Most Car Clamping completly illegal

mazdafarl · 15-01-2007 05:35PM #1

Its true, I recently fought a case over removing one myself, Given the fact this does not apply to contractors working for the council they ARE protected by the various by-laws and what, anyway my story as follows

I removed a clamp from my car a year ago whilst parked in the front car park of WIT in Waterford and was charged with THEFT and being in possession of stolen property(!!) Anyways I fought it and was brought to court 5 days ago and judge ruled what sentry security was illegal and Im now perfectly entitled to sue for damages(only the council can hire clampers so any car spaces owned privately aren't legally covered to clamp).

I believe this to be the first case of this nature (Im not 100%) although it was said in court that i returned the clamp damaged it was a complete lie-
here is the following technique to remove a illegally clamped car without damaging the clamp-

1. deflate appropiate tyre fully
2. Jack up car
3. with tire deflated it should giv u enough space to push clamp enough to be able to access one of the wheel's nuts
4. Remove nut and rotate wheel for each nut
5. Take off clamp+wheel and put on spare
6. Wheel should be able to be separated with bit of persuasion

DeBeere · 15-01-2007 06:00PM

Nice work! Thanks for the guide

fletch · 15-01-2007 06:03PM

Ditto! Will be giving that a go if I ever get clamped illegally.

Guy:Incognito · 15-01-2007 06:04PM

As a matter of interest, were you pakred where you shouldnt have been?

Would you be happy enough with you rneighbour deciding to park in your driveway and just let it go, or would you do something/expect something to be done?

mazdafarl · 15-01-2007 06:15PM

I was parked where i shouldn't have been yes(the carpark there is always overflowing), but not illegally as because its a private car-park open to the public and therefore isnt covered by any traffic laws and they cant legally touch your property- They can keep it detained sure,maybe do you for trespassing but not clamp it

and your driveway isnt a private car-park open to the public therefor itd be considered tresspassing
and u would call the gards

Trampas · 15-01-2007 06:56PM

I remember hearing aout like this in Scotland or England but i think on that case was that the clampers weren't trained properly in how to clamper the car without damaging it.

Something like that anyway.

Well done

FX Meister · 15-01-2007 06:56PM

What's a gard?

Sizzler · 15-01-2007 07:54PM

So the long and short of it (apart from the useful guide) is that you cant be clamped on private property??

ongarite · 15-01-2007 08:38PM

Hmm must mention this to one of the guys I work with as he has been clamped for parking illegally at Intel twice before.

maidhc · 15-01-2007 09:11PM

Was this in the district court?

In the UK the rule has been that if given prior notice of the possibility of being clamped, it is a breach of contract to remove the clamp.

But well done and fair play!

mazdafarl · 15-01-2007 11:04PM

Ye it was the district court. I mean it obviously could be appealed by them to a higher court but I doubt they would because they failed to produce any laws in their favour - and it has set a precedence

Lorax · 15-01-2007 11:13PM

mazdafarl wrote:

Its true, I recently fought a case over removing one myself, Given the fact this does not apply to contractors working for the council they ARE protected by the various by-laws and what, anyway my story as follows

I removed a clamp from my car a year ago whilst parked in the front car park of WIT in Waterford and was charged with THEFT and being in possession of stolen property(!!) Anyways I fought it and was brought to court 5 days ago and judge ruled what sentry security was illegal and Im now perfectly entitled to sue for damages(only the council can hire clampers so any car spaces owned privately aren't legally covered to clamp).

I believe this to be the first case of this nature (Im not 100%) although it was said in court that i returned the clamp damaged it was a complete lie-
here is the following technique to remove a illegally clamped car without damaging the clamp-

1. deflate appropiate tyre fully
2. Jack up car
3. with tire deflated it should giv u enough space to push clamp enough to be able to access one of the wheel's nuts
4. Remove nut and rotate wheel for each nut
5. Take off clamp+wheel and put on spare
6. Wheel should be able to be separated with bit of persuasion

Dont think that would work on a wheel with hubcaps (which most have) ? Am I right there? Unless u smashed your hubcap..

Our man in Havana · 15-01-2007 11:15PM

Were you aquitted of all charges?

They can't appeal an aquittal.

