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Russia-Ukraine War

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,111 ✭✭✭RGARDINR


    Yeah with the more experienced troops relocated back from kursk to the donbass there having a big affect there. My only issue is they get moved around a lot for the heavy fighting some of these brigades like the azov brigade and 92nd mechanised brigade to name a few. There not really getting much out of the line of heavy contact, sometimes just thrown into the hardest fighting. I mean Ukraine would not want to lose 2 or 3 of these brigades/divisions as a fighting force.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,741 ✭✭✭✭TheValeyard


    Russians acknowledging loosing more ground

    All eyes on Kursk. Slava Ukraini.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,741 ✭✭✭✭TheValeyard


    Idiots! Let me just casually sweep this mine off the beach.

    All eyes on Kursk. Slava Ukraini.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,702 ✭✭✭flutered


    i am sorry this is so long, but with the new hotmail app i cannot make a link, you may need a map, there are two links to suscribe if anyone is interested as it is very detailed

    Forwarded this email? Subscribe here for more
    Russia's war on Ukraine. 07.09.24
    Operational situation
    CDS
    SEP 7

     

    READ IN APP
     
    In the operational zone of the Ukrainian Operational Group of Forces (OTG) "Kharkiv" on the Kharkiv direction, the aggressor attempted to storm Ukrainian positions 4 times in the areas of Lyptsi and Vovchansk.

    In the "Khortytsia" Operational-Strategic Group of Forces (OSG) operational zone on the Kupyansk direction, the enemy launched 24 attacks near Synkivka, Hlushkivka, Andriivka, Berestove, and Stelmakhivka. On the Lyman direction, Russian forces stormed Ukrainian defenders’ positions 17 times in the areas of Novoyehorivka, Druzhelyubivka, Cherneshchyna, Terny, Torske, Dibrova, and Makiivka. On the Siversk direction, 5 enemy attempts to improve tactical positions near Verkhnyokamianske and Spirne were repelled, with the occupiers suffering losses. On the Kramatorsk direction, 3 failed attempts were made by the invaders to advance near Hryhorivka, Chasiv Yar, and Andriivka. On the Toretsk direction, the occupiers launched 9 assaults in the areas of Toretsk and Nelipivka, with enemy assault and bomber aviation actively engaged. The enemy is pressing hard, attempting to advance near Sukha Balka.

    In the "Tavriya" OSG operational zone, on the Pokrovsk direction, the enemy is intensively attacking Ukrainian Defense Forces carrying out 45 assaults. The greatest activity of Russian occupiers remains in the areas of Novohrodivka, Hrodivka, and Mykhailivka. The situation on the Kurakhove direction is difficult, with 41 combat clashes occurring. The enemy attempted to advance in the areas of Krasnohorivka, Kostyantynivka, and Heorhiivka. On the Vremivka direction, the aggressor launched 8 assaults on the frontline of Ukrainian Defense Forces in the direction of Vodyane and Staromayorske.

    In the operational zone of "Odesa" OSG on the Prydniprovskiy direction, 9 enemy attacks were repelled, resulting in the adversary’s failure.

    General conclusion:

    "Siversk" OTG controls 1,153 km² of territory in Kursk Oblast and 49 towns and villages (around 100 in total including small villages).

    Russian forces have increased their activity on the Kharkiv direction and are preparing for an escalation of combat operations: the 11th Tank Regiment of the 18th Motorized Rifle Division of the 11th Army Corps is near Hlyboke, and the 7th Separate Motorized Rifle Regiment of the same corps is near Lukyantsi.

    On the Kupyansk direction, enemy infantry units are forced to move long distances on foot, sometimes up to 10 km, as their combat vehicles can't advance due to the Ukrainian Defense Forces' control of the air with strike UAVs. There's no evacuation of wounded personnel, and frontline troops are only receiving small arms and ammo resupply.

    A decree of the Russian president tasked the operational headquarters in Simferopol with leading the counter-terrorist operation in the Sea of Azov.

    Russian forces have increased the transfer of fuel from Rostov Oblast to Crimea to 160 rail cars per day via Donetsk, Zaporizhzhia, and Kherson Oblasts, along the Avilo-Uspenka–Amvrosiivka–Volnovakha–Tokmak–Melitopol–Dzhankoi railway. Russian forces are accelerating the construction of new railway branches: Taganrog–Ilovaisk and Mariupol–Volnovakha.

    Change in the line of contact (LoC):

    There were 165 combat engagements on various fronts.

