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M6 - Galway City Ring Road [planning decision pending]

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Comments

  • #2252
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 15,362 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    youngrun wrote: »
    N6 action group meeting tomorrow I understand, I wonder where they are at re a campaign against the route or otherwise , might go along.

    I wonder......

    Can the "N" in N6 action group stand for Nimby?

    "The Nimby 6 action group" just rolls off the tongue and captures what they're are about in both the literal and figurative sense

    Just remembering that some of these are the ones who prevented the Bish move to free land provided by the Uni.


  • #2253
    Schadenfreudia
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 6,995 ✭✭✭Schadenfreudia


    monument wrote: »

    You've lost in any attempt to actually tackle the points I've made so you have tired to flinging muck and trying to say I'm not demanding better PT funding... Unreal

    I've certainly not "lost" ;)

    Ireland's road infrastructure is below par; its PT infrastructure in Dublin is very far below par.

    We need increases in transport infrastructure investment; over the past 60 years the lowest in Western Europe - including roads.

    You'd be better arguing for more PT investment than whining about the seriously inadequate investments in roads.

    Politicians just love the type of negative arguments you make; they provide the perfect cover for doing very little or nothing. Start a controversy about every major project - and save money that can be spent on your local priorities :(

    Result: decrepit unmaintained inadequate roads in the country and no metro system in the city.


  • #2254
    monument
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 14,097 Mod ✭✭✭✭monument


    Carawaystick wrote: »
    Good roads have greatly improved public transport, it's not an either or.
    It's quicker form Dublin city centre to Galway city centre by road on a bus, than by tram&train, not to mention the disaster of getting to Galway by train from Limerick.

    If it was not clear: I was referring to the chronic imbalance between motorway spend and spend on sustainable transport in our cities (i.e. Dart Underground, metro, Luas, BRT, walking and cycling).
    Schadenfreudia wrote: »
    I've certainly not "lost" ;)

    Ireland's road infrastructure is below par; its PT infrastructure in Dublin is very far below par.

    We need increases in transport infrastructure investment; over the past 60 years the lowest in Western Europe - including roads.

    You'd be better arguing for more PT investment than whining about the seriously inadequate investments in roads.

    Politicians just love the type of negative arguments you make; they provide the perfect cover for doing very little or nothing. Start a controversy about every major project - and save money that can be spent on your local priorities :(

    Result: decrepit unmaintained inadequate roads in the country and no metro system in the city.

    You can say you have not lost or whatever, but it is clear that you are failing to deal with the issues in previous posts (trying to claim there was no bad planning in Dublin bar not making roads larger enough when a tribunal was needed for the bad planning), then you go on to mud slinging and trying to blame people for a lack of large scale road investment while the budget for such projects remains high (which is clear nonsense -- nobody can be blamed for a lack of such funding while such funding is high).

    Yes. The M50 is a success. And yes. The Emperor is wearing nothing at all.


  • #2255
    Schadenfreudia
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 6,995 ✭✭✭Schadenfreudia


    monument wrote: »
    If it was not clear: I was referring to the chronic imbalance between motorway spend and spend on sustainable transport in our cities (i.e. Dart Underground, metro, Luas, BRT, walking and cycling).

    That was very clear, and I explained by that was pointless and negative and only gives succour to the mindset which opposes infrastructural investment in general.

    You can say you have not lost or whatever, but it is clear that you are failing to deal with the issues in previous posts

    I have dealt rather comprehensively with all he issues you raised, including the fallacies.
    (trying to claim there was no bad planning in Dublin bar not making roads larger enough when a tribunal was needed for the bad planning)

    Trying to claim the M50 was part of the "bad planning" is simply nonsense.

    then you go on to mud slinging and trying to blame people for a lack of large scale road investment while the budget for such projects remains high (which is clear nonsense -- nobody can be blamed for a lack of such funding while such funding is high).

    Not sure what your point is. What does "nobody can be blamed for a lack of such funding while such funding is high" mean?

    I have stated the fact that for the past 60 years our investment in transport infrastructure, roads and PT, has been way below developed country norms.

    You seem unable to grasp that simple fact.
    Yes. The M50 is a success.

    Correct.
    And yes. The Emperor is wearing nothing at all.

