Road Deaths due to Lawlessness

Id say just driving like lunatics is 90%.

It's not 90% . It's a significant factor but 90% of deaths are not due to lunatic driving

Ah Mrs O'bumble has joined the thread

Whats your own opinion or are u focussing on the headline crashes which are often due to recklessness

The poster said "driving like lunatics" which is a strong term

seeing Garda traffic or road policing is a seriously rare occurrence.

Loads more cars and vehicles in general yet…..

https://www.irishtimes.com/crime-law/2024/05/16/numbers-in-garda-roads-policing-units-falls-to-lowest-level-since-2017-says-drew-harris/

Sooooooo, vehicular road use is increasing, but the policing of them decreasing…. Such a great country.

I thought there was supposed to be an uptick since the 30minute thing came in

And what's the point in Judges giving out driving bans? Sure they are just ignored by these lads.

Which is why we need Gardaí to proactively go around to their house or usual haunts and see if there is a car there.

Almost like neutering the police force has consequences isnt it ,

Perhaps, but that at least will inconvenience them. The guards should swing by on a windy night with sleet.

I honestly think that shouldn't have to happen

If these people have previous they shouldn't be out...the guards shouldn't have to be running around checking up on them because they shouldn't be at liberty in the first place....maybe tagged but with severe actual consequences if they remove the tag or cheat that system ....

Ah Drew Harris… the man who is helping Helen ruin AGS. There was a traffic corps. They concentrated on traffic stuff much to the annoyance of the general populace who like to consistently break road traffic laws. Then the numbers in AGS started dropping. So Harris though a massively expensive renaming/rebranding of the traffic corps to the Roads Policing Unit, and this was so he could tell the life long traffic lads that they now HAVE to do non-traffic calls. And now the traffic situation is as bad as it is, there's even less Gardai and Harris thinks getting the regular units to do the traffic stuff while the RPU do… not traffic…

Here's the thing though. Most people would not be happy to see AGS increase their traffic patrols. Because they won't just be catching the scumbags. They'll be catching the 70%+ of ye who are bad drivers. The ones who speed, regardless of how much over it is. The ones who don't indicate. The ones who can't use roundabouts. What people want is a traffic corp that only targets scumbags but leaves off the general Joe Soap for making "small" mistakes. No. That's not how it works.

And we need stronger enforcement of traffic laws in general. The level of driver competence is shockingly low. But it's not just that, it's the confidence these useless fvcks have while driving is the worst part. They're so confident that they're driving is not bad, that they get thick at you for rightfully blowing them out of it. Add to that that we now have L/N drivers in massive crossover vehicles that they can't properly control. We need these people off the road too. I can't understand people being ok with bad drivers on the road because "they have to".

i dont get how there are so many learners whove any amout of years driving that cant pass a driving test?its not hard(admittedlty i passed all mine back in the 70s) its mostly common sense! although common sense isnt all that common now!

as for the standard of driving…holy shite! drive any road at any time of day or night and just watch the fcukwits…mobile phone pressed to the ear,weaving in and out of traffic,cutting in at last second,no indicators,no lights,i could go on and on…just listen to the radio any day,"1car,2 car,3 car,4 car,whatever number of car/truck/bus crash on the m50/m1/m4/m7/m8/mwhatever…said it before we need more gards,we need the real traffic corp brought back to where it should be and we need the gards NOT to have their hands tied behind their backs,ffs near every time they try to do their job it seems there is a gsoc investigation!

You can't hammer an honest person with a speed camera. Only ones breaking the law.

i get you as regards practice,its probably not that easy for some,i was lucky that way,i had done the bike licence(was way different then in 76or77)then went for the car licence,was still at home so i think i had just turned 18 as i left when i was 18,nearest shop was about 5miles away so every day my father would go with me,sometimes twice a day so got the practice in that way,yes it is something you have to keep up with if you want to be a reasonably competent driver…i dont have any answer for the people on a learners permit that get into a car once in a blue moon…

Does your general law and order problem include drivers breaking the speed limit, using their phones at the wheel, drink and drug driving, not using seat belts? Because they're the major causes of road deaths and injuries?

A lot of country folk are bloody irresponsible on the road. What's the urgency to overtake at any opportunity? And as for tailgating

Is this all true ?

It reads like a speculative word salad

Yrars ago I was in a taxi in Warsaw, at a time the driving was absolutely lethal. He had a fairly large screen, watching a match and driving about 80mph to Okecie airport. The driving test in Poland only involved driving around the block & parking.

In the interim there has been a radical change in driver behaviour there. I have mobility issues and every driver stopped way ahead of crossing to let me cross comfortably, nobody looking at phones and driving at a speed corresponding to roads. One taxi driver told me there’s been a huge investment into road safety.

Sounds a very reasonable explanation to me tbh, and matches what we experience.

I drive an SUV myself, a RAV4 hybrid, couldn’t be a tamer vehicle in the world, but I know they are not all like like. It almost shouts at me when I exceed the speed limit, I have it on a very restrained eco mode where it barely sips petrol. All sorts of safety kit to reduce mishap potential. In future all this will be pretty standard across vehicles.

I tetrstingly I’ve just come off the Stillorgan road where I was overtaken by a driving school car. I was doing 59kph in a 60kph limit. The driving school car was doing considerably more and it had a student plus instructor on board.

I have felt like opening a thread on why people keep failing to do the driving test. I’ve known people myself to baulk at undergoing test because they felt they wouldn’t pass it.

