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Handwriting decipher thread *must post link to full page*

16061626365

Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 65 ✭✭Fraoch333


    I'd never heard of it before. It's terribly sad, she had a baby just 17 days before she died. S



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 107 ✭✭dubred


    Looking for help with an address please, it is for entry 368, Joseph Connell, it is the address in column 2 I am interested in https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1931/04890/4324677.pdf

    it looks like 221 ? ? South ? Street.



  • Registered Users Posts: 65 ✭✭Fraoch333


    I wonder if it could be 2 St (possibly Mary's) Villas. There is a South Earl Street, but I can't find a sign of a place with villas there.

    Post edited by Fraoch333 on


  • Registered Users Posts: 121 ✭✭55Gem


    Memorial for him on Nov 28 1935 Evening Herald by his brothers and sisters.

    4 St. Mary’s Villa, South Earl Street



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 11,438 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hermy


    Great spot Fraoch!

    According to Thom's Directory St. Mary's Villas was between 21 and 22 South Earl Street.

    From 1934-46 it was down as Long Entry and before that it was known as Donohoe's Court.

    The map is from the UCD collection.

    Interesting side note - the Office of Registration of Births, Marriages and Deaths was then at 33-35 South Earl Street.

    Genealogy Forum Mod



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 107 ✭✭dubred


    Brilliant, I have access to the Newspaper Archive through work and had checked for Death notices, but keep forgetting to check the Memorials. Is there a smart way to limit search results to obituaries and memorials?

    Some of his cousins were born in 1 South Earl Street in the 1880s.

    He would have been my Great Grandmother's brother and while I thought I had accounted for all of her siblings last year, I discovered him last week when I purchased the Glasnevin grave record for their father and he was listed as the informant. I haven't been able to find a record of his birth or baptism, I found his marriage record, but nothing in either of the census archives. He is recorded as an 'Ex-Sailor' in the record above, is that likely to mean he was in the British Navy?

    Thanks also to Fraoch and Hermy. That map resource may well consume the rest of my weekend 😁.

    Edit, just found him in the 1901 Census, his age was mistranscribed, and also in the 1911 census.

    Post edited by dubred on


  • Registered Users Posts: 121 ✭✭55Gem


    I can’t get the search to work again for 1935, found another Memorial though this time from 1940.

    The 4 puzzled me before as the cert house number looks like 2 not 4 but this time it’s 5.😮

    So in All these words I put Deaths. (Memorials are on the same page so usually works)

    In the search bar I put Connell< NEAR> Joseph

    And because Fraoch looked to be spot on in This EXACT word or phrase I put Villas South Earl Street

    Even though the s is missing on Villas it worked but not for St it had to be Street.

    So hit and miss.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 107 ✭✭dubred


    I have since found that Joseph's uncle, James Cramer, died at 3 Mary's Villas in November 1930, entry 338 https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1930/04909/4331660.pdf

    and the obituary in the Evening Herald states he died at his residence at 21 South Earl Street. He was a Pork Butcher and Joseph was recorded as a Bacon Factory worker in the 1911 census.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 107 ✭✭dubred


    Thanks for that, the <NEAR> is something I hadn't been using, just searching for the name in All these words can result in 1000s of results for anything other than the most common names. I had been just browsing the Herald for the dates after the death if i knew it, but haven't had much luck with that prior to the 1940s. I find the search can miss a lot if the original is of lower quality.



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  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 6,690 Mod ✭✭✭✭pinkypinky




  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 11,438 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hermy


    Can I get peoples thoughts on the name for entry #159?

    I think it's been incorrectly transcribed but what do ye think?

    https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1945/04626/4228004.pdf

    Genealogy Forum Mod



  • Registered Users Posts: 121 ✭✭55Gem


    Gosh it's terrible writing.

    Margaret, the Ma doesn't look right but going by the Married and given the end of the word I'm fairly sure that's right.

    Surname is difficult O'H after that, could be any of the vowels and probably ends in ley.

    O'Haley, O'Heley, none of them look correct. Sorry I just keep changing my mind about the surname.

    Any chance of a death notice?



  • Registered Users Posts: 192 ✭✭JDERIC2017


    Looks like Daniel O'Rourke to me



  • Registered Users Posts: 270 ✭✭stopthevoting


    I think you are looking at entry number 157 not 159. The writing is so bad that 157 and 158 also look like 159 at first glance. I was actually looking at 158 myself before I realised it was the wrong entry. Anyway 157 is transcribed as Margaret O'Mahony, I have no idea if that is correct



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 704 ✭✭✭Mick Tator


    That's for #157 (easy to err, the writing is awful!



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 704 ✭✭✭Mick Tator




  • Registered Users Posts: 270 ✭✭stopthevoting


    My first impression was also Daniel O'Rourke, before I searched to find that the transcription is David O'Rourke.
    It's very hard to make it out. I don't know which is correct, if either.



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 11,438 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hermy


    Indeed #157 does look like #159 but I didn't want to influence anyone's thoughts so said nothing.

    I was hoping someone would read it as Daniel O'Rourke which is what I believe it is though it's been transcribed as David.

    The only other issue is that his occupation is labourer rather than tinsmith but my hunch is that this is the correct record for 'my' Daniel O'Rourke.

    Thanks all.

    Genealogy Forum Mod



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 11,438 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hermy


    One more if ye don't mind - what is the church for the first entry on this one, the marriage of Jeremiah Healy and Honora Murphy.

    https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1866/11529/8239987.pdf

    Genealogy Forum Mod



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Education Moderators Posts: 27,283 CMod ✭✭✭✭spurious


    I think it is an old spelling of Eyeries.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 704 ✭✭✭Mick Tator


    I'd agree with Spurious on Eyeries - it's appropriate for the bride's townland address of Inches (FWIW a corruption of Inse, a meadow along a waterway).