    Bit OTT to compare yourself to an Emperor :rolleyes:


  • #2256
    spacetweek
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 5,239 Mod ✭✭✭✭spacetweek


    Back on topic please.


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  • #2257
    what_traffic
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,172 ✭✭✭what_traffic


    Meeting was on last night. Good turnout. Reckon 150-200 people attended at the Westwood. Twitter handle
    https://twitter.com/N6Action
    They were live tweeting during the event.
    Is worth reviewing if you want to hear various sound bites from local representatives and others regarding the proposal.


  • #2258
    youngrun
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,477 ✭✭✭youngrun


    what_traffic wrote: »
    Meeting was on last night. Good turnout. Reckon 150-200 people attended at the Westwood. Twitter handle
    https://twitter.com/N6Action
    They were live tweeting during the event.
    Is worth reviewing if you want to hear various sound bites from local representatives and others regarding the proposal.

    Meant to go but work intervened
    Was there anything concrete about route selection process and what this Action group is likely to do strategy wise. Was there representation from NUI galway at it re their lands the subject of a big chunk of route.


  • #2259
    what_traffic
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,172 ✭✭✭what_traffic


    youngrun wrote: »
    Meant to go but work intervened
    Was there anything concrete about route selection process and what this Action group is likely to do strategy wise. Was there representation from NUI galway at it re their lands the subject of a big chunk of route.

    No NUIG representative. Plenty of politicians.
    Only arrived during the 2nd half of the Route Selection process presentation. Was not sure exaclty what the purpose of this presentation was.
    Some of the presentations given are here.
    https://galwayn6action.wordpress.com/2016/02/04/publicinfopresentations/

    Re strategy - would need to contact them directly. At the end of meeting was call for support from affected persons (and others) for funding to hire experts for the ABP process when submissions wil be made.


  • #2260
    yer man!
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,653 ✭✭✭yer man!


    http://connachttribune.ie/meeting-hears-city-bypass-will-increase-traffic-congestion-722/

    These people just don't get it! The article pushes the notion that the one of the major issues they are having is that the bypass would only serve 3% of the people (ppl that need to use the entire road end to end to bypass the city) by comparison, what's the percentage tag of people that need to use any ring road end to end? Most people would be using portions of this road to navigate in and out of the city to get from one section to another. Like seriously it's like a broken record, they know it's needed and every other city has one and are viral to them but just it's just pure NIMBYISM.


  • #2261
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 31,118 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    yer man! wrote: »
    Like seriously it's like a broken record, they know it's needed and every other city has one and are viral to them but just it's just pure NIMBYISM.
    I assume that you mean vital, but viral works as well as most cities that have had bypass operations tend to grow (like a virus) and fill in the gaps between itself and the new road & often extending outwards.


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  • #2262
    yer man!
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,653 ✭✭✭yer man!


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    I assume that you mean vital, but viral works as well as most cities that have had bypass operations tend to grow (like a virus) and fill in the gaps between itself and the new road & often extending outwards.

    Sorry, phone typing.... I accept that cities will grow, it is infrastructure. We are extremely limited for options at this point however, there simply isn't room to put in added public transport alongside current road capacity without closing roads, this option can only really be explored once the traffic can bleed off to somewhere else.


  • #2263
    monument
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 14,097 Mod ✭✭✭✭monument


    yer man! wrote: »
    Sorry, phone typing.... I accept that cities will grow, it is infrastructure. We are extremely limited for options at this point however, there simply isn't room to put in added public transport alongside current road capacity without closing roads, this option can only really be explored once the traffic can bleed off to somewhere else.

    That's not really supported by evidence and is certainly not a given.

    Loads of examples in Dublin and around the world where traffic is displaced without any extra road space for traffic elsewhere.

    And Dublin is going to continue to displace traffic within the M50 even with the M50 at critical levels and most of the displaced traffic would not be using the M50 anyway.

    In any case, closing roads is generally not done -- restricting ineffective travel modes and travel patterns in what's done elsewhere, with access maintained for those who need it.


  • #2264
    GDSGR8
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 76 ✭✭GDSGR8


    monument wrote: »
    That's not really supported by evidence and is certainly not a given.

