Tillage farming

winterwheat · 27-09-2014 1:12am #1

Hi, thinking of changing 80-100 acres currently in drystock into tillage. Worked with cereals before, always had an interest I them. Just wondering about set up costs. Does anyone have any tips on what amounts i should be spending on machinery needed eg plough, harrow, sower, sprayer, harvester. Have tractor and grain trailer. Thanks

epfff · 27-09-2014 7:29am

winterwheat wrote: »

Hi, thinking of changing 80-100 acres currently in drystock into tillage. Worked with cereals before, always had an interest I them. Just wondering about set up costs. Does anyone have any tips on what amounts i should be spending on machinery needed eg plough, harrow, sower, sprayer, harvester. Have tractor and grain trailer. Thanks

How many hp have you
What type soil you dealing with
Would you consider contractor fot first few years to find your feet

Lambofdave · 27-09-2014 7:32am

winterwheat wrote: »

Hi, thinking of changing 80-100 acres currently in drystock into tillage. Worked with cereals before, always had an interest I them. Just wondering about set up costs. Does anyone have any tips on what amounts i should be spending on machinery needed eg plough, harrow, sower, sprayer, harvester. Have tractor and grain trailer. Thanks

sounds like going from the fire into the frying pan

freedominacup · 27-09-2014 7:33am

epfff wrote: »

How many hp have you
What type soil you dealing with

Sprayer and fert spreader is all you need and will be able to afford/justify. Contract everything else.

Zoo4m8 · 27-09-2014 7:49am

Impossible IMO to tell someone what they should spend, everyone's circumstances are different, for what it's worth I spent 6k some years ago on a secondhand three furrow reversible, traded last year for a new one, sprayer, berthoud 12 m, ( should have been 15!) 15k, fert spreader with bag crane, 4k years ago, greatest thing since sliced bread! Huge selection of cultivating and sowing gear out there, some at mad money some for half nothing you just have to work out what you need and what you can afford, I've don't sow any more but my drill was a Massey 30 bought for 900 with electronic tramliner, never gave me a bit of trouble, things of course have moved on a long way in that department. Combines, from 4k to 300k plus!
As has been said above contract out and buy your machinery a bit at a time, I contract sowing and cutting now because I can! But I find it adds hugely to costs , for years I did all my own work with quite old but very well maintained machinery which had paid for them selves many times over.

merryberry · 27-09-2014 9:05am

If u were to ask any tillage farmer for advice they would probably say stay well clear. Return over costs just has not been there for the last three years even on owned ground. Take spring barley at c.€500 ac establishment costs. A yield of 3 tonnes an acre won't even cover that. What do u know about crops...like costs, varieties, sprays and timings, weeds and diseases and how to identify them, regulations such a 2/3 crop rule and EFAs. Yes, don't mind ur gear as previous posters advised u. Ur just paying for the pleasure of having it depreciate in the shed. Have a look at the teagasc crop costs and return booklets. U would want to be a top operator to make a decent return. Its only a guide but makes for some sober reading.

larrymiller · 27-09-2014 9:15am

Tillage and dry stock are both as bad as each other, at least with the tillage you could work full time.
Do both here.
Do everything myself bar sow and harvest.
Worldwide record harvests is where it's killing us

winterwheat · 27-09-2014 11:02am

Hi thanks for posting , good reading. Soil is good, heavy in some spots so would go with winter crops mostly. I would like tillage as I have more time for off farm work. Tractor 120hp. I know crop costs and returns may look sober but cattle do too.Will probably grow bit by bit so with my contractor in the future. Thanks

merryberry · 27-09-2014 11:28am

winterwheat wrote: »

Hi thanks for posting , good reading. Soil is good, heavy in some spots so would go with winter crops mostly. I would like tillage as I have more time for off farm work. Tractor 120hp. I know crop costs and returns may look sober but cattle do too.Will probably grow bit by bit so with my contractor in the future. Thanks

The best of luck with it. I started out much the same as u a while back. Work off the farm but opted not to turn up all the grass to cereals. Keeps my options open like i did well out of selling silage on the stem this year. Some crops went for whole crop here this year. Didn't like the sight of a silage harvester in a grand field of barley but the buyer price was the deal breaker. Will still keep crops cos i enjoy it. Have u thought of seed crops over conventional markets. Theres an opportunity after grass and a good price markup but again u need that little more know how. Seed buyer and daff helpful on this. Do what ur comfortable with. Very good tillage discussions on forum for farming with mostly irish subscribers. Dont b a stranger either on this. Always like to hear about tillage on this forum.

