg


    That’s correct, that was clarified today - the €725m is the total of all public funding for RTE, including the revenue from the TV license plus money already committed in lieu of TV license exemptions.

    €4m direct exchequer funding has been allocated to Sound and Vision, no doubt in any attempt to soften any outcry from the commercial sector.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,010 ✭✭✭✭LambshankRedemption


    The thing I wish one or more presenters or correspondents would point out is this is a tax on a persons already taxed income.

    Double Irish Tax evasion is a method by US multi-nationals to avoid paying corporate tax.

    The license fee is a double Irish tax gouging by our own government.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,265 ✭✭✭✭iamwhoiam


    Catherine Martin was so disappointed with the RTE payment scandal that she rewarded it with €750 million



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 812 ✭✭✭Mickey Mike


    Wouldn't you think part of the licence fee would go to VM for HD carriage on Saorview, its painful to look at it.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,777 ✭✭✭✭Larbre34


    Predictably VM have come out rather annoyed, and make some very valid points.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,500 ✭✭✭RoTelly


    RTÉ will now be in a more dominant position than ever before where it will receive a guaranteed €725m from the taxpayer while continuing to benefit from the largest share of commercial revenue

    If Virgin Media wanted it could invest in public service broadcasting, it is owned by one of Ireland's largest broadband providers, they are making what RTÉ are getting over 3 years in one.

    has no alternative but to review all options including our position with regards to our existing Public Service Broadcasting commitments

    What commitments? Ireland AM, News, The Tonight Show, Champions League, 6 Nations

    25-year record of delivering extensive Public Service content and the 93% of the population that we reach on an annual basis

    What record exactly? They have been given a Licence and part of that licence is news and current affairs, they have a strong audience level, they have no online news service except for what goes out on TV.

    They already do the bare minimum.

    4 TV channels repeating The Chase, Heartbeat and Frost is not PSM, it IMO is less than an ITV opt-out.


    ______

    Just one more thing .... when did they return that car

    Yesterday



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 603 ✭✭✭Shan Doras


    They should F Off and hand back their public service licence, leave saorview and become a cable and sky only channel. I know I wouldn't miss them



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,010 ✭✭✭✭LambshankRedemption


    They get a 10th of what RTE get, and you are surprised their Public Service output is a more than a 10th of RTE's?

    Quelle surprise!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 37,946 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    The only time VMTV enters my consciousness is "ah %$&*, the match is on Virgin Media"

    Legovision ahoy!

    That's bad enough but everything else they do is a waste of electrons. Bad and all as most of RTE's output is, VM have them well beaten in the being rubbish stakes.

    I'm partial to your abracadabra,

    I'm raptured by the joy of it all.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,500 ✭✭✭RoTelly


    I'd have some sympathy but they get about the same as TG4 (if not more) and have access to the Sound and Vision Fund. Some of their productions from that have been 90% supported by the license fee. They've always avoid prime time TV. Over the last year they could have really made a push into some areas that RTÉ cut back on, VMTV's public service is minimal.


    ______

    Just one more thing .... when did they return that car

    Yesterday



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,523 ✭✭✭✭Red Silurian


    This surely goes against EU competition rules, or is that only a thing when the consumer isn't being screwed?



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 603 ✭✭✭Shan Doras


    Speaking of "EU competition rules", It amazes me that the TV licence collection contract doesn't have to be put out to tender under EU competition rules, indeed An post getting a 6 millon euro government handout to "update the database" stinks to high heaven but it's not like any mainstream journalist is going to challenge this, they'll all be hoping to get a government advisor or quango job after the next general election.



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