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Walltite - Problems?

  • 09-10-2024 6:48pm
    #1
    Jdawg009
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12 ✭


    There hasn't been a thread on this in quite sometime. I did read a horror story here before about it.

    Anyway I was due to get it done soon and the crowd doing it said they stopped doing it due to too many problems after the install and they didnt want the headache anymore.

    The problems being plaster cracking in the house afterwards. I did ask him was it major damage or only cosmetic and if you were to take his word it was only cosmetic but who knows.

    Anyway I'm at a loss as to what to do now. Walltite had me sold on waterproof and airtight specs.

    Thoughts appreciated. Thanks.

    Post edited by Jdawg009 on


Comments

  • #2
    Rows Grower
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,576 ✭✭✭Rows Grower


    Sounds like it's best avoided.

    "Very soon we are going to Mars. You wouldn't have been going to Mars if my opponent won, that I can tell you. You wouldn't even be thinking about it."

    Donald Trump, March 13th 2018.



  • #3
    Lumen
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,220 ✭✭✭✭Lumen


    There hasn't been a thread on this in quite sometime

    Apart from the one which was active last week 😉

    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2057830336/walltite-certification-for-masonry-cavity-retrofit

    Is yours a retrofit or new build? How old is the house?



  • #4
    Jdawg009
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12 ✭Jdawg009


    Ooops. Missed that will read now. It was built in approx 1980.



  • #5
    10-10-20
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,071 ✭✭✭10-10-20


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122702322#Comment_122702322

    Is it cavity wall (double leaf with a gap between) or cavity block ("breeze-block")?



  • #6
    Jdawg009
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12 ✭Jdawg009


    Apologies, cavity wall. 70mm gap.



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  • #7
    Lumen
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,220 ✭✭✭✭Lumen


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122702779#Comment_122702779

    Presumably the other 30mm is EPS? Or..?



  • #8
    Jdawg009
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12 ✭Jdawg009


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122708847#Comment_122708847

    There is no insulation at all in the gap and its 70mm wide.



  • #9
    10-10-20
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,071 ✭✭✭10-10-20


    I'd love to know if the issue of cracking is related to the installation method - such as overfilling the wall and excessive spacing between the injection holes, plus the fact that the foam responds differently in different temperatures… I'm keen to get it done, but not sure I want to be taking on the risk somewhat blindfolded.



  • #10
    Lumen
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,220 ✭✭✭✭Lumen


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122709370#Comment_122709370

    I thought the cracking was from adhesion + shrinkage, rather than expansion, but I could be wrong.

    Wall ties work in tension, there's nothing to resist compression (from shrinkage) in a standard cavity wall.

    But I'm not an engineer.

    Anyway, my cavities have got 38mm of EPS in them, so there's no risk of pulling the walls together, but with shrinkage I might get a gap forming between the EPS and the inner leaf, which is bad cos thermal cycling, right?

    In the OP's case I can see why they'd be concerned about cracking of plaster.



  • #11
    10-10-20
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,071 ✭✭✭10-10-20


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122709398#Comment_122709398

    According to the documentation that I have read It is caused by the shrinkage as the product cures - but I was thinking along the lines of that shrinkage happening over a large area in a short duration if the product was applied excessively or using extended spacing between the holes. My understanding is that you fill it in stages so that the product has time to set-up and I'd presume that the pulling effect would be lessened.

    But anyway you just reminded me that it's not supposed to be an issue if there is pre-existing insulation boards in the wall. I forgot to ask you last week if that was the case in the case mentioned here:

    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122678977#Comment_122678977



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  • #12
    Jdawg009
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12 ✭Jdawg009


    Inside the house is warmboarded if that makes any difference. I could prob live with cosmetic cracks. It's only structural that would scare me.



  • #13
    Lumen
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,220 ✭✭✭✭Lumen


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122709468#Comment_122709468

    But anyway you just reminded me that it's not supposed to be an issue if there is pre-existing insulation boards in the wall. I forgot to ask you last week if that was the case in the case mentioned here:

    I think that was a new build so an empty cavity.



  • #14
    10-10-20
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,071 ✭✭✭10-10-20


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122709715#Comment_122709715

    Right, that would make sense. Thanks for sharing the info.



  • #15
    Jdawg009
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12 ✭Jdawg009


    Ive since seen a product called synthesia by kingspan and one company offering it in Dublin.

    Any info or thoughts on that?

    And again, if the house is warmboarded inside am I any less likely to get "cracks"



  • #16
    Lumen
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,220 ✭✭✭✭Lumen


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122719119#Comment_122719119

    Synthesia is a brand not a single product.

    https://www.synthesia.com/en/pu-systems/polyurethane-spray/spray-foam-open-cell/

    However, all of their products seem to be spray foam for "Partition walls, pitched roofs and suspended floors".

    So, not for cavities and therefore not comparable.

    Whether you trust Kingspan product marketing is another matter, they're still claiming no responsibility for the 72 deaths in Grenfell.



  • #17
    Jdawg009
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12 ✭Jdawg009


    The video I saw was a closed cell one for cavities. Sorry if I got the exact name wrong. Seems no one can be trusted about anything in this insulation game :(

    https://www.synthesia.com/en/pu-systems/polyurethane-spray/spray-foam-closed-cell/

    https://youtu.be/rurYplCCkdE



  • #18
    Lumen
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,220 ✭✭✭✭Lumen


    https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/122719980#Comment_122719980

    That's an interesting video but I can't see any mention of the specific product used.

    I missed that in the list on the page I linked to there are products for "Façades, interior ceilings and suspended floors" but none of those are cavity walls.

    On the page you linked to there is mention of NSAI (Ireland) and BBA (UK) certs but I couldn't seem to download them from the site, maybe search the NSAI site.

    If you're checking certs make sure the specific application (cavity wall) is listed and read all the fine print.

    The Fusion Insulation website does talk about closed cell foam but I can't see anything about cavities. Maybe ask them, again get them to provide specific product codes and then check certs on the NSAI/BBA websites.

    I can only find an NSAI cert for the Synthesia spray foam

    https://www.nsai.ie/images/uploads/certification-agrement/IAB_190414_Sythesia_2020.pdf



  • #19
    Jdawg009
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12 ✭Jdawg009


    Thanks. I'm waiting on a call back from them. Will update over next few days. Thanks for the help.



  • #20
    Jdawg009
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12 ✭Jdawg009


    So the kingspan lad is saying he doesnt recommended a semi d or terrace house as risk is too much.

    Mine is an end terrace but it's moved halfway forward than all the rest. We only partially share a wall.

    They do not make this easy!



  • #21
    Jdawg009
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12 ✭Jdawg009


    Update. Can anyone recommend anyone in Dublin who will do this job with a closed cell foam.

    The whole experience has literally aged me. Cant do loads of other stuff until this is done.



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