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Enoch Burke turns up to school again despite sacking - read OP before posting

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    #12242
    Quin_Dub
    Moderators, Politics Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators Posts: 15,546 Mod ✭✭✭✭Quin_Dub


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122428692#Comment_122428692

    It may be at the centre of his dispute , but his actions have meant that that substantive issue has never once been formally addressed.

    He did indeed send some emails and have a meeting with his boss , but what he did not do was lodge a formal grievance which would have initiated a whole process to review the issue and arrive at a conclusion.

    Instead he chose to disrupt the school event and then ignore the formal disciplinary process (which he would have signed up to when he accepted the post) and ended up where we are today.

    Following those emails/meetings he could have chosen open a formal grievance with the Dept. and followed the road there.

    He could even have acknowledged the suspension and disciplinary process that followed and used that formal process to have his position reviewed , but he didn't.

    He simply decided "I'm right , everyone else is wrong, I'm just going to do exactly what I want and that's that".

    Everything that has happened to Enoch Burke is as a direct result of his belligerent refusal to acknowledge the existence of any rules and laws that he does not like.



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    #12243
    aloyisious
    Registered Users Posts: 11,708 ✭✭✭✭aloyisious


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122428712#Comment_122428712

    Agreed on first sentence: His legal issues of his presence at the school are with the courts as he was not complying with court orders to stay away and from the school and inform the court that he would comply with it's orders, in line with his train of thoughts of obedience to a higher edict, as he sees it.

    On the UK court ruling, debate and feedback on the possibility about similar being applied here to solve the problem he created for the teaching profession here with his adherence to a higher authority over the rules used by the profession was why I posted mention of the UK COURT RULING.

    Post edited by aloyisious at


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    #12244
    Ezeoul
    Registered Users Posts: 2,915 ✭✭✭Ezeoul


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122428692#Comment_122428692

    Why didn't Burke kick up a storm the first time he received a request from his employer in relation to a non-binary student?

    Because this child wasn't the first time he'd received such a request. There was a previous one six months earlier in Dec 2021, in relation to a different student, so why didn't he kick off then?

    He planned this. His actions in June 2022 at the school's public event was deliberate. He knew what he was doing.

    At this point, three different high court justices have made it clear this case has to do with Burke's behaviour, and has nothing to do with transgender or use of pronouns.

    And all this, including the case of the UK teacher - who made a target of a student and misgendered them deliberately and in the classroom in front of other students - has been covered in the thread, multiple times.

    Even I'm getting bored repeating it now.



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    #12245
    aloyisious
    Registered Users Posts: 11,708 ✭✭✭✭aloyisious


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122428751#Comment_122428751

    Oh yes. It seems all he did and has done has [allegedly] been in line with what he apparently sees as an obligation to a non-human edict. Render unto God etc etc….



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    #12246
    aloyisious
    Registered Users Posts: 11,708 ✭✭✭✭aloyisious


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122428779#Comment_122428779

    Yeah, the court report mentioned that he didn't voice opposition in the case of the first instance when a similar request was made to the teachers there. He picks and chooses which argument approach he will use as things accelerate.

    Edit: I hadn't known the UK teacher case was discussed before - as in the same way that the Burke saga has been - thought it was only finalized and mentioned in the papers over the past few days.

    Post edited by aloyisious at


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    #12247
    CatFromHue
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 18,159 Mod ✭✭✭✭CatFromHue


    What you're doing here is trying to find reason in the situation but you're forgetting you're dealing with a very unreasonable person.

    There are many far better ways Enoch could have handled this, one's where he could have actually won his case. Instead he chose one of maximum aggression and unreasonableness which leaves him with no chance of winning his case.