Dawggone · 27-09-2014 4:22pm

winterwheat wrote: »

Hi, thinking of changing 80-100 acres currently in drystock into tillage. Worked with cereals before, always had an interest I them. Just wondering about set up costs. Does anyone have any tips on what amounts i should be spending on machinery needed eg plough, harrow, sower, sprayer, harvester. Have tractor and grain trailer. Thanks

Freedom is on the ball. Sprayer and spinner. The two most important machines on any farm. Off farm job and away you go.

otisleeomal · 27-09-2014 9:54pm

freedominacup wrote: »

Sprayer and fert spreader is all you need and will be able to afford/justify. Contract everything else.

could not agree more

larrymiller · 27-09-2014 10:49pm

Dawggone wrote: »

Freedom is on the ball. Sprayer and spinner. The two most important machines on any farm. Off farm job and away you go.

And a plough maybe

blue5000 · 27-09-2014 11:27pm

If you rented it out to somebody with all the gear you'd probably clear the most money per acre. 100 acres with this year's barley price even at 3 ton/acre wouldn't pay for much gear.
Grain is in oversupply on the world market, and the only way the price will be better is when lads cut back. But because we as farmers are all eternal optimists (because we have to be

) no one is in a big hurry to cut back production in case we miss out on a super year.

However if you still want to go ahead I'd be inclined to agree with larrymiller and dawgone, plough, spinner and sprayer would be enough for the first year, all of it second hand though. Would you have to do 3 crops at 100 acres?

Coonagh · 28-09-2014 7:19am

3 crops are compulsory on 100 acres. It's a complete load of ****e!

grazeaway · 28-09-2014 10:54am

How is your place for beet? If you rotate in some fodder beet and spring barley the you could out winter some stock on it. Feed them straw and silage in round feeders and strip graze the beet. Young stock won't do as much damage and heavy cattle or cows.

As for the gear what have you at the mo you said you have a 120hp tractor. If it's 4wd and in good condition then away you go. If it were me then I would just have the plough (3 or 4 furrow rev) a harrow or rib roller to break up the ground and my fertiliser spreader. Get in a contractor to sow, spray, harvest and bale. If your working off fame the you only need to be there for a few days in the spring/autumn to prepare the ground and and put out the fertiliser. You will be able to manage the crop in the evenings when your home and ring the contractor to spray. Ditto come harvest time. Granted the margins aren't great these days but neither are the dry stock one.

f140 · 28-09-2014 1:33pm

you have the tractor so:
4 furrow reversible plough €5.5k http://www.donedeal.ie/ploughs-for-sale/plough/7759134

harrow €1200 http://www.donedeal.ie/harrows-for-sale/harrow/7502394

Kuhn power harrow €6k (this one is 8 but you should still get a good one for 6k and get a 3metre) http://www.donedeal.ie/harrows-for-sale/kuhn-2-5/6806747

mf corn drill 2k (at most 2k one like this in the ad) http://www.donedeal.ie/otherfarmmachinery-for-sale/wanted-and-breaking-mf-30-corn-drills/4893385

Kuhn fert 4k (one like the pic but get one not damaged) http://www.donedeal.ie/fertiliserspreaders-for-sale/rauch-fert-spreader/7357483

combine 8060 8k (be ready to spend another 5k on it for the first year but it will do you) http://www.donedeal.ie/combineharvesters-for-sale/new-holland-8060-combine-harvester/7499407

roller- either buy an 8ft and don't fill with water or else rent out a big one for the day and put it on your own tractor. id say it wouldn't pay to spend 5k on one of them.

baler- get contractor in to do that for the first few years.

sprayer- don't know much about them so cant advise

Feckthis · 28-09-2014 2:11pm

Coonagh wrote: »

3 crops are compulsory on 100 acres. It's a complete load of ****e!

Grass is classified as a crop so you could leave a small bit in grass.

merryberry · 28-09-2014 4:31pm

Feckthis wrote: »

Grass is classified as a crop so you could leave a small bit in grass.