    Loads of examples in Dublin and around the world where traffic is displaced without any extra road space for traffic elsewhere.

    And Dublin is going to continue to displace traffic within the M50 even with the M50 at critical levels and most of the displaced traffic would not be using the M50 anyway.

    In any case, closing roads is generally not done -- restricting ineffective travel modes and travel patterns in what's done elsewhere, with access maintained for those who need it.

    Your points are only partially true, but don't really apply in Galway's case in any event. The geography of Galway, sandwiched between Lough Corrib and the Atlantic Ocean funnels everything through a narrow corridor. There are only four bridges, three of which have very limited capacity. There are essentially only about six effectively operating lanes crossing the bridge at any given time. Dedicating two of those to exclusive public transport use (which is a desirable aim ultimately) isn't really viable as things stand. Another bridge, not constrained by running directly into a medieval street network, is necessary to achieve this.


  • #2265
    Shurimgreat
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,133 ✭✭✭Shurimgreat


    Does Galway really need a bypass? Yes the traffic is an inconvienence but its the same in every city in Ireland. The big problem in galway is the school run. After its over the traffic is fine. If you can miss the school run either before or delay your journey a few minutes its fine.

    I'm not convinced.


  • #2266
    Schadenfreudia
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 6,995 ✭✭✭Schadenfreudia


    Shurimgreat wrote: »
    Does Galway really need a bypass? Yes the traffic is an inconvienence but its the same in every city in Ireland. The big problem in galway is the school run. After its over the traffic is fine. If you can miss the school run either before or delay your journey a few minutes its fine.

    I'm not convinced.

    Yeah? Why would a town of 80,000 people need a bypass....just because every such town in the developed world has one?

    Ridiculous :rolleyes:


  • #2267
    GDSGR8
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 76 ✭✭GDSGR8


    Shurimgreat wrote: »
    Does Galway really need a bypass? Yes the traffic is an inconvienence but its the same in every city in Ireland. The big problem in galway is the school run. After its over the traffic is fine. If you can miss the school run either before or delay your journey a few minutes its fine.

    I'm not convinced.

    It clogs up well before the school run. It's also prone to massive delays and virtual gridlock at off peaks time on occasion and for no obvious reason and when, God forbid, a single lane is closed off on the N6 due to a burst watermain then total chaos descends. When a serious traffic accident occurs, forget about it. And then you've got the seasonal mayhem associated with the novena, race week etc etc. But no, it's the school run that's all it is. Problem solved.


  • #2268
    m17
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,321 ✭✭✭m17


    Shurimgreat wrote: »
    Does Galway really need a bypass? Yes the traffic is an inconvienence but its the same in every city in Ireland. The big problem in galway is the school run. After its over the traffic is fine. If you can miss the school run either before or delay your journey a few minutes its fine.

    I'm not convinced.

    Yes it does I drove Dublin to Briarhill in 90 minutes then it that long again to get to barna there hasn't been a bridge built over the corrib since 1985


  • #2269
    spacetweek
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 5,239 Mod ✭✭✭✭spacetweek


    Galway needs a new bypass basically so that the existing one can be rededicated to public transport. This will require engineering changes, new buses, and a lot of branding as currently PT doesn't have a good image in the city.


  • #2270
    what_traffic
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,172 ✭✭✭what_traffic


    spacetweek wrote: »
    Galway needs a new bypass basically so that the existing one can be rededicated to public transport. This will require engineering changes, new buses, and a lot of branding as currently PT doesn't have a good image in the city.

    If the City Expressway was actually been sold alongside this proposal it would have a lot more supporters IMHO. No indication at all that this will actually occur. Most likely it will be business as usual should it be built.


  • #2271
    GDSGR8
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 76 ✭✭GDSGR8


    what_traffic wrote: »
    If the City Expressway was actually been sold alongside this proposal it would have a lot more supporters IMHO. No indication at all that this will actually occur. Most likely it will be business as usual should it be built.

    Expressway in Ireland refers to a bus service, I'm not sure what you're trying to achieve with such a bizarre name. Anyway, the overall project includes a public transport component, the details of which should become clearer when the NTA report is published this month. It'll be difficult for the road component to get article 6(4) approval without having a definitive plan to back it up.


