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2024 Irish EV Sales

11415161719

Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,822 ✭✭✭Old diesel


    The value people see in PHEVs is undoubtedly linked to the idea of still having the comfort of an ICE engine when needed.

    Never needing to charge on a trip and refuel as normal - ie fill up with petrol.

    Charge only when convenient - ie at home and/or the workplace while doing normal other stuff.

    People often focus heavily on a journey they might only do 5 times a year.

    And they see the PHEV as been able to operate as an ICE vehicle for those journeys.

    But they can run in EV mode for local journeys in the comfort of knowing that they won't run out once there's petrol in the tank.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,676 ✭✭✭joe1303l


    A lot of folks buying new PHEV’s because they can’t get diesel’s anymore in a particular model or the premium for the diesel version is too much of a price jump.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,457 ✭✭✭SharkMX


    Stayed in a friends holiday home in France. There is a charging area with 10 or 12 chargers about 300m down the road from the holiday apartment. It is locked with only access to the people from his complex. He told me there was a charge added on to the apartments to buy the field and put in the car park and chargers. Everyone had to pay this and each person can then get a card for access if they want it and they then pay with that card when they charge. Those who use it have to pay an annual fee to get the card. The price doubles after a certain time or amount of energy consumed he said so people arent just leaving cars in the car park blocking it. A few hundred meters down the road there is another one, presumably for another group of apartments.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,457 ✭✭✭SharkMX


    We were using go car for a while as one of us was using our car all the time. Found that there werent enough of them tbh. Otherwise they would have been great. Usually when i wanted one there was none available. Not always, but enough that it stopped me using them. If they had enough gocars that there was always one available when you needed it then it could easily replace having your own car.



  • Registered Users Posts: 16 ellyU


    Most likely a reflection of the growing interest in hybrids and electrics cars. . By the way, speaking of convenience, I recently found an article listing the best coupon sites. It might help save some money when shopping for different essentials!

    Post edited by ellyU on


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,924 ✭✭✭orangerhyme


    Eamon Ryan was ridiculed for suggesting this but he was somewhat right. Might not work in rural villages but might work in an urban setting better.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,246 ✭✭✭✭Hurrache




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,409 ✭✭✭sk8board


    pretty much more of the same in July - here’s the whole year so far:

    EV market share of 13%, overall volume down 24% (also down 24% for July alone).

    Electric cars by month: 2024 v 2023:

    By manufacture, all of 2024 v 2023:

    Falls across the whole market really, the only ones with gains are ones with new models released.


    by model:

    There’s a number of car models from last year that have disappeared, or large drops in sales this year, such as the Zoe, Corsa, Mini, Honda E, 2008, 208, eTron GT, Mokka, EQS, MachE, iX, Taycan, ID5 and some others.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 227 ✭✭Ryano87


    Do you mind me asking what she traded the Karoq against? We are in the same boat with a 222 one and thinking of going electric.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 227 ✭✭Ryano87


    Sorry see post above.. what did ye end up buying? Thanks



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 937 ✭✭✭mun1


    we went for the dolphin ,great trade in value. I would have chosen the mg4 but my OH liked the feel of the byd



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,676 ✭✭✭joe1303l


    Some really bleak numbers there…..
    The greenwashing effect of petrol hybrids must be really taking hold because diesel car sales numbers are also in tatters.



  • Registered Users Posts: 107 ✭✭yermanthere


    Plug in hybrids are a pain for full electric too, when it comes to charger use.

    One of the sites I work at has a staff charger. Phev plugged in for hours. And small battery means it's emptied every day. My battery charges 3 times faster (11kw), so in the same time I've got nearly 200km range. So I wouldn't be plugging in every day.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,825 ✭✭✭micks_address


    A fair few people I know are buying plug in hybrids because they can cover their daily commute or local journeys on battery only.. they never or rarely use the petrol/engine unless they do long journeys which might only be couple of times a year. Important to do at least one engine powered journey a month in these cars or the mechanical side and fuel side will become unhappy. Was thinking about pricing and EVs are probably about the same price as ice new now and definitely cheaper than plug in hybrids which is basically a conjoined EV and ice car so the price is going to be higher. The cost of removing potential range anxiety is pretty high



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,676 ✭✭✭joe1303l


    You’ld be better off to give the PHEV owner a €5 petrol voucher to let you charge or get in to work earlier….



