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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 215 ✭✭Yvonne007


    It's that type of passive agressive posting which encourages people to respond in a way that will result in a ban. There is an exceptional amount of 'baiting' I've noticed from people who are regarded to be on the "compassionate" side.

    "For the good of your own health" is, without context, compassionate, but you have chosen, deliberately to make it sarcastic and patronising. Yet you can still claim the moral high ground by leaving it open to interpretation.

    While it's true, nothing you have said would warrant a sanction, you have posted it in such a way to garner a reaction which would result in a sanction.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,341 ✭✭✭✭nullzero
    °°°°°


    I'm not talking about me.

    I'm talking about the perception of inconsistent modding generally.

    The last thread ban I received I was trying to reply to something like 38 replies from people being openly uncivil towards me that I received within a couple of hours. I was told that by replying to them all I alone dragging the thread off topic.

    I was issued with pointed warnings for two separate posts a day after they were posted, the logic being that I had been warned once and the ignored that warning and posted again, the problem being that the first warning came a day after the second post was posted, the logic and timeline was flawed.

    The mod in question understood why I felt unjustly treated and offered to over turn the ban but not lift the warnings, I refused on the grounds that only one warning should stand not two, the issue went to Dr and was reviewed by Ancapailldorcha who had been abusive towards me in that thread, and he upheld the ban, big surprise.

    So whatever perception you have of me wanting the rules changed to suit me is completely baseless.

    I want the rules applied evenly across the board, that is not happening currently and having dispute resolutions overseen by someone who is so hostile in their approach to discussion on threads is a conflict of interest.

    It would be useful if you could take on board what I'm saying instead of making assumptions.

    Post edited by nullzero on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,869 ✭✭✭Shoog


    Nullzero has repeatedly blamed others for his own behaviour, cannot comport himself in a way which remains civil within current affairs and is clearly very upset about been constantly victimised.

    His solution is to stop anyone else debating when really the only appropriate course for him is to abscent himself from the discussions which clearly get him into repeated trouble. I have literally never seen a poster spend so much time in jail for their behaviour.

    Frankly I avoid getting into debates in which he participates because I already know the outcome both for the quality of the debate and him.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,341 ✭✭✭✭nullzero
    °°°°°


    I'm not able to report posts currently, but that post from Shoog was a prime example of a post that warrants being sanctioned on thread.

    Like you said, it's pure baiting and adds nothing to the discussion at hand, just jabbing at someone for the hell of it.

    Yet another poster calling my mental health into question which is an absolutely disgusting type of commentary.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,341 ✭✭✭✭nullzero
    °°°°°


    I haven't blamed anybody else for my behaviour.

    I'm not stopping anyone else from debating either.

    I have been jailed twice on boards in fifteen years, so your statement about me being constantly jailed is way off the mark.

    Your comments relating to my mental health are completely inappropriate as well and the height of hypocrisy when your commentary on my behaviour is taken into account.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 215 ✭✭Yvonne007


    He has stated that he purposely ignores or has "on ignore" people who post like you do to circumnavigate being banned which is, in my opinion, a really good idea.

    While people claim it results in an echo chamber, it does the opposite. It prevents him from being banned and allows him to still speak his mind.

    There does seem to be a lot of people who go out of their way to shut down dissenting opinions by luring them into responding in a way that gets the poster threadbanned or the conversation shut completely, all the while "staying within the lines" of acceptable speech to moderation from people that agree with them.

    Thats a true echo chamber.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,869 ✭✭✭Shoog


    Can I suggest that if thats how you feel then report my post.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,066 ✭✭✭Smee_Again


    That's the thing about perception, it often doesn't match reality.

    You have the perception that moderators show bias and only sanction certain opinions or sanction them more frequently but by your own admission you are not being sanctioned for your opinions, you're being sanctioned for your actions and behaviours. So your perception doesn't match your own lived experience.

    And I never said you wanted the rules changed, but because you brought it up you did suggest certain phrases be banned a lá the soccer forum which would be a rule change.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,648 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    The claim that 100+ posters on the ignore are all out to get them, and is facilitated by biased modding has zero credibility.
    On this thread they have alleged "extreme anger" and projected all sorts of motives onto a poster whose posts expressed no such thing.
    Bear this in mind when they are claiming they are only 'defending' themselves against 'abuse'.

    I have 5 people on my ignore list, 4 of which were subsequently site banned.

    If you are ignoring that many frequent posters, you are not shutting down perceived attacks on you, you are shutting down the voices that are challenging your claims and expressing different opinions to you.

    That's a true echo chamber.

    If you want to speak your mind like that setup a blog or use Twitter.

    Also, I don't know how a busy thread on CA is readable with that many active posters on ignore, would be very difficult to follow, especially as posters not on your ignore list start engaging with ones who are.

