LUAS Network + Future Expansion

Well yes but we don't know if we'll ever get Dart underground

It happens all the time in Amsterdam, and that have routes that criss-cross and change, so you could get Lucan-Dundrum for example and Broombridge-Ringsend, as well as the existing ones.

I think the yellow line is the most likely, but with I think it would be extended all the way up Sean Moore Road to terminate with the Red line after Luas Poolbeg. Though I would hope it would run south of ssg with either an elevated or cut and cover so it avoids a junction with the green line.

In general our trams are fairly long. Looking at other Citadis or even Siemens Avenio and CAF Urbos customers, 30-35m seems to be a very common number, making even the red line trams at 44m seem long but at least not uncommon. But our 55m green line are truly a beast, only surpased by (from what I can find) some countries which link trams together (similair to what we do with the 3+4 unit 22Ks for heavy rail) and Budapest with 56m trams (sadly it looks like these went into service before the 402s were extended to 502s).

But I can't see TII building any new lines that aren't capable of using 55m trams, and I imagine they have some plan on how to lengthen all the red line platforms in the distant future (last I checked the new red line fleet is planned as being 44m), but stations like Busaras are making it difficult.

Are there any detailed drawings or road maps of that Knocklyon line?

When you say high level map- is that the one you posted or is there a more detailed one?

Paragraph that might be of interest to you. It seems recently they have decided a Luas is feasible based off those maps but who knows.

In general our trams are fairly long.

Some would almost say too long. Ideally we'd have more frequent shorter trams, but I suspect even LUAS are suffering from a driver shortage?

Or is it a council-based thing that they don't want the transit corridors clogged up with trams?

I couldn't put it better than BK if I tried. Frequency can't be increased without some major upgrades first so there is no "shorter trams but higher frequency" just lower frequency. But also an important point people keep missing, our tram system isn't X countries tram system. The best vehicle for our tram system is the one that fits our tram system's design. Ours is designed around long high capacity and high frequency trams, and large portions of our system are grade separated because of it. So that's what we buy, like other's have said it is more of a metro-lite or RT-lite than it is like many other countries' tram systems.

Ah that makes more sense. I was wondering how they would get the green line to 30tph without bringing the red line to a standstill at Abbey street. I do wonder how that is going to work though, from my memory SSG was always one of the busiest stops. I suppose if it is just a few extra trams and they aren't replacing existing Broombridge or Parnell services it can only increase capacity? At the very least it should decrease journey times between Sandyford and Charlemont, and help prepare the line for the metro upgrade if it ever happens.

Parts of Green can easily handle 30tph, but the central section definitely cannot. But - and I promise this is the last time I’ll harp on about my idea for new short segments - one way to address the capacity mismatch in the medium term (i.e., until Metro subsumes the Harcourt St Line section of Green) would be to provide multiple routes for Green trams through the city centre: the alternative is for many of the trams along the faster stretches to stop at the edge of the slower city centre stretch, which is much less useful when a large number of passengers probably wanted to cross the Liffey as part of their journey.

That's true, in that case I guess we can really hope ML breaks ground sooner than later, and that some design for the Sandyford-Ranelagh metro upgrade/tie-in is pushed forward (where has that plan even gone?)? A replacement allignment from Harcourt to Sandyford would be required, I think the 2042 plan mentioned an allignment around UCD. Plus the metro-upgrade ever happens it might even be possible to reclaim the old allignment between Sandyford and Carrickmines and continue the metro upgrade through Bride's Glen.

Maybe but I don't think it makes a ton of sense to have all the lines funnel together only after it passes the highest density areas. I think it makes more sense to continue work on the ML-Green line tie-in to take full advantage of the capacity along the line, or just work on ways to increase capacity for other sections of the line.

thats probably for the best. if we get a new allignment before work starts, than at least the green line doesn't have to shut down, just that section, which with how vital it is and still will be during the ML-green line connection, it probably isn't the best idea to completely shut down that line for potentially multiple years.

The bridge at New Ross is epic. On a lesser scale the extra runway at the airport, neither public transport obviously.

COVID and WFH are the only reason it currently isn't over capacity. Its managing for now but its often packed tram after packed tram, and as the city grows its going to be over capacity within the next few years without improvements. If the gov decided over night to immediately start building tram line after tram line, its still going to be more than a decade before we start to see improvements on that corridor, as priority will go to areas without a tram system. Even in the best case scenario the green line is going to need capacity improvement before another line/system is able to increase capacity.

Also the massive benefit of the metro extension is we have an old heavy rail allignment that is mostly segregated and is capable of a higher capacity than what a tram system is normally designed for. It doesn't make sense to not convert it to a metro and reroute the green line where it isn't possible to send a metro. It would allow for the area to grow more in the future as the public transport system will have the capacity for it.

That's not quite true.

The longer trams have made a massive difference.

Also, the alternating service pattern of Broombridge-Sandyford and Parnell-Brides Glen ensures that there is more than sufficient capacity on the core section between the city centre and Sandyford.