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  • #2272
    what_traffic
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,172 ✭✭✭what_traffic


    GDSGR8 wrote: »
    Expressway in Ireland refers to a bus service, I'm not sure what you're trying to achieve with such a bizarre name. Anyway, the overall project includes a public transport component, the details of which should become clearer when the NTA report is published this month. It'll be difficult for the road component to get article 6(4) approval without having a definitive plan to back it up.

    Yes it is unusual when I heard it first. Has a US ring to it. It
    is a title already used in the local media, the first person I heard saying it was Eileen McCarthy of ARUP who is the lead project engineer for the N6 Galway City Transport Project: Home
    Already covered here in this closed thread.
    http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055431889&page=62

    Agree re article 6(4) - but they (Galway City and County Council) have approached it by putting the cart before the ass.


  • #2273
    Carawaystick
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,779 ✭✭✭Carawaystick


    GDSGR8 wrote: »
    . Anyway, the overall project includes a public transport component, the details of which should become clearer when the NTA report is published this month.

    This would be the same NTA that prevented a 15min bus service and said a 30 min service would be grand, when a private operator wanted to serve Galway city right?


  • #2274
    Shurimgreat
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,133 ✭✭✭Shurimgreat


    Again, its been mentioned elsewhere that the proportion of traffic who would use the bypass at any time is relatively small compared to the amount of traffic in Galway generally - less than 5% I think is the figure I heard. In other words it would reduce traffic by about 5% - hardly worth the cost.

    It would not do a significant amount to cure the traffic issue in Galway. It might speed up some journeys for some people but wouldn't do much for everyone else.

    From what I can see the problems are related to the school run - Galway in the summer is relatively quiet traffic wise. There are also various bottle necks around the city such as between the University and the Hospital - ie people working there or attending them. These bottle necks would not be solved by a bypass.

    Salthill is another blackspot, probably because of the number of secondary schools with people bringing their kids from all over Galway just so they can attend a secondary school there. Would it make sense to move one of the secondary schools? Would more school buses make sense? I see a lot of short journeys too with parents dropping their kids off. Would safer cycle lanes make sense? There's very few of them in Galway and I rarely see kids cycling to school. Again, a bypass wouldn't solve this.

    The only thing a bypass would do is get people to the next bottleneck quicker. A little thinking outside the box wouldn't go amiss and a little recognition that the Galway traffic problem is complex and the fix is complex too as opposed to the simplistic "lets build a bypass".


  • #2275
    Shurimgreat
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,133 ✭✭✭Shurimgreat


    m17 wrote: »
    Yes it does I drove Dublin to Briarhill in 90 minutes then it that long again to get to barna there hasn't been a bridge built over the corrib since 1985

    What time were you driving through Galway? And what route did you take? And how many people are driving Briarhill to Barna on a daily basis or as part of their commute?

    There needs to be a certain minimum number of people to benefit from a bypass for it to make sense. Some people cross the corrib as part of their commute, but it needs to be established what proportion of overall traffic and if a bypass will bring real benefits or just a small improvement.

    I'd be in favour of a congestion charge myself along with more bus lanes, cycle lanes, improved public transport and possibly widening the existing bridge over the Corrib to accommodate a bus/taxi lane.


  • #2276
    Ren2k7
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,161 ✭✭✭Ren2k7


    Carawaystick wrote: »
    This would be the same NTA that prevented a 15min bus service and said a 30 min service would be grand, when a private operator wanted to serve Galway city right?

    The NTA should be abolished really. It's just another useless quango.


  • #2277
    GDSGR8
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 76 ✭✭GDSGR8


    Ren2k7 wrote: »
    The NTA should be abolished really. It's just another useless quango.

    In what way is it a useless quango? Please provide some evidence to support your position.


  • #2278
    Carawaystick
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,779 ✭✭✭Carawaystick


    Shurimgreat wrote: »
    There needs to be a certain minimum number of people to benefit from a bypass for it to make sense. Some people cross the corrib as part of their commute, but it needs to be established what proportion of overall traffic and if a bypass will bring real benefits or just a small improvement.
    .
    If only the census asked where people worked and where they lived and how they got to work... :rolleyes:


  • #2279
    GDSGR8
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 76 ✭✭GDSGR8


    Shurimgreat wrote: »
    Again, its been mentioned elsewhere that the proportion of traffic who would use the bypass at any time is relatively small compared to the amount of traffic in Galway generally - less than 5% I think is the figure I heard. In other words it would reduce traffic by about 5% - hardly worth the cost.