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,018 ✭✭✭Buddy Bubs


    We don't let the PHEV staff member charge in work, he will just hog the chargers every day. Mitsubishi outlander and it needs the best part of the day to charge the small battery. It doesn't even cover his commute



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,522 ✭✭✭dor83


    My last car was a PHEV and if I hadn't owned it first I'd have been reluctant to go full electric this time. It suited me perfectly as my daily commute is 22km so that and local driving were always on the electric as I always charged it at home. I'm happy with the EV now but I can also see the benefits of a PHEV for some people.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,409 ✭✭✭sk8board


    Personally I don’t think caring about the environment has much to do with a car buying decision; EVs or not. As for BEVs, it’s abundantly clear that ‘tailpipe emissions’ is not the primary reason given when asked why you bought it.

    EVs have greenwashing too, with some rather big holes being dug in the ground in the Congo or wherever - drivers are not too concerned.

    Considering where we are in the rollout of BEV, If you can do the vast majority of your miles on electric and have a ‘range extender’ for long journeys, people seem to be very happy to go that way at the moment. I don’t see the point personally, but as we always say, the people on a motor forum are not representative of the average car buyer in any way!



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,409 ✭✭✭sk8board


    (The quote thing in broken again)

    Replying to the comment about diesel sales in tatters - Diesel car sales are up year on year



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,730 ✭✭✭✭Flinty997


    I went looking for a PHEV but ended up with an BEV because the used PHEV were so much more expensive it didn't make sense, for me. Used because a year ago the new prices made no sense to me.

    Unless I was doing a regular long distance journey having a BEV that can be charged faster does 95% of my journeys with less charging, and lower running costs. Makes more sense.

    If I was doing regular long distance where range and time was important, I'd just buy an ICE. Theres no govt disincentive not to buy one and it's more economical on long runs and simpler than a hybrid.

    If I wanted a PHEV it would have to have 150km range and fast charging. Things I only realise from running a BEV. But I'm not sure it's worth the extra It would cost. I think I could get a BEV with 300km range and very fast charging DC and AC for much less and it would be fine for 98% of journeys, a lot cheaper to run. That last 2-5% of journeys where it's pain I could live with.

    But I totally get why people choose a MHEV or PHEV. Its a less risky compromise.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,730 ✭✭✭✭Flinty997


    I noted that while in London this year there were far more EVs than last year. Perhaps due partially to the extension of the ULEZ. Though modern ICE can use it.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,825 ✭✭✭creedp


    A bit of EV racism being practiced here😁 Reality is most EV owners don't need to plug in in work to cover there commute either but are cheapskates and won't charge at home for between 6 and 20c per kwh.

    Personally I don't see why EV driving emloyees feel their employer should be obliged to fund the cost of non work related driving. Great deal to come into work on turtle mode and dump 80kwh of free electricity into their car. Imagine the termity of a phev driver inhibiting access to this freebie🤣



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,825 ✭✭✭micks_address


    wait till vehicle to grid is available and you can put 60kwh into your car at work for free and dump it to the grid for 15 euro..



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,825 ✭✭✭creedp


    Will probably be taxable too but even so would be a profitable little hustle. Better make sure any EV driving luddite without vtg will be excluded from chargers😁



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,294 ✭✭✭MightyMunster


    Plenty of work chargers aren't free, nice option for people without home charging



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,825 ✭✭✭creedp




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,018 ✭✭✭Buddy Bubs


    Employer is me....and 3 other directors with EVs and 2 other company cars. I have 2 EVs and so does 1 other director.

    1 staff member now with an EV that is not an owner or a director and she is allowed charge at work as a perk, no problem allowing her to do that

    3 chargers installed and a guy arrived with his outlander phev looking to charge at work to do his commute home, I said no. He works mainly away from premises too in a van.

    We would be down to 2 chargers in that case, not happening.

    Certainly open to installing more chargers as more staff get EVs if needed, happy for them to see it as a perk. If we ever get to EV vans, which we are possibly going to do soon with an ID Buzz, they will be needed for that too.

    But charging PHEVS basically means that car has their own dedicated charger.

    I had a phev before and had to plug in every day I know what they're like. Hours of charging for a few KMs.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,246 ✭✭✭✭Hurrache


    Suits us perfectly. 6 if not 7 days a week is all on battery, charged by solar. But due to the nature of my wife's job she can get a call at short notice at all hours to go to several sites the next day. They're usually at either end of the country so she'll be gone from dawn to that night and the PHEV in hybrid mode is perfect.