    On the Kursk Direction: Russian forces regained positions northeast of Zhuravli.

    "Siversk" OTG launched attacks near Komarovka, Korenevo, Matveeva, Olgovka, Malaya Loknya, Pogrebki, Russkoe Porechie, Martynovka, Cherkasskaya Konopelka, and Borki, destroying a pontoon crossing in the Glushkovo district. Ukrainian reconnaissance and sabotage groups operate along the 38K-017 (Kursk-Rylsk) highway prompting the enemy to set up checkpoints.

    On the Kharkiv direction, Russian troops continued attacks in the areas of Hlyboke, Vovchansk, Starytsya, and Hatyshche, while repelling counterattacks by "Kharkiv" OTG in Vovchansk, Hlyboke, near Lyptsi, and toward Starytsya.

    On the Kupyansk direction, Russian forces advanced south of Pishchane, north and east of Stelmakhivka, northwest of Synkivka, and continued offensives near Hlushkivka, toward Lozova and near Andriivka.

    On the Lyman direction, Russian forces attacked near Novoyehorivka, Druzhelyubivka, Cherneshchyna, Terny, Torske, and Dibrova.

    On the Siversk Direction, Russian forces continued attacks near Verkhnyokamianske, Spirne, and Vyimka.

    On the Kramatorsk direction, Russian forces advanced in the western part of Kalynivka, northeast and west of the village, continued their offensive near Chasiv Yar, Hryhorivka, Ivanivske, Bila Hora, and toward Predtechyne and Ivanopillya, as well as near Klishchiivka and Andriivka.

    On the Toretsk direction, combat engagements persisted in the northern and eastern parts of New York, north of New York, and in the eastern part of Nelipivka. Russian forces captured Pivnichne and advanced in the southern part of Toretsk, near Druzhba.

    Ukrainian Defense Forces regained control of parts of New York and counterattacked near Toretsk and New York.

    Fighting continued near Toretsk, Nelipivka, Oleksandropil, Panteleimonivka, and Leonidivka.

    On the Pokrovsk direction, Ukrainian Defense Forces reclaimed lost positions in southwestern Halytsynivka and western Mykhailivka.

    Russian forces captured most of Lisivka and are approaching the southern outskirts of Ukrainsk. The enemy controls Ptyche, Skuchne, Karlivka, Zavitne, and Zhuravka. A Russian reconnaissance and sabotage group reached the outskirts of Hirnyk.

    Fighting continued in the areas of Vozdvyzhenka, Zelene Pole, Sukha Balka, Myrolyubivka, Hrodivka, Novotoretske, Novohrodivka, Selydove, Mykhailivka, Zhelanne Pershe, and Ukrainsk.

    On the Kurakhove direction, the 110th Separate Motorized Rifle Brigade (51st Army) advanced in northern Krasnohorivka. The enemy attacked near Krasnohorivka and Heorhiivka.

    Ukrainian Defense Forces counterattacked near Maksymilianivka.

    On the Vremivka direction, Russian forces continued their offensive near Kostyantynivka, Staromayorske, Vuhledar, and Vodyane.

    In the Black Sea-Azov naval operational area, the enemy naval group on combat duty consists of:

    Black Sea: 1 ship, including 1 cruise missile carrier; the total salvo is 4 cruise missiles.

    The sinking of the "Conro Trader" railway ferry has reduced the capacity of the Kerch Strait supply line by threefold, and the enemy lacks available rail ferries to immediately restore its throughput.

    Changes in the enemy disposition:

    The 51st Airborne Regiment of the 106th Airborne Division redeployed from the Siversk direction is operating on the Kursk direction.

    Assault units of the 144th Motorized Rifle Division of the 20th Army are engaged in combat on the Svatove-Kreminna line, while "Storm-V" assault units manned by former prisoners are involved on the Kupyansk direction.

    The "Black Knives Division" unit is operating in Zavitne (likely a volunteer unit formed in the Urals, alluding to the 1st Volunteer Tank Corps from World War II).

    The 37th Separate Motorized Rifle Brigade of the 36th Army and the 40th Separate Marines Brigade of the Pacific Fleet are active In Prechystivka.

    Escalation indicators:

    The transfer of a batch of tactical missiles from Iran to Russia with a range of up to 120 km.

    Possible operation situation developments:

    The enemy's command on the theater of operations must conduct strategic regrouping between operational zones and reinforce the "Tsentr (Center)"Operational Grouping on the Toretsk direction with at least a corps. For this purpose, the 3rd Army Corps may be redeployed to this direction from the Kramatorsk direction, or the main forces of the 51st Army may be concentrated.