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,869 ✭✭✭Shoog




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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 215 ✭✭Yvonne007


    You could. But I won't.

    I would rather discuss it as part of the general discussion to shine a light on issues that seemingly aren't addressed. I've already clearly stated you technically haven't said anything that would be sanctionable

    (apart from, imo, the questionable and subjective 'don't be a dick' rule, so reporting would be pissing in the wind)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,341 ✭✭✭✭nullzero
    °°°°°


    Again , you're ignoring what I said. Why?

    I explained how I was banned unfairly, the mod themselves acknowledged that fact but refused to overturn the warnings they issued to me but offered to overturn the thread ban.

    I went to Dispute Resolution on principle because the rules weren't being enforced properly. I was happy to accept one warning but refused to accept the second for the fact that the mod themselves acknowledged they were wrong for giving me that warning.

    Then I get to the DR thread and find myself at the mercy of Ancapailldorcha, who had been abusive towards me in that thread, that's a conflict of interest.

    So I'm not talking about perception in that case, I'm citing observable facts. I spoke about perception on a larger scale which is influenced by situations like the one I detailed for you.

    You're ignoring the facts presented to you and telling me that my lived experience doesn't match my perceptions which is preposterous.

    If its OK with the mod in question I'd happily share the PM exchange if you require proof.

    We're all entitled to suggest rule changes in feedback, my suggestion about banning baiting phrases was intended to cut out petty arguments not censor people.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 215 ✭✭Yvonne007


    His claim is probably overstated. I have no way of verifying it, nor is it important to this conversation.

    The ignore function is there to be used and whether you have 1, 10 or 100 people, use it at your own discresion. I enjoy seeing other peoples opinions and even enjoy a heated back and forth with people I strongly disagree with. But if I felt I was being sanctioned while the other party were skirting within the accepted parameters, whilst still riling me up, I would withdraw from the conversation and ignore the poster to avoid breaking the rules.

    Clearly that it is the best option. And then on a feedback thread, I would raise the issue of inconsistent moderation as to highlight it. This is what the poster has done, but has now resulted in a mini pile on from a handful of people.

    And in fairness, I can see where he was coming when he replied to a poster. While 'extreme anger' was over-egging the pudding, there is no doubt that the post he was responding, just at a glance, has a history with him. Starting a response with 'FFS' rarely means that it will be a post that isn't aggressive or angry in it's tone.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,066 ✭✭✭Smee_Again


    I'm not ignoring what you said but I'm not going to discuss specific moderator actions with you either, perhaps your willingness to flout the rules is more of an issue than your opinions?

    And of course you can suggest rule changes, this is Feedback after all. I was just pointing out the inconsistencies in your comments.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,648 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    It is important to the conversation on this thread if someone is alleging a large number of 100+ posters are out to abuse them and this is being facilitated by biased moderation. I point this out here as it speaks to the credibility of their claims of such a site wide issue.

    Having a couple of posters on ignore is one thing, using ignore in that manner is materially different. It could potentially also be used to soap-box \ hit and run post on a thread in a disruptive manner without engaging with other posters who query or challenge your claims, point out the inconsistencies in your posts. That would not be posting constructively therefore. I don't think it is something that should be encouraged.
    And at a practical level I think it would make back-and-forth CA threads difficult to follow. I can understand it being used on one-liner type areas such as AH.

    This is exasperation, not remotely "extreme anger"

    people ending up in the same thread as you is not them 'following you around'

    Other than the single opening exclamation, the post is civil in its tone and language. To describe it as motivated by "extreme anger" is completely without foundation.

    Have a look over the posts on this thread and decide for yourself which ones are expressing "extreme anger" at others, it will be revealing.

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,341 ✭✭✭✭nullzero
    °°°°°


    You're creating your own narrative now.

    You've ignored the content of what I laid out for you and are just pushing your opinion.

    I have no issues with robust debate but the way the site operates currently allows it for one group of people while coming down hard on another for identical behaviour, that's the issue.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,341 ✭✭✭✭nullzero
    °°°°°


    For clarification, some users on my ignore list are people I have had bad experiences with.

    Others are users I have observed to be people intent on causing trouble that I haven't interacted with personally, I added them to my ignore list as a means of avoiding replying to them. Boards has a lot of users, the ignore function is the only way to keep track of those who you don't want to interact with.

    Why my ignore list is of such interest to you puzzles me.

    I also never claimed to have been on the receiving end of abuse from everyone on my ignore list you're playing jazz at this point with that type of commentary.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 215 ✭✭Yvonne007


    And that's the beauty of it.

    You read it as exasperation, I read it as aggressive.

    Because you agree with it, and I disagree with it.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,648 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    Regardless, it is a million miles from what was alleged.

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,648 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    You are the one who brought up the ignore list onto this thread.

    Now you respond with: "Why my ignore list is of such interest to you puzzles me."