    Added bonus now is that she won't need to worry about the EV Charger police.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,676 ✭✭✭joe1303l


    I can understand your stance but there may implications if you’ve been seen to treat 2 staff members differently. A perk for one and not the other…. If you’ve provided a work van for the owner of the Outlander that he is allowed to bring home, then it’s a non issue.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,730 ✭✭✭✭Flinty997


    No different to parking for some and not for others.



  • Registered Users Posts: 643 ✭✭✭Nickindublin


    Just have an out door 3 pin plug for the Phev. I dont know anything about charging speeds as i never had one but a client of mine has bought a Phev and is putting in 3 pin plugs to charge overnight.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,825 ✭✭✭creedp


    I was aware of your status and obviously it's the owners perogative to make such calls. Would think though, as the number of EVs increase, this is going to be a much more contentious IR issue in the future. Just like ecars/Lidl and the like introducing charges stopped locals hogging free chargers they didn't need, employers may have to consider charging for chargers to avoid employee friction and prioritise chargers for actual work purpose. No need to publicly ban phev owners from chargers if more expensive to charge at work that a decent domestic night rate.



  • Registered Users Posts: 137 ✭✭derekreilly


    Don't be fooled by the headlines! The EV revolution in Ireland is happening. Don't let negative media coverage overshadow the incredible progress being made. 65 new EVs are sold each day this year on average and nearly 14,000 for 2024. Yes it was more last year after a lack of supply towards the end of 2022, I feel 2023 were inflated numbers. Let's break down the myths, spread some positivity and support the future of electric transport.



  • Registered Users Posts: 330 ✭✭Gerrymandering reborn


    So is this headline misleading?

    https://www.rte.ie/news/business/2024/0902/1467934-new-electric-vehicle-sales-down-over-25-so-far-this-year/



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,654 ✭✭✭✭fits




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  • Registered Users Posts: 204 ✭✭prosaic


    In terms of market share, it isn't quite so bad.

    2023 Aug overall registrations 8261 of which 1782 were EV. EVs were 21.6% of overall.

    2024 Aug overall registrations 7567 of which 1259 were EV. EVs were 16.8% of overall.

    That's a 4.9% reduction in market share for registrations.

    Edit: I had writen Jan-Aug. Corrected to say August only.



  • Registered Users Posts: 204 ✭✭prosaic


    The Jan to August figures:

    2024: overall 112,171, EV 15,129. EVs were 13.5% of overall

    2023 : overall 113,199, EV 20,266. EVs were 17.9% of overall

    Loss of market share for EVs was 4.4% for Jan to August. So the loss of market share was slightly smaller for Jan-Aug than for August on its own.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 759 ✭✭✭CivilEx


    @derekreilly has made a fair point that 2023 numbers probably contained pent up post COVID demand. The long run rate is positive, albeit not at that rate we might have hoped for.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,409 ✭✭✭sk8board


    just to be clear, mathematically speaking - a market share drop of 4.4% from 17.9% to 13.5%, is a drop of 24.5%.

    The argument always seems to miss the fact that EVs are the future and sales should in theory continue to increase in terms of market share, in good sales years and bad.

    The prices on offer have dropped significantly for the big 2023 sellers (ID4, M3, MY etc), and the choice has increased hugely, yet market share has dropped 25% - this tells you there’s a serious demand issue among the general population now that most if not all early adopters have their cars.

    Don’t even get us started on the demand issue in the second hand market.

    I’m very much pro EV btw, but the “don’t be fooled by the headlines” stuff just grinds my gears (ICE pun intended 🙄).

    Post edited by sk8board on


  • Registered Users Posts: 137 ✭✭derekreilly


    Grinding my gears the way it's always a negative spin and no counter point so I suppose both of us will remain frustrated



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  • Registered Users Posts: 204 ✭✭prosaic


    Mathematically, I was talking in relative terms. Relative to the new car market as a whole, EVs declined by 4.4% for Jan-Aug this year relative to last year.

    The new car market declined overall by 0.9% and the EV component declined by more but it was still only 4.4% of the market.

    People had less money to spend on any kind of car and probably spent more on lower priced cars than higher priced cars (I didn't check this). It would be interesting to compare similar price brackets in the overall vs EV and see what the EV proportion was from 2023 to 2024.