No only temporary grassland (<5yrs) is and not permanent grassland

Coonagh · 28-09-2014 4:33pm

5% fallow stubble can count as one crop too(I think!)

merryberry · 29-09-2014 9:24am

Coonagh wrote: »

5% fallow stubble can count as one crop too(I think!)

fallow land with sufficient greencover will count. Minimum % areas depends on ur overall tillage area

DarByrne1980 · 29-09-2014 9:27pm

epfff wrote: »

How many hp have you
What type soil you dealing with
Would you consider contractor fot first few years to find your feet

I agree with this sounds crazy to by all that machinery and than u have the costs of seed
You should check out the costs of a contract, costs less for the first yr or two than bying all ur equipment up-front.

farm14 · 03-10-2014 12:10am

winterwheat wrote: »

Hi, thinking of changing 80-100 acres currently in drystock into tillage. Worked with cereals before, always had an interest I them. Just wondering about set up costs. Does anyone have any tips on what amounts i should be spending on machinery needed eg plough, harrow, sower, sprayer, harvester. Have tractor and grain trailer. Thanks

A sprayer & fertiliser spreader will pay you to buy have my doubts about the rest especially a combine. Big expense getting a seeder too. Can get a contractor to cut for €50/acre. Tillage is loss making this year you'd want a good job

Feckthis · 03-10-2014 12:26am

farm14 wrote: »

A sprayer & fertiliser spreader will pay you to buy have my doubts about the rest especially a combine. Big expense getting a seeder too. Can get a contractor to cut for €50/acre. Tillage is loss making this year you'd want a good job

We made something this year on spring barley. We don't carry big machinery though. The plough that we use my dad bought in1990 for €600. We contract sowing and harvesting that's all!!

GRASSorMUCK · 03-10-2014 7:15am

1/3 ww/maize or fodder beet for stock farm/Wbeans
Straw for cow poo deal
fodder crop gt plastered in farmers own slurry then plough in
strip-til in wheat after beans
cover crop after wheat with forage radishes and mustard vetches over winter pre fodder cropping and plaster with slurry then plough in.
top dress ww with dung early as in spring but get a very good agronomis or leave a strip or 2 bare with artificial to see how much natural N comes through
contract most the work bar spraying/ ferting

trabpc · 03-10-2014 8:52am

f140 wrote: »

you have the tractor so:
4 furrow reversible plough €5.5k http://www.donedeal.ie/ploughs-for-sale/plough/7759134

harrow €1200 http://www.donedeal.ie/harrows-for-sale/harrow/7502394

Kuhn power harrow €6k (this one is 8 but you should still get a good one for 6k and get a 3metre) http://www.donedeal.ie/harrows-for-sale/kuhn-2-5/6806747

mf corn drill 2k (at most 2k one like this in the ad) http://www.donedeal.ie/otherfarmmachinery-for-sale/wanted-and-breaking-mf-30-corn-drills/4893385

Kuhn fert 4k (one like the pic but get one not damaged) http://www.donedeal.ie/fertiliserspreaders-for-sale/rauch-fert-spreader/7357483

combine 8060 8k (be ready to spend another 5k on it for the first year but it will do you) http://www.donedeal.ie/combineharvesters-for-sale/new-holland-8060-combine-harvester/7499407

roller- either buy an 8ft and don't fill with water or else rent out a big one for the day and put it on your own tractor. id say it wouldn't pay to spend 5k on one of them.

baler- get contractor in to do that for the first few years.

sprayer- don't know much about them so cant advise

would a harrow and power harrow be required. Never seen one of those basic harrows with leveller.

farm14 · 03-10-2014 9:58pm

Tillage is a very low margin job. Alot of money tied up for a very low return. Why not grow organic cereals? Alot lower costs & higher prices.

Dawggone · 04-10-2014 11:23am

GRASSorMUCK wrote: »

1/3 ww/maize or fodder beet for stock farm/Wbeans
Straw for cow poo deal
fodder crop gt plastered in farmers own slurry then plough in
strip-til in wheat after beans
cover crop after wheat with forage radishes and mustard vetches over winter pre fodder cropping and plaster with slurry then plough in.
top dress ww with dung early as in spring but get a very good agronomis or leave a strip or 2 bare with artificial to see how much natural N comes through
contract most the work bar spraying/ ferting

+1.

RJGMovie · 07-09-2024 11:05pm

how did you get on?

K.G. · 08-09-2024 11:48am

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122593322#Comment_122593322

hasnt posted since 2015 so unlikely to respond

blue5000 · 08-09-2024 5:19pm

Try ending them a PM, if they still have the same email address they might see it.

Tillage farming

Comments