    Without the involvement of additional forces and resources, the enemy's 41st Army Command will soon have to either concentrate on narrower directions and sectors or abandon simultaneous offensive actions across the entire operational zone and focus on high-cost battles in Toretsk itself or conclude combat operations in the area of New York and Nelipivka.

    The enemy’s shift of their main offensive focus to the southern sector of the "Tsentr (Center)" Operational Grouping’s operational zone on the Pokrovsk direction will soon intensify combat operations around Selidove, Ukrainsk, Halytsynivka, Kurakhivka, and Hirnyk. Without securing the Selidove area, the enemy cannot sustain their offensive towards Pokrovsk, but they will continue attacking in an attempt to breach the defensive line along the Zhuravka and Kazennyi Torets rivers.

    The enemy's "Tsentr (Center)" Operational Grouping may attempt to advance through "Tavriya" OSG positions along the Novohrodivka-Hrodivka line, despite higher levels of casualties, in order to maintain the speed of their advance and try to capture Myrnohrad more quickly.

    By the end of this year, the enemy will not only fail to occupy Donetsk Oblast within its administrative borders but also will be unable to seize the "fortress belt" of Kostyantynivka-Druzhkivka-Kramatorsk-Slovyansk. The upcoming battle for Pokrovsk will be the climax of the enemy's offensive operation in the Southwestern Theater of Operations in 2024.

    Russian operational losses from 24.02.22 to 06.09.24  

    Personnel - almost 623,990 (+1270); 

    Tanks 8,632 (+1);

    Armored combat vehicles – 16,878 (0); 

    Artillery systems – 17,774 (+29);

    Multiple rocket launchers (MLRS) – 1,178 (0);

    Anti-aircraft warfare systems - 942 (0);

    Vehicles and fuel tanks – 24,171 (+55);

    Aircraft - 368 (0);

    Helicopters – 328 (0);

    UAV operational and tactical level – 14,784 (+52);

    Intercepted cruise missiles – 2,588 (+1);

    Boats/ships – 29 (0).

    Humanitarian+general:

    During the night of September 7, the Air Force's radar units detected and tracked 67 Shahed drones. Ukrainian air defense forces successfully shot down 58 of these strike UAVs, while six exited Ukrainian airspace, flying towards Russia, Belarus, and temporarily occupied Luhansk.

    As a result of the attack, debris from the Russian drones fell in the Pechersk and Dnipro districts of Kyiv. In the Pechersk district, debris landed in the courtyard of a residential building, while in the Dnipro district, it fell on the grounds of a kindergarten. Fortunately, no injuries were reported.

    In Kyiv Oblast, debris from downed drones damaged three private homes in one of the districts.

    On the night and morning of Saturday, September 7, Russian forces shelled border areas and settlements in Sumy Oblast 15 times.

    From 09:15 to 10:00 on September 7, 2024, Russian artillery struck the city of Kostyantynivka in Donetsk Oblast, killing three men aged between 24 and 69. Three others were injured. The attack damaged an apartment building, an administrative building, a shop, a pharmacy, six cars, and three power lines.

    Later that day, the occupiers dropped explosives from a UAV on a resident of Odradokamianka, Kherson Oblast. A 69-year-old woman was injured in the attack and was taken to the hospital with blast injuries, as well as wounds to her legs and abdomen.

    In Kharkiv Oblast, nine people, including two children, were injured due to Russian shelling over the past day. A logistics facility, private homes, and vehicles were also damaged in the attack.

    Centre for Defence Strategies (CDS) is a Ukrainian security think tank. We operate since 2020. We publish this brief daily. If you would like to subscribe, please send us an email at cds.dailybrief@gmail.com

    Please note, that we subscribe only verified persons and can decline or cancel the subscription at our own discretion

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    Our brief is for information only and we verify our information to the best possible extent

    Pledge your support



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,741 ✭✭✭✭TheValeyard


    All eyes on Kursk. Slava Ukraini.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,138 ✭✭✭RoyalCelt


    I hate constantly reading headlines in the media like "Zelenski under pressure to end the war as it enters it's third year".

    Yeah because Zelenski chose to start it. It's insulting reading about western leaders putting pressure on him when not providing the weapons to do so.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,214 ✭✭✭✭Danzy




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,214 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    Not just the West.

    Ukraine warned Iran that their would be a price to pay if the ballistic missiles it sells Russia kill civilians.