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,781 ✭✭✭BowWow




  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 11,438 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hermy


    Thanks again all.

    I couldn't make anything of the writing on that one but Inches looks right.

    Genealogy Forum Mod



  • Registered Users Posts: 183 ✭✭doctorwho-fan


    Hello, Can anyone help with number 5 down, John - mothers name and what is under her name? thank you.



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 11,438 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hermy


    Kate Butler

    1_ Marlboro Street

    Genealogy Forum Mod



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,781 ✭✭✭BowWow


    Rose Butler

    13 Marlboro Rd



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 11,438 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hermy


    Yes, I can see Rose now - just the second letter looks more like an 'a' than an 'o'.

    Genealogy Forum Mod



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15 euro_girl21


    Hi all, would appreciate help with the latin text relating to Samuel William Davidson baptism (comments over his birth date and in the final column) which might explain the difference between his birth date 1866 and baptism date 1882:

    https://churchrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/display-pdf.jsp?pdfName=rathmines_mf_1823-1886_ba_0641

    His sister, Isabella, also had a late baptism which took place in the year just before she got married. I am not sure if they had not been baptised/were being baptised again. Thanks for any help/advice.



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 6,690 Mod ✭✭✭✭pinkypinky


    Above 1866 it says day and month uncertain.

    In the comments column I can't make out the second word. Adult XXX sub-conditional baptism (or some version of it). Basically, they're doing a precautionary baptism as an adult in case he wasn't done as a baby.

    Genealogy Forum Mod



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 704 ✭✭✭Mick Tator


    I agree with Pinky

    Date born column is ‘Mensa et die incerta’ = month and day uncertain/unknown.

    In the comments, I see ‘adultus’ and sub conditione. I suggest that proof of baptism (Isabella needed it for her marriage) and as Samuel did not know the date of his birth he could not obtain a copy of the b.cert. (or was not baptised) he went through the ceremony again, ‘conditionally’ as you cannot be accepted into the church(baptized) twice.



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15 euro_girl21


    Thanks to both @pinkypinky and @Mick Tator - really appreciate the help.



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 326 ✭✭louis346789


    Hi All

    Need a second opinion on entry of the 21 Aug 1870. Witness surname and disp

    Thank you.

    Louis



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 326 ✭✭louis346789




  • Registered Users Posts: 65 ✭✭Fraoch333


    The witness surname may be Burns.



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 11,438 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hermy


    MOD NOTE: Can you please provide a link to the source of the document.

    Genealogy Forum Mod



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 326 ✭✭louis346789


    https://search.findmypast.ie/record?id=IRE%2FPRS%2FMICROFILM05761-09%2F0010&parentid=IRE%2FPRS%2FMAR%2F0546493%2F1



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 11,438 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hermy


    Providing a link to the source of the document and a brief description of it helps other posters to help you.

    Here's a link to the same record at the NLI for those who prefer using that site.

    https://registers.nli.ie//registers/vtls000633044#page/10/mode/1up

    Genealogy Forum Mod



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 11,438 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hermy


    Witnesses are Hugh Burns and Sarah Mullan.

    The word after Disp looks like Banns with the priests name immediately below it which may be J. McKay.

    Genealogy Forum Mod



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 326 ✭✭louis346789


    Cheers thanks. I suspected Sarah but needed to be sure.



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  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 11,438 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hermy


    For the third entry down, the baptism of Mary Catherine Murphy on June 24th, can anyone tell me what the word is in the far right column?

    https://registers.nli.ie/registers/vtls000633799?locale=en#page/87/mode/1up

    Genealogy Forum Mod



  • Moderators, Category Moderators, Education Moderators Posts: 27,283 CMod ✭✭✭✭spurious


    I think it's privatum - a private baptism, not in the church.

    Could it have been done by someone present at the birth? Maybe the child was sickly?



  • Registered Users Posts: 121 ✭✭55Gem


    I think private could well be correct, the one above has the same word and established conditional or similar, both baptised the same day by the same priest, both Rotunda and both missing the second last column entry.

    Perhaps born in the Rotunda hospital and both sickly.



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 11,438 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hermy


    The child only survived for 19 days so I think your suggestions of a baptism possibly taking place in the hospital is spot on, thanks.

    Genealogy Forum Mod



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 6,690 Mod ✭✭✭✭pinkypinky


    I agree: privatum

    Genealogy Forum Mod



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,781 ✭✭✭BowWow


    I would say "proatim" meaning "in advance" - basically saying it's being done just in case or provisionally.

    Latin for "private" is "privatus".



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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 740 ✭✭✭Yeah Right


    It gives examples at the top/header of that column:

    Circumstantiæ ex Rit. Rom. apponendæ, e. g. si fuerit adultus, recens conversus, sub conditione vel privatim Baptisatus, expositus, etc.

    which means

    Circumstances of the rite, for example, if an adult, recent convert, previously baptized privately, etcetera

    Link explaining the headers



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 11,438 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hermy


    Genealogy Forum Mod



  • Registered Users Posts: 121 ✭✭55Gem


    The girl above Mary Catherine Murphy, Margaret Mary Timmins also sadly died on the 25th June

    Registered as Unknown Timmins bottom of the page, the last in a list of five babies from the Rotunda Hospital on that one page.



  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 11,438 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hermy


    I wonder can anyone tell me what the address is for James Kirwan, the last entry on the page?

    https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1943/08789/5177130.pdf

    Genealogy Forum Mod



  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 240 ✭✭ath262


    Looks like 57 Coopair/Conyair Green Fairview, never heard of it



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