    It would not do a significant amount to cure the traffic issue in Galway. It might speed up some journeys for some people but wouldn't do much for everyone else.

    From what I can see the problems are related to the school run - Galway in the summer is relatively quiet traffic wise. There are also various bottle necks around the city such as between the University and the Hospital - ie people working there or attending them. These bottle necks would not be solved by a bypass.

    Salthill is another blackspot, probably because of the number of secondary schools with people bringing their kids from all over Galway just so they can attend a secondary school there. Would it make sense to move one of the secondary schools? Would more school buses make sense? I see a lot of short journeys too with parents dropping their kids off. Would safer cycle lanes make sense? There's very few of them in Galway and I rarely see kids cycling to school. Again, a bypass wouldn't solve this.

    The only thing a bypass would do is get people to the next bottleneck quicker. A little thinking outside the box wouldn't go amiss and a little recognition that the Galway traffic problem is complex and the fix is complex too as opposed to the simplistic "lets build a bypass".

    Complete and utter nonsense, start to finish. It's remarkably (to the point of suspicion) similar to the drivel I heard at the N6 action group meeting. Embarrassing.


  • #2280
    Ren2k7
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,161 ✭✭✭Ren2k7


    GDSGR8 wrote: »
    In what way is it a useless quango? Please provide some evidence to support your position.

    Regulation of city and county transport services could just as easily be handled at local authority level with regulation at the national level handled by the Dept. of Transport.


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  • #2281
    GDSGR8
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 76 ✭✭GDSGR8


    Ren2k7 wrote: »
    Regulation of city and county transport services could just as easily be handled at local authority level with regulation at the national level handled by the Dept. of Transport.

    Several decades of evidence suggest otherwise, the NTA has only been around for a few years. Care to try again?


  • #2282
    Ren2k7
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,161 ✭✭✭Ren2k7


    GDSGR8 wrote: »
    Several decades of evidence suggest otherwise, the NTA has only been around for a few years. Care to try again?

    No, I'm quite content that I'm right on this.


  • #2283
    spacetweek
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 5,239 Mod ✭✭✭✭spacetweek


    Ren2k7 wrote: »
    No, I'm quite content that I'm right on this.

    You definitely aren't. The whole point of taking control of transport from county councils and giving it to the NTA was because CCo's were failing at it.


  • #2284
    spacetweek
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 5,239 Mod ✭✭✭✭spacetweek


    GDSGR8 wrote: »
    Complete and utter nonsense, start to finish. It's remarkably (to the point of suspicion) similar to the drivel I heard at the N6 action group meeting. Embarrassing.
    Absolutely. And the 5% figure! Laughable.


  • #2285
    Carawaystick
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,779 ✭✭✭Carawaystick


    Ren2k7 wrote: »
    No, I'm quite content that I'm right on this.

    How much do you think the city council would give to public transport operators vs the amount the NTA give BÉ?


  • #2286
    Shurimgreat
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,133 ✭✭✭Shurimgreat


    GDSGR8 wrote: »
    Complete and utter nonsense, start to finish. It's remarkably (to the point of suspicion) similar to the drivel I heard at the N6 action group meeting. Embarrassing.

    Not embarrassing in the least. What is vastly more embarrassing is people like you essentially saying a bypass will solve ALL Galway's traffic problems. You really didn't bother reading my entire post. A bypass will solve some of Galway's traffic problems, even its advocates recognise it will solve only a small part of it. The issue is complex, far more complex than you can understand from what I can see. But yeh build your bypass and see if that will fix it. Expensive mistake if it doesn't.


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  • #2287
    Shurimgreat
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,133 ✭✭✭Shurimgreat


    Schadenfreudia wrote: »
    Yeah? Why would a town of 80,000 people need a bypass....just because every such town in the developed world has one?

    Ridiculous :rolleyes:

    Many such towns particularly in Europe also have light rail. Encouraging more cars in Galway is not the answer to these traffic problems.