    Whether it is 100+ or 50+ I don't know, but it is obviously a non trivial number involved or you wouldn't keep bringing it up. And you are alleging they are getting away with abuse and it is being facilitated by biased mods. That it is not a once off or isolated issue but repeated enough times for you to raise it here.

    That is why it is being discussed.

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,066 ✭✭✭Smee_Again


    I'm not creating my own narrative, I'm challenging yours by highlighting that you're an unreliable narrator.

    You say certain opinions attract more mod action than others while admitting its behaviour, not opinions, that gets you sanctioned.

    You say you're not calling for rule changes while suggesting rule changes.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,341 ✭✭✭✭nullzero
    °°°°°


    I brought it up once when the ignore function was being discussed by someone else.

    Others such as yourself are the ones who keep brining it up, treating it like a Trump card any time I say anything here "well you have X amount of people on ignore", as if using the ignore function invalidates anything I say.

    This thread is specifically for feedback, I have had experiences where I have been sanctioned where others being abusive to me either haven't been sanctioned at all or were dealt with more leniently.

    That is the reason I began using the ignore function, for years I had nobody on it, through experience I've learned that it's better for me to just ignore people than get into pointless petty arguments, kind of like this one ironically enough, although I'm only willing to discuss this type of thing here because it's a more open forum in terms of expression.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,341 ✭✭✭✭nullzero
    °°°°°


    I'm stating that the opinions I and others express lead to a more heavy handed approach form moderators who are typically more aligned with views or opinions contrary to mine.

    I haven't said I'm not calling for rule changes, I have suggested rule changes that I believe would benefit everyone.

    You're suggesting that I want rule changes that only benefit me, which is not accurate.

    You say all this whilst calling me an unreliable narrator. You're literally twisting my words to suit yourself.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,946 ✭✭✭✭EmmetSpiceland


    Would it possible to bring in a change to the way the dispute resolution works? Instead of getting a “free” appeal to an admin after a sanction has been upheld could the appeal come with the risk of doubling the punishment if not successful?

    This would save a lot of, wasted, admin time dealing with, dreadful, “time sink” users.

    Also, maybe updating forum charter/rules to provide clarification on what will be enforced. Like with this, very, forum where you’re supposed to have 100 posts and be a member for 3 months before you can post on here. If that’s no longer the case then it should be “amended”.

    “It is not blood that makes you Irish but a willingness to be part of the Irish nation” - Thomas Davis



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,066 ✭✭✭Smee_Again


    You're suggesting that I want rule changes that only benefit me, which is not accurate.

    But I'm not. I never even said you wanted rules changed until you claimed you didn't, that's why I'm calling you an unreliable narrator.

    You introduced that false claim and are now quoting it in support of your own argument.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,341 ✭✭✭✭nullzero
    °°°°°


    As most decisions are upheld in DR what you're proposing is to take away any potential for decisions to be questioned at all.

    What you're proposing wouldn't have been out of place in East Germany tbh.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,341 ✭✭✭✭nullzero
    °°°°°


    Here's your post that I quoted...

    You used the term "asking for the lines to be widened" which I interpreted as wanting the rules to be changed to suit me or whoever else you're addressing. Unless you can retionalise that you meant something different with that comment I'm going to assume that "lines widened" means people asking for rules to be changed for them.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,648 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    You may perceive it as posters being 'abusive' to you and you only 'defending' yourself, that does not make it true or convincing to 3rd parties. Mods may deal with actions differently depending on previous conduct on a thread, an informal zero point or on thread warning may be sufficient for some posters but if similar conduct continues then a pointed warning is applied. It does not necessarily mean any bias.

    And I find your claims \ perceptions unconvincing, and have pointed out reasons for this, not only with reference to ignore list but also with reference to claims made in posts in this thread.

    You are making the claims here therefore if you can make such claims it should be open to other posters to comment on them in a civil manner. Or neither type should be made.

    I've also discussed some of the implications of large scale use of ignore in a general sense, your comments may have prompted that but it is not all about your use of it, but general implications of wider use and and how it could be abused (that doesn't mean you are abusing it in the ways considered).

    I think everybody reading this thread at this stage has read sufficient of your posts expressing your view and of mine in response to it to form their own opinions in response to it.

    I do not plan to "keep bringing it up" unless to challenge further points you have made. And to respond to e.g. general comments made about ignore function.

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,341 ✭✭✭✭nullzero
    °°°°°


    The problem there is that it isn't being discussed in a civil manner.

    I have people calling my mental health into question and psychoanalysing me.

    Do you support people making those types of comments?



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 215 ✭✭Yvonne007


    You are suggesting that if someone questions the moderation by a certain mod, that the mods can choose to further punish the poster for doing so?

    How very Orwellian.



This discussion has been closed.
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