Deposit return scheme (recycling) - Part 2

The launch of the scheme in the State of Victoria Australia bears fair comparison with the scheme in Ireland. Having launched on 01 November 2023. The sort of issues which attend any such introduction were evident there. This is the first part of an article from a local newspaper. The full article is behind a paywall.

13 Nov 2023. The state government scheme has been hit with an array of faulty issues in multiple locations. Victorians trying to cash in their bottles and cans have found several machines already offline two weeks after the program launch, with the opposition saying the “scheme roll out is stuffed”.

This piece outlines various teething problems following the launch.

https://www.mpnews.com.au/2023/11/15/recycling-schemes-unhappy-returns/

Then 3 months on the head of the scheme has to defend how it is running. All very familiar, and I only bring it up in response to the claim earlier in the thread that Ireland should aspire to Australian standards.

https://timesnewsgroup.com.au/bendigotimes/news/scheme-head-defends-container-deposit-challenges/

That's true.

Say you buy ten cans a week, that's €1.50 that will be permanently tied up in deposits as long as you keep buying them.

If you go on the dry or change to glass bottles you can cash out and get the €1.50 back.

Otherwise if the scheme lasts for 20 years so will your €1.50, turned over 1040 times and then you will get it back.

As you have to put up with bad water the five litre might be better value and there is no deposit.

Very hard to throw a 5L onto the side of the street without being noticed

Seldom see them littered.

Some people re-use them.

I've seen them filling water from taps in public areas where they find the water more palatable than their own supply.

I live rural and pick up the odd bit of litter along the road here. There would always be some cans & bottles, both before and after this current scheme. But in terms of quantity, it'd be tiny overall both before & after.

And where did this 23% figure come from? There was no reliable pre deposit estimate afaik (it was oft discussed early in the year) as the bin companies didn't collate it, they just sorted out sent to the appropriate customers. There is/ was money in aluminium cans etc.

I'd have no problem with the scheme on balance if was cost neutral for the householder allowing for fees paid already to bin companies. More work for the householder but if there had been a reduction in bin charges, might be some sense in it.

I would expect any scheme to develop gradually over the years. Rather than think it should arrive fully formed from the start. An example is Queensland which started in November 2018. Early on there was a lot of negative reporting due to things not working well. After that it mostly disappeared from the media, a natural thing to happen.

Five years later they got round to expanding the scheme to take glass. But someone wanting to denigrate the Irish scheme could easily point to Qld as being superior to Ireland, because they take glass. But of course not all the locals in Qld are happy with the new addition to the scheme.

https://theshout.com.au/expanded-queensland-cds-angers-winemakers/

Who told you that?

Ehmmm

There is supposedly 40 countries operating a DRS scheme. And the Minister is acting like this is the first scheme in the world, warts and all and we will make changes!

You were asked very specific questions about the scheme, questions which would highlight the inconsistencies in the defences of the scheme and your own posts.

Instead you dodge by reposting self serving waffle from the Minister.

Utterly disingenuous.

This was the question that was put to you, and you ran away from once.~
And don't pretend that drivel from a waffling politician is an answer.

Even though we have examples of the scheme in operation in other EU countries, examples we could have copied and learnt from... we did not copy any tried and tested schemes and instead are having to repeat mistakes other schemes went through?

And where are your posts challenging the claims that we copied what worked elsewhere?
Don't pretend you haven't seen them on the thread, you have been posting on the thread from the outset.

And what does any of that self serving waffle from the incompetent minister have to do with machines breaking down and the screw ups with whether logo required or not?

Or items not in the scheme being charged deposits which could not be refunded?

It wasn't a working scheme when it launched, and there are still basic flaws with it.

Anyone competent who genuinely cared about the success of the scheme would have foreseen such issues as well as:

Lack of bulk machines at council depots.

The need for clear rules for retailers where RVMs are down for handling manual returns.

Ignorance is no defence. Any competent minister would have looked at the examples in existing schemes in EU countries and anticipated them.

But we don't have a competent minister, we have a waffler.

A few weeks ago I found some of the tendering documentation for the DRS. Many of the things you have suggested, deposit paid to bank account or to an app, is easily done. The truth of the matter is, they went with the cheapest option. A cheap basic machine. Guess what, the machines break down a lot, no bulk return option etc.

The manufacturer is Envipco. Take a look at their Quantum model, and compare it to the machine you use regularly: https://www.envipco.com/reverse-vending-machines/quantum

If you look at the website, most of them have a loyalty card reader, meaning as an alternative to a paper voucher you could scan your Tesco or Supervalu loyalty card and get your deposit in points rather than money. If, I know I'm like a broken record, if the scheme had been fully thought out.

You and thousands of others are helping pay the wages of the ReTurn quango!

I'm going to get 2 receipts for the same amount to compare the barcodes.