    While it is not immediately obvious how Ukraine could make Iran pay. It could end up helping it's ally in the region fight Russian allied Iranian proxies like Hamas and Hezbollah, same as Israeli military hardware and expertise helps them at home.

    A bad day for Hamas, Hezbollah or Iran is a bad day for Russia and vice versa.



  • Registered Users Posts: 86 ✭✭Lucien_Sarti


    FYI, any insults in this post are not aimed at other posters – they are aimed only at the war mongering hegemonic ruling class.

    From some questions posed to me in June

    they always say Russia was forced to do this and that. If they are such a great country they shouldn't be so prone to external influence

    Everything the Kremlin says is lies has been a pretty good guide as far as this conflict goes

    Provoked. Yeah, it's awful when a nation's citizens use their hard-fought democratic voice to decide which way they want their country to go

    Russia planned to storm kiev and kharkiv. Kill Zelensky, decapitate the government and military leadership. And then settle in for the long haul.

    It's just been a 2 year feint.

    <Odessa massacre may 2014> Both parties were throwing Molotov cocktails at each other and the place went up in flames. It was a situation that got out of control, not deliberate.

    It was the evil F-UK-USers that fooled the weak minded Russians (who are superior in every other respect) into attacking. Or something.

    Full disclousure, I think I remember being like this myself in my teenage years. Very much anti-US. But even then, I don't think I remember gleefully cheerleading the attempted destruction of a demrocatic state or the innocent civilians therein.

    <Donbass> What I did point out is the vast majority of these deaths on both sides occurred between 2014-2016. A point you avoided mentioning.

    As a general way of answering the wide ranging points above; where I was coming from was - during WWII, the Imperial British elite (ie the lowest of the lowest scum of the Earth. Remember 1847 plus 800 years of evidence) gave the following training to its (behind enemy lines) special forces commandos:-

    (my paraphrase from memory) …. <when b.e.l.> you must analyse each piece of information relayed to you, firstly for what purpose it serves & who it serves before even deciding if you will treat it as true or false, or on a spectrum between the two. This was for all information received, regardless of source. Only after establishing this, there was further procedural training for the special forces in how to speedily decide to accept or reject each piece of information.

    When it is in the interests of the ‘elite’ they will give their loyal servants the best possible training for their depraved way of living on the planet (i.e. permanent war against less-organised “opponents” OR in this much, much rarer case – war against peer “opponents” in a proxy format).

    Compare that SHARPNESS to when it is not in their interests: instead they will groom their non-combatant citizens to switch off their brains and to consume - whatever (in my opinion) “madman”, “orcs” cartoon-level, war-justification slop is fed to them: to get their beleaguered hostages citizens to support this same psychotic, permanent-war way of living.

    ----------------------------------------------------------------------;

    Anyway as of now, from the current stark battlefield reality, It is looking like the predictable blame game script is soon about to start in bourgeois MSM for this failed large scale, inhuman, murderous US punch at Russia – I don’t mean this last gasp Kursk effort, I mean the whole <70 year…30 year…20 year> 10 year Great Power proxy war.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,135 ✭✭✭thatsdaft


    I thought sales of Russian anti bourgeois vodka were banned in Ireland



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,587 ✭✭✭Jinglejangle69


    So Russia can use these Iranian missiles to strike deep into Ukraine but Ukraine can’t use the wests misslies to do the same.


    Utter weakness, cowardice and basically embarrassing from the West.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,741 ✭✭✭✭TheValeyard


    All eyes on Kursk. Slava Ukraini.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,741 ✭✭✭✭TheValeyard


    Imagine Roosevelt telling Churchill he can only use US weapons to defend mainland UK. No offensive strikes into occupied Europe.

    All eyes on Kursk. Slava Ukraini.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,135 ✭✭✭thatsdaft


    Romania

    Another drone crashed in Latvia today, nowhere near Ukraine with Belarus between them

    Same Belarus who has been shooting down Russian drones, while NATO countries go “this is fine” when not offering armed escort



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,918 ✭✭✭Wolf359f


    Something ridiculous about escalation. It's the perfect time for the west to come out and state that if Russian uses Iranian basaltic missiles in Ukraine that Ukraine will be given the ok to attack the launch sites within Russia with western missiles.

    It's not going to happen unfortunately. It's one time I'd love to be wrong.