  • #2288
    m17
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,321 ✭✭✭m17


    Shurimgreat wrote: »
    What time were you driving through Galway? And what route did you take? And how many people are driving Briarhill to Barna on a daily basis or as part of their commute?

    There needs to be a certain minimum number of people to benefit from a bypass for it to make sense. Some people cross the corrib as part of their commute, but it needs to be established what proportion of overall traffic and if a bypass will bring real benefits or just a small improvement.

    I'd be in favour of a congestion charge myself along with more bus lanes, cycle lanes, improved public transport and possibly widening the existing bridge over the Corrib to accommodate a bus/taxi lane.

    Left Dublin at 6.40am got to the roundabout just before Briarhill at 8.10am there was such a long tail back what's going to happen when the m17/m18 opens there will be tail backs back as far as cranmore junction 19 then got to the Briarhill junction I can't believe that the roundabout is going back in when the bypass starts kept going past galway shopping junction over the bridge past Westside turned left, passed Knocknacarra and finally arrived in Barna by 9.40 never again god help next week when the novena starts


  • #2289
    Shurimgreat
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,133 ✭✭✭Shurimgreat


    m17 wrote: »
    Left Dublin at 6.40am got to the roundabout just before Briarhill at 8.10am there was such a long tail back what's going to happen when the m17/m18 opens there will be tail backs back as far as cranmore junction 19 then got to the Briarhill junction I can't believe that the roundabout is going back in when the bypass starts kept going past galway shopping junction over the bridge past Westside turned left, passed Knocknacarra and finally arrived in Barna by 9.40 never again

    You hit rush hour traffic, school run, university, commuters coming from basically all over Galway and some from Mayo, Clare and so on. Everyone converges on Galway at that hour of the morning. If you had arrived in Galway at 9.10, the same journey would take you 30 minutes. I have experienced the same myself. My commute is 10-12 minutes if I leave my house at 9am when things die down. If I left at 8.30, it would be about 30 minutes in traffic, although I try to take back roads which helps. If I drive home at lunchtime, its back to 10-12 minutes. Evening rush hour, 20 minutes.


  • #2290
    Ren2k7
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,161 ✭✭✭Ren2k7


    spacetweek wrote: »
    You definitely aren't. The whole point of taking control of transport from county councils and giving it to the NTA was because CCo's were failing at it.

    What powers were taken from county council's? The NTA was just a rebranding of the Dublin Transport Office with transport regulation moved out of the Dept to the NTA. It's funny hearing people say that local authorities are incapable of running transport services themselves when they've never been trusted by central government to begin with. When we see CoCo's with some actual powers in transport provision THEN your argument may stand up to scrutiny.


  • #2291
    Shurimgreat
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,133 ✭✭✭Shurimgreat


    My understanding and I really only learned this today, is County Councils are responsible for minor and regional roads, whereas the NTA are solely responsible for motorways and major bypasses. The council wouldn't be involved in motorways or bypasses.


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  • #2292
    Sam Russell
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 20,181 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    Ren2k7 wrote: »
    What powers were taken from county council's?

    The ability to be a county councillor and a TD at the same time.


  • #2293
    m17
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,321 ✭✭✭m17


    Sam Russell wrote: »
    The ability to be a county councillor and a TD at the same time.

    Roll on the 26th of February


  • #2294
    Carawaystick
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,779 ✭✭✭Carawaystick


    Shurimgreat wrote: »
    My understanding and I really only learned this today, is County Councils are responsible for minor and regional roads, whereas the NTA are solely responsible for motorways and major bypasses. The council wouldn't be involved in motorways or bypasses.

    You are confusing TII with the NTA, TII is the NRA & RPA.

    Councils (City and County) are involved in Motorways. Dublin City council was the lead for the port tunnel for example.

    The TII aren't responsible for minor roads, but are jointly responsible for national roads


    NTA = National transport Authority
    TII = Transport Infrastructure Ireland
    RPA = Railway Procurement Agency
    NRA = National Roads Authority
    AbS = Alphabet Soup of quangos....


  • #2295
    Shurimgreat
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,133 ✭✭✭Shurimgreat


    Carawaystick wrote: »
    You are confusing TII with the NTA, TII is the NRA & RPA.