Was this judge Hartnett by chance?

mazdafarl · 15-01-2007 11:20PM

Case dismissed if that means the same I cant rember the judges name it was in waterford courthouse on thurs 11th-
i suppose if ye had hubcaps itd be harder but ye could try remove it id imagine if not just break them think ye can buy them for 10 squid

Our man in Havana · 15-01-2007 11:22PM

This might curtail their operations in the industrial estate. It will be a big revenue loss for them.

mazdafarl · 15-01-2007 11:32PM

Oh yeah the do lots of places around Waterford , Tescos apartment blocks, I think thats why they pressed charges so if it went in their favour they would have some legal backup - well that idea blew up in their face

Anan1 · 16-01-2007 01:11AM

mazdafarl wrote:

Its true, I recently fought a case over removing one myself, Given the fact this does not apply to contractors working for the council they ARE protected by the various by-laws and what, anyway my story as follows

I removed a clamp from my car a year ago whilst parked in the front car park of WIT in Waterford and was charged with THEFT and being in possession of stolen property(!!) Anyways I fought it and was brought to court 5 days ago and judge ruled what sentry security was illegal and Im now perfectly entitled to sue for damages(only the council can hire clampers so any car spaces owned privately aren't legally covered to clamp).

I believe this to be the first case of this nature (Im not 100%) although it was said in court that i returned the clamp damaged it was a complete lie-
here is the following technique to remove a illegally clamped car without damaging the clamp-

1. deflate appropiate tyre fully
2. Jack up car
3. with tire deflated it should giv u enough space to push clamp enough to be able to access one of the wheel's nuts
4. Remove nut and rotate wheel for each nut
5. Take off clamp+wheel and put on spare
6. Wheel should be able to be separated with bit of persuasion

If stealing were legal would you do that too?

Hotblack Desiato · 16-01-2007 02:00AM

Anan1 wrote:

If stealing were legal would you do that too?

Hardly the point. The point is that private companies are clamping people's property without, it seems, legal grounds to do so. Obeying the law works both ways.

mazdafarl · 16-01-2007 04:01AM

edit: post removed - user banned

cast_iron · 16-01-2007 04:09AM

I really don't think such a tirade of abuse was warranted.

FuzzyWuzzyWazza · 16-01-2007 08:26AM

Anan1 wrote:

If stealing were legal would you do that too?

Hell yeah, if it was a legal activity why the hell wouldn't I do it?????
The only thing that stops most people for stealing in one form or another is that fact that you could get caught and imprisoned.

Fair play to the OP for fighting this, and thanks for the info.

Gregor Samsa · 16-01-2007 08:48AM

cast_iron wrote:

I really don't think such a tirade of abuse was warranted.

I do.

The OP was acquitted of theft in Court. He shouldn't have to put up with being accused of it again here.

Anan1 · 16-01-2007 08:52AM

eidt: mazdafarls abuse removed!

Is this how you felt when you returned to your car to find it clamped? Angry to the point where you forget how to spell even the simplest of words?Perhaps i'm not the first to suggest this, but might you not benefit from some anger management counselling? You might also consider that the people providing a carpark have a perfect moral right to say who can and cannot use it. What you did may not have been illegal, but it was wrong.

Anan1 wrote:

If stealing were legal would you do that too?

FuzzyWuzzyWazza wrote:

Hell yeah, if it was a legal activity why the hell wouldn't I do it?????
The only thing that stops most people for stealing in one form or another is that fact that you could get caught and imprisoned.

Out of interest, how do you feel when people steal from you?

Anan1 · 16-01-2007 08:54AM

phutyle wrote:

I do.

The OP was acquitted of theft in Court. He shouldn't have to put up with being accused of it again here.

Read my post again. S-l-o-w-l-y. Repeat until you get it, it's not complicated.;)

Mr.Diagnostic · 16-01-2007 08:59AM

I'm no legal eagle but I would be surprised if this sets any legal precedent. The OP was charged with theft and the case was dismissed. If it was dismissed on the grounds that the clamping was illegal then maybe it could set a precedent. Does the judgement not have to be recorded first though?

overdriver · 16-01-2007 09:01AM

Calm down dude. That sort of response will get you a ban, sharpish. Anan is always coming in on the side of "the rules", in my experience.

I was clamped outside my girlfriend's apartment once, and the clampers were a private company. Total scum. If I'd known it was technically illegal, I'd have removed the clamp myself. I carry a bolt-cutters for that eventuality in my van.

Not so that I can park illegally, but to combat jobsworths in a sutuation like this. The clampers kept me detained, even though I was playing at a wedding, and they were there throughout. they were verifying the credit card apparently, but it seems the delay is part of one's punishment.

overdriver · 16-01-2007 09:03AM

Anan1 wrote:

Is this how you felt when you returned to your car to find it clamped? Angry to the point where you forget how to spell even the simplest of words?