    I also see a Russian suicide drone crashed in Latvia. I think Russia may have to rethink their nuclear first strike strategy. Why alert the country they intend to attack with a missile launch when ya can just use a suicide drone as the west seem reluctant to shoot them down.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,904 ✭✭✭Polar101


    I can see there is an old quote I wrote about Russia, but I must confess the rest of the post is difficult to comprehend.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,587 ✭✭✭Jinglejangle69




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,785 ✭✭✭amandstu


    They weren't addressing the mere posters on the site but the powers that be .(either that or it is some movie set they have in the pipeline)

    Nothing to see.Move along.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,214 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    While there is some push back in Pokrovsk and the south, the Ukrainian forces there are massively outnumbered and there are serious problems appearing as the war takes its toll.

    Behind Pokrovsk to pretty much Dnipro and Zap. is a very sparsely populated area. Really sparsely populated, even though it is a vast area with probably some of the best land in the world.

    A collapse in the front line there could see a rapid red army advance across empty fields for a very long distance.

    If the west aren't going to allow Ukraine use missiles now to take pressure off a serious threat, then they never will.

    For all their fear of escalation and plain cowardice, the west may well end up with Russia Ukraine stalemate like 2014 but with Russia threatening on the doorstep or Zaporizhia, Dnipro all the way up to Kherson.

    That's a worse case scenario but it is possible and more possible every day.

    That Ukrainian soldiers still can't fire artillery consistently is a deep shame. Russia might be using North Korean shells , it's own cold war surplus and new runs but at least it has them.

    Rheinmetall has a new factory producing shells in Germany, it's a big step up and very welcome. It will make 100k shells this year and same next year. Days worth of use in an offensive.

    Ukraine were lucky that the leadership of russian and the red army were and are so poor.

    Russia may be lucky that the leadership of the west is so poor, it's being given chance after chance to scrape out something that can be described as a win.

    Ukrainian officials last year said they needed 20k shells a day, that's 600k a month, the Russians are producing about 350k shells a month, before any old ones or bought in ones from North Korea, or Chinese ones shipped in via the above. They were firing 60k a day at the start.

    100k a year extra production for a munition where a million fired in a month isn't unheard of in the conflict.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 36,462 ✭✭✭✭BorneTobyWilde


    UK should be helping Ukraine more than anyone else, if Boris was in power, he'd be doing more thats for sure.



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  • Registered Users Posts: 5,918 ✭✭✭Wolf359f


    The Ukrainian's have always been outnumbered, that's nothing new. Pokrovsk is another town/city where people cry once it's taken the entire frontline will collapse and Russian will be driving tanks down Kyiv. We've heard it before with Bakhmut, that took 10 months for Russia to take. Since then Russia has progressed 10 miles further…. that's well over a year. 10 miles per YEAR!.

    According to the Associated Press in October 2022, "taking Bakhmut would rupture Ukraine's supply lines and open a route for Russian forces to press on toward Kramatorsk and Sloviansk, key Ukrainian strongholds in Donetsk province".

    A year later and  Kramatorsk and Sloviansk are still under Ukranian control.

    I honestly haven't heard about Ukraine needing more shells. All I've heard is permission to strike deep within Russia with missiles and of course air defence.

    You do know Rheinmetall have more than 1 factory making shells and Rheinmetall is not the only producer of shells for Ukraine? This new factory you mention is unique as it will produce not just the shell, but the fuse, propellant and explosive, that's why the volume is so low, well low in comparison to other Rheinmetall factories which produce about 600k a year, so another 100k should be welcomed.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,214 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    I know it's only one factory but the entire shell production of the western world is not enough to meet Ukrainian needs. Nevermind build up or replace reserves.

    That's a deep wrong.

    Russia is slowly picking up steam in terms of gains, production and experience. Even the Russian army eventually learns.

    Russia can afford to lose men and it has often thrown convicts or some dopes from a far off region to grind down positions and that has cleared out a lot if the Ukrainian best men. Desertion, disobedience etc are becoming serious problems.

    As things stand now the results have been better every month for Russia since Feb. They certainly make it difficult for themselves but things are greatly improving.

    In terms of population density what is ahead of the red army is a vast empty plain compared to the high density of eastern Donbass. No doubt they will make that a difficult ask for themselves.

    Outside of the shortage of offensive weapons and experienced and motivated fighters. Ukraine is also faced with a crisis of air defence, months of Iranian drones..

    Their power grid and industry is really suffering now and it is entire plants being destroyed now, not sub stations.

    Momentum is strongly with Russia now. How far will that get them, who knows but everything building so far suggests that Increasing. They are taking towns of 15k now and sometimes hardly a shot fired. After Pokrovsk there isn't a whole lot left to take in southern Donetsk.