    Councils (City and County) are involved in Motorways. Dublin City council was the lead for the port tunnel for example.

    The TII aren't responsible for minor roads, but are jointly responsible for national roads


    NTA = National transport Authority
    TII = Transport Infrastructure Ireland
    RPA = Railway Procurement Agency
    NRA = National Roads Authority
    AbS = Alphabet Soup of quangos....

    I stand corrected! :)


  • #2296
    Schadenfreudia
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 6,995 ✭✭✭Schadenfreudia


    Shurimgreat wrote: »
    Many such towns particularly in Europe also have light rail. Encouraging more cars in Galway is not the answer to these traffic problems.

    This is encouraging more cars to stay out of Galway city centre :rolleyes:

    How many of those towns had their light rail before a bypass (and I'm not referring to trams in the pre-car era)?


  • #2297
    Schadenfreudia
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 6,995 ✭✭✭Schadenfreudia


    m17 wrote: »
    Roll on the 26th of February

    Are the candidates taking a firm stand, for/against the proposed bypass?


  • #2298
    monument
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 14,097 Mod ✭✭✭✭monument


    GDSGR8 wrote: »
    Your points are only partially true, but don't really apply in Galway's case in any event. The geography of Galway, sandwiched between Lough Corrib and the Atlantic Ocean funnels everything through a narrow corridor. There are only four bridges, three of which have very limited capacity. There are essentially only about six effectively operating lanes crossing the bridge at any given time. Dedicating two of those to exclusive public transport use (which is a desirable aim ultimately) isn't really viable as things stand. Another bridge, not constrained by running directly into a medieval street network, is necessary to achieve this.

    Or you could have a new bridge for trams - http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057438782

    Another option of leaving the current city centre bypass to general traffic would be to close one or more of the inner bridges for traffic and have them bus-only with bus priority into and of the city centre.

    There's more than one option or number of things you could do to add to capacity over the river: if they were willing to put in bus lanes linking up to it, they could expand the Father Griffin Road bridge to include bus and cycle lanes or the Bridge Street bridge could accomadate a two-way cycle route if the taxi rank or a traffic lane was removed and if there was willingness to make some of the streets linking into it one-way with parking and a two way cycle path or remove the parking.

    The only thing that has really been looked at is extra roads and Galway's car dependency (including factors like its current messed up bus system) stops meaningful capacity changes which allows for more people to be moved in the current restricted space.
    Schadenfreudia wrote: »
    This is encouraging more cars to stay out of Galway city centre :rolleyes:

    How many of those towns had their light rail before a bypass (and I'm not referring to trams in the pre-car era)?

    Galway has a bypass which does not use any central streets or other confined urban city villages/centres. The plan is to add an outer bypass.

    A lot could be done within the current bypass in terms of walking, cycling and public transport. Galway us a city where there is bus stops in places like outside third level colleges but no save way to cross the road to one of the bus stops.


  • #2299
    Ren2k7
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,161 ✭✭✭Ren2k7


    Sam Russell wrote: »
    The ability to be a county councillor and a TD at the same time.

    How is that relevant to this discussion? spacetweek claimed that transport powers had been transferred from the CoCo's to the NTA, this isn't true. LA have never had any transport powers. It is an arms length quango that had powers transferred from the Dept of Transport to ensure ministers wouldn't be responsible for transport regulation. It SHOULD be abolished and its responsibilities transferred back to the Dept of Transport while local transport handled by local authorities.


  • #2300
    what_traffic
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,172 ✭✭✭what_traffic


    monument wrote: »
    Another option of leaving the current city centre bypass to general traffic would be to close one or more of the inner bridges for traffic and have them bus-only with bus priority into and of the city centre.
    Salmon Weir Bridge is the obvious canidate for this. Huge pedestrian numbers crossing at all hours going from NUIG into the City Centre.

    But a bus gate /bus priority facilities here, widen the footpaths and build cycling facilities.
    Also Eglinton Stree and Eyre Sq should be closed off from Private Car traffic.
    Would make all the bus services that service the North and West of the City more reliable as this is a pinch point for them and encourage more walking and cycling.


  • #2301
    m17
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,321 ✭✭✭m17


    Why can't the build the bypass from oranmore to barna out over galway bay


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