Are you referring to the gaps he left so the filter wouldn't remove his swearing?

cast_iron · 16-01-2007 09:03AM

Simply put, without knowing alot more facts of the case, you can't draw any conclusions as to what it means to private clamping.

Anan1 · 16-01-2007 09:05AM

overdriver wrote:

Calm down dude. That sort of response will get you a ban, sharpish. Anan is always coming in on the side of "the rules", in my experience.

Hardly, given that "the rules" in this case appear to favour the OP.

Anan1 · 16-01-2007 09:06AM

overdriver wrote:

Are you referring to the gaps he left so the filter wouldn't remove his swearing?

Is this a joke?

overdriver · 16-01-2007 09:13AM

No, I'm saying I've seen worse spelling here, and pulling someone on their spelling is no way to either put your point across or win an argument.

AndrewMc · 16-01-2007 09:13AM

Is it possible that (a) they are actually allowed to clamp you on private property, but (b) if you can "wriggle" out of the clamp without damaging it, you're in the clear? So long as you leave the clamp where it was, you didn't steal it (although I'd take photos in case somebody else came along and knicked it later...).

I would expect that wriggling out of the clamp is illegal when clamped by the council or Gardaí, though.

Mitch Connor · 16-01-2007 09:24AM

Anan1 wrote:

Is this how you felt when you returned to your car to find it clamped? Angry to the point where you forget how to spell even the simplest of words?Perhaps i'm not the first to suggest this, but might you not benefit from some anger management counselling? You might also consider that the people providing a carpark have a perfect moral right to say who can and cannot use it. What you did may not have been illegal, but it was wrong.

Out of interest, how do you feel when people steal from you?

I went to WIT for 4 years, and the car park is a joke. People park all over the place and i have only seen a few clamped (they were blocking fire exits). Unless this is what the OP was doing, fair play. There isn't enough parking in the first place, then they bring in more students!

Anan1 · 16-01-2007 09:30AM

overdriver wrote:

No, I'm saying I've seen worse spelling here, and pulling someone on their spelling is no way to either put your point across or win an argument.

I wouldn't usually point out that someone can't spell. What's interesting here, though, is that the OP's spelling was fine until he/she read my post. Put that together with the rant and you have a clear problem with anger management. Given that this thread is about the removal of clamps, I feel this point to be entirely relevant.

kippy · 16-01-2007 09:30AM

Interesting.
But I'd like to hear the full facts of the judgement/case and possibly ask for some opinion over on the Legal Forum on it-as there are a number of pretty valid points (above) on precidence and what exactly happened here.

The main argument being put forth above is the lack of laws supporting their clamping of cars which are parked without a permit or not parked in a marked parking space and this, based on the above, is limited to private car parks only, as public ones are governed by the local by laws.
If this is the case - are the speed limits and speed bumps which are also in many private car parks not backed with any laws? I suppose it the Gardai that police this so they would have rights in this instance but a private operator would have no rights to clamp cars.

In my opinion, clamping, is overall a GOOD thing so long as the clampers dont abuse their position.

Gregor Samsa · 16-01-2007 09:34AM

Anan1 wrote:

Read my post again. S-l-o-w-l-y. Repeat until you get it, it's not complicated.;)

I'm very sorry. I've re-read you post, and I'd like to humbly withdraw my previous comment and replace it with this measured response:

I do.

The OP was acquitted of theft in Court. He shouldn't have to put up with self-righteous comments that question his moral and ethical integerity.

egan007 · 16-01-2007 09:40AM

Anan1

i don't know what your problem is - It was proved in court it's therefore not illegal

Your daddy a clamper?

Anan1 · 16-01-2007 09:42AM

phutyle wrote:

I'm very sorry. I've re-read you post, and I'd like to humbly withdraw my previous comment and replace it with this measured response:

I do.

The OP was acquitted of theft in Court. He shouldn't have to put up with self-righteous comments that question his moral and ethical integerity.

Moral and ethical integrity? If you read the OP's posts (s-l-o-w-l-y;) ), you'll see that he's already admitted that he "was parked where he shouldn't have been".

Anan1 · 16-01-2007 09:46AM

egan007 wrote:

Anan1

i don't know what your problem is - It was proved in court it's therefore not illegal

Your daddy a clamper?