    The west playing it late and cagey has allowed this to develop.

    Unless a serious effort is made now that will not change.

    Is their will in the west to change that, no. Not even close, and we will be living with the fallout of that for a long time to come.

    I want them to change but the west isn't serious about Ukraine getting a result or stopping Russian and it's other allies across the world.



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,918 ✭✭✭Wolf359f


    The Russian arms industry cannot keep up with the Russian arms needs also. Why do you think they haven't been firing 60k shells a day since 2 years ago?

    Russia have lost more land than they have taken in the past 6 months, unless you don't use the Ukranian SMO into Kursk in your stats.

    Go back and look at the land Russia has taken in the past year, look at what they have lost (materiel and soliders) and see if they can physically take the land east of the Dnipro. They have zero chance. They would be resorting to sending Russian women and children into minefields to clear them. They need to advance 90 miles to get there, They have advanced 9 miles in 16 months from Bakhmut (a city we were told, once lost, the Ukranian frontline would collapse). So 13 years and…. 4mil soldiers later they could get to the Dnipro.

    When you use the word momentum, don't add strongly, the Russian momentum is at best snails pace. 0.0007 mph. Sorry a garden snail is 42 times faster, they would have traveled over 1000 miles since the first Russian crossed the border.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,785 ✭✭✭amandstu


    You are right the buggers do move a fair pace.(better protected as well than some of the Russian gear)



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,347 ✭✭✭rogber


    BBC update from inside Pokrovsk:



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,347 ✭✭✭rogber


    Many of us have said it from early on: the West gives Ukraine enough not to lose, but not enough to win. Keeping Russia bogged down is arguably better for the West's longer term political interests than total Russian defeat and potential anarchy in the country.

    Just compare Western support and rules for the murderous government of Israel and the ethical and righteous government of Ukraine to see the difference between full support and partial support

    Post edited by rogber on


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,135 ✭✭✭thatsdaft


    The UK are up there in top of the list of countries who support Ukraine up to and including giving latest equipment and training, to the point where Russians are now scared and obsessed with seeing likes of challengers and storm shadows everywhere

    They also done the most in the crucial first few weeks of the war while others sent … helmets

    If you looking for someone to blame then look no further than VDL in EU and Scholz in Germany who are blocking transfer of Russian 300bn in seized assets, assets that more than likely be used in EU to buy weapons to win this war

    In last few pages you seen reports of UK sending whole production line outputs of shells and missiles they are paying for, and as largest manufacturer in world of gas masks that looks like next area they can help as Russians now crossed Bidens red line of using chemical weapons



  • Registered Users Posts: 6,037 ✭✭✭Yeah_Right


    I'm sorry I actually read all of that. I could feel my IQ dropping as I read it. What a load of utter bollocks.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,214 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    The Russians though are keeping up enough to keep advancing, and killing bit by bit Ukraine's best and most motivated soldiers.

    That's enough but Russia is willing to grind out a win of some kind, no matter the cost.

    The west is not even close to willing to do that and not willing to supply what is needed.

    You are looking at this like a Western politician. Just give Ukraine enough to slow the to a snail pace and hope that the last few months are a blip .

    What is the fear of giving Ukraine enough to win



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,135 ✭✭✭thatsdaft


    The fear should be what happens if Ukrainians lose



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,135 ✭✭✭thatsdaft


    The narrative that difference in shell use is widening is wrong, the situation is getting better as production ramps up and allies via several initiatives are sending shells to Ukraine, some like Norway are sending blueprints and equipment/tooling so Ukrainians can manufacture at home, private companies like Rheinmetal are opening factories in Ukraine

    None of this is happening in Russia who are having to beg North Koreans for help, even their allies in Iran are insisting Russia pays upfront in gold of which Russia only had about 100bn at time war started

    Could more be done faster, definitely

    That 300bn of Russian state seized assets that EU is blocking from transferring to Ukraine would buy a lot of equipment and ammo and give quite a boost to European industries, that’s something like 6 years of current Ukranian war expenditure

    No wonder the Americans and Brits are looking on exasperated, if half Europe endsup a glowing radioactive dump when Putin’s missiles eventually hit a nuclear plant he keeps aiming for it be EU who would suffer the most



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,451 ✭✭✭Hoop66


    I think that there is probably a fear in the US intelligence/analysis community about what happens if Russia is defeated in Ukraine. Could Putin hold on to power post a Russian defeat? Or would power fracture and we end up with a bunch of squabbling states, some of which have nuclear weapons? That, to me, seems the most likely reason for the reticence in giving Ukraine the full go ahead.