    Sales will only continue to grow where money (demand) is available. 4.4% relative decline is as much the truth as 25% absolute decline. You choose the number to paint the picture you want. So, here, the SIMI are pushing government for subsidies for the EV market and so highlight the 25% number (not fooling but putting a spin of sorts on it).



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,678 ✭✭✭✭ted1


    I’d say yes, it’s written to be sensational, a true independent article with no bias would use a larger sample size.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,258 ✭✭✭✭ELM327


    You're conflating percentage points with percent.



  • Registered Users Posts: 483 ✭✭PaulRyan97


    I mean, comparing this year to 2022, we're looking at a 20% increase in EV sales in absolute terms while the traditional diesel has shrunk.

    Market share wise however, we're barely above that. The biggest draw away from EV sales at the moment is the massive influx of new model hybrids onto the market. Providing peoplevwith a "ah close enough alternative" to EVs for the time being.

    Hybrids are gaining across the board, especially PHEVs. These are no longer compliance vehicles but often great cars offering real world ranges of up to 100km. They're a compelling argument for a lot of people. It becomes more clear when you realise that stats are a bit off, as cars are getting reported with the wrong fuel types. The PHEV and HEV market share is probably close to 35%.



  • Registered Users Posts: 204 ✭✭prosaic


    Fair point. Coming originally from a science background, I didn't really use the term 'percentage point'. I would generally just figure out if the percentage was in relative or absolute terms. I can see the advantage of pp terminology for clarity.

    In this case, I believe the relative (pp) difference is more important than the absolute (percentage) as it comes down to economic decisions about options for the group of people who are making this ICE/EV choice. The size of group making the choice varies from year to year so the absolute number comparison is less meaningful.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,747 ✭✭✭MojoMaker


    Otherwise known as "sorry, you're right".



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 187 ✭✭Exiled Rebel


    Heard a report on newstalk this morning that started off by saying the value of second hand EV's under 5 years old is down 12% this year while ICE was up 5%. It sounded all negative until the last sentence when the report said that second hand EV's under 5 years old are now for the first time more affordable than their petrol and diesel equivalent. I nearly crashed the car with the positivity at the end.



  • Administrators Posts: 54,123 Admin ✭✭✭✭✭awec


    It's good news or bad news depending on what your motivation is.

    If your motivation is price, as in you're someone looking to buy a EV then it's obviously good news, particularly when you consider that part of the reason prices are dropping is due to new, cheaper cars coming to market.

    If you're interested in the proliferation of EVs then it is probably bad news, since ultimately the reason prices are dropping is due to lower demand. Particularly when the demand for ICE cars has increased, and therefore their prices have increased, the trend appears to be that some are turning away from EVs back to ICE.

    The hope will be that at some point the dropping prices will lead to a resurgence of EV sales.

    At this stage, I think the expectation would have been that EVs would show almost continual growth in the market at the expense of the ICE market, and in this context the figures are concerning. On top of this, Volvo came out today and said they are dropping their commitment to not sell ICE vehicles post 2030 and are delaying this by a number (unspecific) of years.

    The transition to electric is inevitable but it does seem like it's going to take a lot longer to get there than some expected.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 187 ✭✭Exiled Rebel


    True to a large extent. The drop in second hand EV price is due to a number of reasons one of which you mentioned is the reduction in price for a new EV. However I wouldn't say there's necessarily lower demand for second hand EV's. Those priced right are selling. One particular example I was looking at was a 232 KIA EV6 GTI Line which sold within a couple of weeks of appearing on DD. Others though are dreaming with some of their valuations e.g. a lot of Tesla M3 sellers.

    As for Volvo the most they can delay is 5 years which is nothing in the grand scheme of things. I would imagine development of ICE engines will stop in the next few years as we near the end of the decade. There's no point continuing to develop engines with 2035 as the hard stop for new ICE sales.

    The transition has taken a hit for sure but the likes of EURO 7 and other incentives/disincentives will speed up the transition.

    With no national car industry we have no say in the direction of travel, pun intended. We'll just have to get on with it.



  • Registered Users Posts: 204 ✭✭prosaic


    Look forward to seeing these tomorrow. I think there could be signs of increased EV interest.

    (Referring to SIMI report for September. Post got moved into this thread.)

    Post edited by prosaic on


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