    Post edited by CatFromHue at


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    #12248
    Morris Garren
    Registered Users Posts: 547 ✭✭✭Morris Garren


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122428712#Comment_122428712

    That is a very good way of putting things— teaching young people, along with so many other people-centred jobs and societal roles, involves surrendering some small elements of your own personal preferences and choices so as to allow for 'reasonable' interaction and ultimately for the work to get done. This can be annoying and frustrating at times but its necessary to avoid a chaotic workplace/society where everyone thinks they can have everything their own way, and no other. I think it's reasonable to consider the issue of pronouns and gender identity these days, frustrating or silly as it might sound to some, without losing your sh1t in public and attacking your boss and protesting like a loon in the corridor. No proper teacher shoul behave that way. Thus, it's the school leadership, the School Board and Dept protocols/circulars that determine how a school is run/managed, not individuals with personal convictions and exhortations to an Almighty God etc etc,

    Enoch and his family are utterly unreasonable and intransigent religious fanatics and their behaviour, never mind their beliefs, is what has them in these situations. And as a parent, I would not want these utterly unreasonable and intransigent individuals teaching my children.



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    #12249
    Ezeoul
    Registered Users Posts: 2,915 ✭✭✭Ezeoul


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122428813#Comment_122428813

    The case of the UK teacher(s) were known, and discussed here previously - but in fairness, it is a very long ongoing thread at this stage.

    But no stone has been left unturned!

    (edit) there have been two cases of UK teachers - in the case of Joshua Sutcliffe, he was sacked again, from another school, before now being struck off.

    (edit) the other UK teacher was Kevin Lister.



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    #12250
    hoodie6029
    Registered Users Posts: 3,892 ✭✭✭hoodie6029


    30 new posts! What mischief have the Burkes gotten up to now?
    Oh, this BS ‘he is being persecuted for this anti-trans beliefs’ again….

    Stop engaging with posters who bring it up. Report it and move on.

    Post edited by hoodie6029 at

    The road to Hell is paved with good intentions.



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    #12251
    Frank Bullitt
    Registered Users Posts: 11,608 ✭✭✭✭Frank Bullitt


    Thought he had done something daft again.

    Nope, just someone thinking it was over pronouns and not his actions…again.



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    #12252
    Jim2007
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators Posts: 10,295 Mod ✭✭✭✭Jim2007


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122427757#Comment_122427757

    At this stage it's late in the game and pretty much everyone here understands the legal issues, so to save us time explain how this relates to contempt of court….



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    #12253
    Ezeoul
    Registered Users Posts: 2,915 ✭✭✭Ezeoul


    Well, in fairness, I think that the fact that Joshua Sutcliffe has lost his appeal and been struck of as a teacher in the UK is topical, even if it isn't Burke specific.

    https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cl4ypx26zxxo

    Mr Sutcliffe’s lawyers argued the Teaching Regulation Agency’s (TRA) order was an “unjustified interference” with his rights of freedom of speech and religion.

    But Mr Justice Pepperall said there was “no merit” in the argument that his human rights had been interfered with.

    The judge said Mr Sutcliffe failed to “understand or accept the harm that he caused vulnerable children in his class”.

    He said Mr Sutcliffe did not accept "that his right to manifest and express his religious convictions might have to be balanced against his professional duties to treat children with dignity and respect and to safeguard their wellbeing".

    The Burkes might want to take note.

    Post edited by Ezeoul at


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    #12254
    aloyisious
    Registered Users Posts: 11,708 ✭✭✭✭aloyisious


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122429920#Comment_122429920

    Having read the UK news report about the case there, I approached Burke's behaviour at the school here prior to any civil court proceedings here against him in comparison to the approach taken in the UK by the UK teacher licencing authority there that if we had such a Govt section or quango here in charge of issuing licences to teachers that it might have been possible to do so here with Burke. I am not finding fault with officialdom here as all the action was initiated by the Burkes, with others having to react to their activities.

    The UK Court merely [AFAIK] ruled on the issue of the legality of the withdrawal of the UK TEACHERS licence after he appealed against the authority taking action against him over his behaviour at the UK school he had been employed at. Things were handled differently there and never got to the level of court action here with Burke and his family, a much more sensible approach to reining in a loose cannon.



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