  • Registered Users Posts: 1,849 ✭✭✭Paddigol


    Has there been any public discussion worth talking about on the release of Russian siezed funds? It would seem an obvious drum to beat for a sizeable portion of mainstream journalists who are pro-Ukraine, but it doesn't seem to be a live issue.

    Ditto, why have the Biden Administration and Downing St. not been leveraging pressure on the EU to act on releasing funds if the funds are indeed there to be released? What's at play in the background?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,135 ✭✭✭thatsdaft


    The US and UK have been putting pressure on EU

    The ball and the blame is very much in EU court

    FT had a an article titled “The clash over whether to commandeer Russia’s frozen assets” from 3rd of May, can’t post link to unpaywalled version but here are snippets from very long article

    ECB and key EU states holding it back

    That’s a fairly sick claim, if Europe has more skin in the game perhaps Europe should do more about this war eh?

    The result is a fudge to use interest on these assets but even here Hungary holding up things

    They worried more about their own assets in Russia which have already been confiscated and sold for most part

    Why the hell would Russians trade Donbass etc for 300bn when they spent 600,000 lives and there’s trillions in resources there



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,980 ✭✭✭fly_agaric


    I agree with you generally, but I think the skin the bankers and I presume the financial industry & all their lobbyists in Europe are talking about is wealth belonging to the world's autocracies invested here. A lot of that may flee the EU if/when Russia's reserves held here get appropriated, esp. if it happens in a fairly rushed or arbitrary way.

    These people (financial industry & central bankers) have a one eyed view and don't care about the war, its outcome, or Ukraine anyway imo. Probably would not mind a bit if the Russian military actually marched to Berlin or Lisbon per the delusional Putin propagandists (!) so long as all their & their clients wealth was kept nice and secure and well protected by a new regime!



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  • Registered Users Posts: 5,918 ✭✭✭Wolf359f


    So have the US and UK handed over the billions in seized assets to Ukraine yet?

    It's very easy singling out the EU for not doing it, but why not question why the US and UK haven't done it yet either?

    If it's such a trivial thing, the US and UK should show the EU how it's done instead of putting pressure on the EU. Could it be not as simple as the US and UK make out? Sure the UK are still sitting on the £2.5 billion sale from Chelsea. That was supposed to go to Ukraine but it's still sitting in a UK bank account and that's a seizure from a private individual and not a sovereign country. Should be a piece of cake right?



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,135 ✭✭✭thatsdaft




  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,135 ✭✭✭thatsdaft


    You are mixing up Oligarchic assets and Russian State assets

    Literally oranges vs watermelons

    And yes not only US have been transferring these they even passed the laws needed to for this, something not even started in EU

    Look I am extremely supportive of EU as an institution but we have to admit they have seriously dropped the ball here

    EU has the funds to end this war, funds that doesn’t require spending a cent of European taxpayers money

    Which would also send every shithole regime a strong message of what we stand for

    Instead EU are praying each time there’s a missile barrage that a nuclear plant is not hit and half of Europe is not rendered uninhabitable for next few thousand years



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,980 ✭✭✭fly_agaric


    I get your point. I do not agree myself with these arguments against seizing it.

    Some of it will go home.

    I suppose, if there's some kind of division between Western countries over seizing the Russian govt. assets and it doesn't happen everywhere as a big bang, some of it would go to countries that didn't get their hands dirty doing it, or were opposed to it (?).



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,135 ✭✭✭thatsdaft


    The key question to ask is why those assets where in Europe in first place

    I am sure Putin knew we’ll months in advance he was going to start the war but he still gambled that EU is too weak and greedy to do anything about these assets

    And he has proven to be right

    Likes of Saudi etc invest in western economies precisely because there is literally nowhere else for them to stash their loot, everywhere else is either corrupt as hell and assets would disappear or don’t have a fraction of the liquidity of markets and laws to protect assets

    They can’t keep the wealth at home as how would they keep it there? There’s no amount for example of gold on this planet to store let’s say Saudi oil earnings in

    and that’s before we get to all these places not even wanting to keep their own kids and wives in their own country



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,980 ✭✭✭fly_agaric


    I suppose they are here (in the EU, or in the West) because they are/were safe (stable predictible democratic states with strong rule of law and independent legal systems) + earn okay return. Same reason other autocracies/dictatorships might do it.