Where did I say that it was? Read first, then type. And yes, Kevin, my daddy is a clamper.

overdriver · 16-01-2007 09:54AM

Anan1 wrote:

I wouldn't usually point out that someone can't spell. What's interesting here, though, is that the OP's spelling was fine until he/she read my post. Put that together with the rant and you have a clear problem with anger management. Given that this thread is about the removal of clamps, I feel this point to be entirely relevant.

C'mon, man, you're better ( usually) than that. It's a low blow at best. I could point out that there are no hyphens in "slowly" !

egan007 · 16-01-2007 10:04AM

Anan1 wrote:

Where did I say that it was? Read first, then type. And yes, Kevin, my daddy is a clamper.

Anan1 wrote:

If stealing were legal would you do that too?

Seems to imply that you seem to think he did something illegal.
Thanks for the advice, How about you take the box of bees out of your knickers then type

Anan1 · 16-01-2007 10:36AM

Anan1 wrote:

If stealing were legal would you do that too?

egan007 wrote:

Seems to imply that you seem to think he did something illegal.

Eh, no.

Anan1 · 16-01-2007 10:43AM

overdriver wrote:

C'mon, man, you're better ( usually) than that. It's a low blow at best. I could point out that there are no hyphens in "slowly" !

If the guy just couldn't spell then i'd agree completely. And if he hadn't stooped so low then i'd have been able to hit higher.;)

Fey! · 16-01-2007 10:58AM

OP - fair dues for not giving in to them, but you may have just been lucky on the day. Were you being taken to court for theft of the clamp (which you returned top the Gardai by the looks of it), illegal removal of the clamp, illegal parking, trespassing????? And which of these was the "precedent" set for?

OT - Ana1 - any chance that for once you could stay on topic without reverting to the you-can't-spell argument? It sounds like something you'd hear in a national school playground.

Anan1 · 16-01-2007 11:10AM

Fey! wrote:

OT - Ana1 - any chance that for once you could stay on topic without reverting to the you-can't-spell argument? It sounds like something you'd hear in a national school playground.

If you could take the time to actually read what I said you would see that my argument is that just because something is not illegal does not necessarily mean that it is right. There is no "you-can't-spell argument", I simply made the point that forgetting how to spell, in conjunction with the content of the OP's post directed at me, is indicative of an unhealthy level of anger.

testicle · 16-01-2007 11:15AM

Lorax wrote:

Dont think that would work on a wheel with hubcaps (which most have) ? Am I right there? Unless u smashed your hubcap..

Only cheap ass steel wheels have hubcaps :-)

Fey! · 16-01-2007 11:15AM

Anan1 wrote:

If you could take the time to actually read what I said you would see that my argument is that just because something is not illegal does not necessarily mean that it is right. There is no "you-can't-spell argument", I simply made the point that forgetting how to spell, in conjunction with the content of the OP's post directed at me, is indicative of an unhealthy level of anger.

Unfortunately, with the tangents you go off on, everybody soon begins to forget your original points. If you look at the last few posts directed toward you you will see this. So maybe you should try clear and simple.

OP - Sorry for the OT intrusion.

Anan1 · 16-01-2007 11:20AM

Fey! wrote:

Unfortunately, with the tangents you go off on, everybody soon begins to forget your original points. If you look at the last few posts directed toward you you will see this. So maybe you should try clear and simple.

OP - Sorry for the OT intrusion.

Thanks for the advice. Perhaps you could simply ignore any of my posts which are not "clear and simple" enough for you from now on?

WhiteWashMan · 16-01-2007 12:24PM

can you all shut the fúck up and get on with the point of this thread.

and its not someone's spelling, the issue of theft, or whos daddy is a clamper.

normally, id ban a few people here, but im feeling in a good mood today. please dont ruin it becuase i will go back and ban people retorospectively.

i will take any further post here as acceptance of this.

and have a nice day

Seth Brundle · 16-01-2007 03:50PM

phutyle wrote:

I do.

The OP was acquitted of theft in Court. He shouldn't have to put up with being accused of it again here.

He has the right to defend himself alright but not to get abusive!

mazdafarl has got himself a 1 week ban for it!*

*done after reading whitewashman's post but then again Im not in a good mood like him!

cpoh1 · 16-01-2007 04:14PM

kbannon wrote:

He has the right to defend himself alright but not to get abusive!

mazdafarl has got himself a 1 week ban for it!*

*done after reading whitewashman's post but then again Im not in a good mood like him!

To be honest with you, although mazdafari was more blatent in his attack, anan1 was just as petty, spiteful and malicious in his posts towards the op and deserved a ban too. After all he did ruin a decent thread.

Most Car Clamping completly illegal

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