I did my test years ago, and failure rate was maybe about 50%. I remember my mindset before I did it, “it’s as easy to do everything right as it is to make a mistake, you actually have to make an effort to make a mistake” . I put myself on the steepest hill I could find, the narrowest road to do the popularly called “3 point turn”, and I kept repeated the manoeuvres. So when it came to the test it was in my muscle memory to do it completely correctly.

People on repeat permits fail to improve their driving to the standard required and fall into very bad habits. Even after passing the test you will make mistakes which you learn from, but at least you’ve proven you can drive to the standard and with more modern & safer cars the typical early mistakes will be less likely to prove lethal.

Figured it wouldn't be long before your good self would hijack the thread to make it about "drivers" writ large.

Fortunately, we have the data - the average Irish driver would need to drive somewhere in the region of 300,000,000 kilometres before even being involved in, let alone the cause of a fatal incident.

https://etsc.eu/wp-content/uploads/14-PIN-annual-report-FINAL.pdf

There are 3.25 million drivers in this country and only around 150 fatalities per year. That means something around 99.7% of Irish drivers have nothing to do with road deaths, and never will.

https://www.cso.ie/en/releasesandpublications/ep/p-tranom/transportomnibus2021/driverandvehicletesting/

Ergo, I suspect that the OP is correct in that a lot of problems are caused by a very small number of individuals behaving in a manner that is wholly unreasonable ("joyriding", stolen cars, criminal activities like drugs, burglary etc).

That would also include pedestrians who were found by the RSA to be the sole culpable party in fatal collisions in 70% of motorist-pedestrian collision cases in 2008-2015.
https://www.rsa.ie/docs/default-source/about/pedestrian-fatalities-on-irish-roads-2008-2015.pdf?Status=Master&sfvrsn=cb71b3df_3

just got back in.

usual craic out there on a Sat, usual tools. Up to their usual antics.

And we know who. Its young Damo trying to be a madlad.

Thought of this thread while watching them trying to be mad things, I think the answer may be restriction on engine capacity for the first 5 (?) years. After that if you've low enough points, a suitably clean driving record, then you can access a bleedin deadly motor. Fck around and you go back to corsa tier 1.3 liters.

Thats if we could police the roads, which is doubtful.

I wonder could part of road policing be done by non-garda private personnel. Like a roaming patrol vehicle with on-board surveillance. With a link to the pulse system. All they do is drive around, and record and report. Passive. Inconspicuous.

So Damo is doing his mad lad act in his 04 bmw, and shoots past a mobile patrol van with a couple of living-wage contractors inside, who catch it all, everything goes in real time to the garda systems. If gardai can respond immediately they have the coordinates, and if not they can follow up later. Proof of excess speed in a location, by licensed contractor with state approved aparatus and some certified training.

And you said "it's not 90% driving like lunatics".

If you know that it's not that, then please do tell us what it is. Because frankly, most recklessness looks pretty damn lunatic to me.

I know the title is about road deaths, but that's not always the only outcome. From this RSA report, the most up to date for 2019 says that while only 140 people were killed, there were also 7598 people injured and over 40k material damage collisions. One doesn't have to die to have a bad outcome, some people have life altering injuries, others end up in severe financial troubles because of the material damage ones and potentially left chasing an unfit for purpose uninsured drivers claims process.

https://www.rsa.ie/docs/default-source/road-safety/r2---statistics/road-collision-annual-reports/road-casualties-and-collisions-in-ireland-2019.pdf?Status=Master&sfvrsn=a6dcadd8_3

Provisional report says 188 dead last year, with 10% of them not wearing a seatbelt being the probable reason. 45% were under 35 so inexperience/overconfidence is the probable cause. Shockingly, 42% of those killed were killed in 80kmph areas, so I would assume speeding being the main factor here. Only 25% in 100kmph areas.

https://www.rsa.ie/docs/default-source/road-safety/r2---statistics/provisional-reviews/infographic-of-fatalities-1-january-to-31-december-2023.pdf?Status=Master&sfvrsn=b04931b6_5

Unfortunately it is impossible to know the exact reason in the majority of cases, and will continue to be that way until cabin cameras are standard and can be used, same with ECU readings showing the exact statistics of the car and what it was doing at the time of the collision. The ECU records freeze frame data at the point of the fault occurring. Why this isn't currently used is beyond me. ABS has stopped being able to determine by skid mark length so the ECU should be taken. Might get a better overview of causes then.

Insurance has a lot to play too. They are making up figures. I'm driving 17 years without incident, yet I'm paying more than some people I know who have been the cause of collisions. That should never be the case, save for driving a weapon being the cause. My A-Rated 2010 car is twice as expensive to insure as the 10 times as expensive, twice as powerful and heavier 2023 model of the same car. Makes no sense imo. And now we have young people learning in EV's with crazy acceleration and all the distracting doodads of touch screen interfaces… in a car… that they are driving…

Which is the main cause these days imo - distraction. If they're not touching their car to change the temperature, or play a Netflix movie while driving, or watch YouTube while driving, they're doing it on their phone. They don't pay attention, and a lack enforcement is allowing them to get away with it. Behaviour worsens over time to a degree of complete distraction which results in collisions. That, and unwarranted driver confidence in faster, larger vehicles coupled with a sense of superiority that this is my road and everyone else is an inconvenience on it.

/rant

Rant is most appropriate and covers the very factors that are behind road incidents.