    I would say Putin didn't think too much about the fate of these assets on the day after when planning because he expected to crush Ukraine quickly, throw a huge cloud of fud similar to the invasion of Crimea, roll out a puppet administration and have a fait accompli to present to the world before anyone could respond to what Russia had done.

    I have always thought these should all be taken and handed over to Ukraine post-war as an enforced reparation (I assumed Russia would pay 0, and there is natural justice in recompensing Ukraine with their assets), but if Ukraine needs them before then, I can see some argument for doing it sooner.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,135 ✭✭✭thatsdaft


    What the EU and ECB are doing is what we seen go on and on for years during the Euro crisis when Germany was all high and mighty lecturing (including this country) and sneering at everyone for not being as smart about economics as them , in what turned down to be a sham economy powered by Russian gas, selling out tools and tech to China and protected by US military

    Until it got to a point when ECB done exactly what was thought as “unthinkable” and everyone just shrugged and moved on and euro was saved and interest rates for likes of Irish debt fell

    This “crisis” of not resolved could lead to terrible consequences for Europe, like I said earlier, we should all fear what will happen if Ukraine falls or worse one of Putin’s missiles hits wrong thing



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,741 ✭✭✭✭TheValeyard


    All eyes on Kursk. Slava Ukraini.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,697 ✭✭✭✭silverharp


    I wouldnt call Germany a sham economy but they do have issues that will drag it down , they have a stupid energy policy (shunning nuclear), and they manage to have a foreign policy that alienates itsself from major markets, not sure how they turn it around but insert cold sniffle analogy for Europe

    A belief in gender identity involves a level of faith as there is nothing tangible to prove its existence which, as something divorced from the physical body, is similar to the idea of a soul. - Colette Colfer



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,135 ✭✭✭thatsdaft


    Maybe sham is too harsh a word but it has been exposed to be for a one trick pony dependent on Russia and China both of whom used them for own aims

    If only there was 300bn that could be spend on type of heavy industries and weapons manufacturing that Germany has that could be found in the back of the couch somewhere to kickstart things 😃



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,918 ✭✭✭Wolf359f


    I am not mixing up state and oligarch assets.

    $300 billion in Russian state assets have been frozen.

    The US froze $5bil and have given Ukraine zero. Unless you can point me to where they have transferred some of that $5 to Ukraine as I haven't seen any evidence they have.

    The UK froze over £8bil and have given Ukraine zero.

    I'm asking why both the UK & US are pressuring the EU to hand over Russian seized assets when both the UK and US have handed over zero?

    My point about seized oligarch assets was the UK still have not handed over the proceeds of the sale of Chelsea to Ukraine and that's a far easier endeavor as it's personal assets and not sovereign assets.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,135 ✭✭✭thatsdaft


    You mentioned Chelsea, was that a state asset or an oligarch asset

    US has transferred oligarch seized assets as far back as 2023

    US passed REPO act in spring, banks started reporting Russian assets in early summer, transfers will be done once they find all the loot

    Meanwhile nothing in Europe along those lines is even on the books to pass as law in first place

    I am not sure why you choosing this hill to die on, as it seems in time you will endup on wrong side

    EU and eu states need to be called out for their feet dragging



  • Registered Users Posts: 5,918 ✭✭✭Wolf359f


    I mentioned the sale of Chelsea to show that the UK not only haven't handed over Russian frozen sovereign assets, they haven't even handed over oligarch's frozen assets, which they agreed to. Seizing private citizens assets is far easier than state ones, case in point, even in Ireland, we have laws to seize private citizens ill-gotten assets.

    Now can you show me where the US have handed over some of that $5bil state assets they seized?

    I've no problem with you pointing out the EU should be handing over those seized funds, but I've an issue with you giving the UK & US a free pass.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,135 ✭✭✭thatsdaft


    You are using the old tried and tested whataboutery technique to downplay and deflect from actions that can be taken in Europe to end this war faster at Russias expense too

    In US all banks had to report any Russian assets to Treasury by 2nd August and within 10days of any new assets

    https://home.treasury.gov/news/press-releases/jy2479

    Next step probably in next few months would be transfer of these assets

    Now where are similar laws to REPO in Europe?

    The US and UK have sent insane amounts of weapons and funds in hundred billion plus range to Ukraine while likes of Germany is busy shouting they will cut aid because Ukrainians will be getting a couple of billion from interest on these state assets



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 258 ✭✭Avatar in the Post




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