Bitten by a dog, Whats the protocol?

califano · 31-03-2007 09:59AM #1

I was attacked by 2 dogs and bitten by one of them during a run on the beach. Im not an animal owner which makes being ran at speed by delerious barking dogs even more frightning. The dogs 3 of them were in the company of their owner and running free. As soon as they seen me 2 of them came hurtling and barking furiously at me. The most agressive of which and the one who bit me looked like a half breed of a jack russel by the looks of him. He got his teeth into my leg but didnt break the skin so i dont know if this counts as a bite?.
After letting my displeasure known to the owner without swearing or being agressive i was prepared to just forget it and started to jog off but the dogs started up again running agrressively at me and barking. I had no other option but to lash out at the dogs by kicking out and they backed off a little when i took this action but it didnt stop them having a few more snaps around my feet.
The woman owner was by now at her car taking leads out but when i challenged her about her taking no action to call the dogs off she got nasty in a verbal way. I told her the dog did bite me and im persuing it starting with taking her reg plate number which i did. She loaded the dogs in the car and whizzed off by me with the window down shouting out at me to get a life and weirdo etc.

So could i have taken a different course of action bearing in mind i have no expierence around animals especially animals acting agressively?. To whom can i report the incident if i decide to report it?.

shane_by · 31-03-2007 10:10AM

Report it to the gardai. A bite is a bite and the bitch (the owner not the dog) didn't even have the good grace to apologise to you. It's good that you have the car reg which means the guards can follow it up.

peasant · 31-03-2007 10:27AM

First off ...this should not have happened, and I'm sorry that it happened to you.

The dog didn't "bite" you ...you would have felt that one ...it "snapped".
It still shouldn't have done that, though.

It is the responsibility of the owner to keep dogs under control at all times.
For a possible report, I guess your local dog warden would be the first port of call. Depending on the dog warden, he will either give the owner a stern talking to (and possibly order the dog in question to be muzzled), or he will have the dog put down, or he will do nothing at all ...It could go either way.

My advice would be to hold out on the reporting this time, but keep a firm eye on this owner and if you see that she hasn't learned from this, then by all means report her. (Having the leads in the car instead of with her would be a clear sign that she hasn't learned)

Some advice what to do if you find yourself in a similar situation again (to avoid being bitten):

Stop running!

Anything that runs is an invitation to dogs to chase it. Especially so, if there is a bunch of them. They get carried away with the chase and are very hard to recall ...even dogs that normally follow commands very well.

So the next time you're out running and are approched by dogs off the lead, stop running and give the owner a chance to recall them.

Any owner that doesn't respond to this deserves to be reported.

califano · 31-03-2007 10:49AM

Thanks thats good advice peasant. I will take your advice and wont report to the gardai anyway. Yeah the dog definately snapped and didnt bite even though i did feel his teeth but he didnt clench so i guess this is termed a snap. It didnt leave a mark anyways.
What you mentioned about 'anything that runs is an invitation to dogs to chase' makes sense because ive watched in the distance seemingly placid dogs off the lead with their owners but when i approach running by they often bound im my direction most just in a hyper way but others in a more agressive way.
Actually earlier on the same run there was a boxer dog ahead and i did slow down and when the owner spotted me they fastened a lead which was good but usually you would be just left waiting if you were expecting every owner to be good enough to do this.
You mentioned a local dog warden. Ive never seen or heard of this. How do i go about contacting my local dog warden, where can they be found?.

I might just give up running on the beach as this hasnt been the first time.

peasant · 31-03-2007 11:02AM

If you ring your local county council, they should be able to give you the number of the dog warden.

Finding a different place to run might be a good idea

Dogs and joggers don't really mix that well (as you know) but there are very few places where a dog can be let run off lead reasonably safely, beaches usually are the last refuge.
So if you'd rather avoid dogs, the beach isn't the best place to be.

I'd like to commend you for your attitude, by the way. It is not usual to find people these days who understand that it takes a bit of give and take on both sides. Most seem to be hell bent on pushing through with their perceived "rights" ...be that letting their dog run wherever they like or be that running wherever they please.

Tiesto · 31-03-2007 11:08AM

I would definitely take this further for the simple reason that the women was such an ignorant bitch

wexford12 · 31-03-2007 11:50AM

peasant wrote:

Finding a different place to run might be a good idea

Dogs and joggers don't really mix that well (as you know) but there are very few places where a dog can be let run off lead reasonably safely, beaches usually are the last refuge.
So if you'd rather avoid dogs, the beach isn't the best place to be.

I'd like to commend you for your attitude, by the way. It is not usual to find people these days who understand that it takes a bit of give and take on both sides. Most seem to be hell bent on pushing through with their perceived "rights" ...be that letting their dog run wherever they like or be that running wherever they please.

Peasant i cant belive what advice you have givin the woman was bitten or snapped at.It is her choice to jog on a beach and its agenst the law to let your dog to run free.I am a animal lover but i woundnt have a dog that bites simple as that.I would report this woman to the guards straight away there is no excuse for what happened.I would nearly think Peasant is the owner or knows the owner by her advice!

fits · 31-03-2007 12:37PM

wexford12 wrote:

Peasant i cant belive what advice you have givin the woman was bitten or snapped at.It is her choice to jog on a beach and its agenst the law to let your dog to run free.I am a animal lover but i woundnt have a dog that bites simple as that.I would report this woman to the guards straight away there is no excuse for what happened.I would nearly think Peasant is the owner or knows the owner by her advice!

Peasant is a he, and it is not against the law to have your dogs off lead, it is against the law not to have them 'under control'. This woman reacted badly, and it is these people who give the rest of us dog owners a bad name. It is kind of essential to be able to let the dogs have a blast off the lead every now and then, very difficult in the city.
If this happens to the OP again, I'd report the owner. What if the jogger was a child?

Rigsby · 31-03-2007 02:30PM

peasant wrote:

Finding a different place to run might be a good idea

Dogs and joggers don't really mix that well (as you know) but there are very few places where a dog can be let run off lead reasonably safely, beaches usually are the last refuge.
So if you'd rather avoid dogs, the beach isn't the best place to be.

Peasant, your normally excellent advice has let you down this time with the above statement. Why should dogs and their owners have the monopoly on the beach ? Anybody should have the right to use the beach as they see fit without the risk of injury from dogs owned by careless people. If dogs and joggers dont mix then all the more reason to ensure the former are kept under control. I say this as a dog owner myself.

Jotter · 31-03-2007 03:29PM

I thought peasants post was a good one, although I do think the op should continue to jog on the beach as is his/her right!

The dog didnt bite, it snapped, not good but if the dog is reported theres a good chance the dog will be put down, the owner wont be punished, the dog will and whats the point in that?

If I saw her around again with the dogs off the lead, then I would report her, I wouldnt say that the dog bit you bec he didnt, Id say he acted aggressively and the owner responded aggressively to you. I know someone who did this and the guards came and spoke to the owner giving them a warning. This might be enough to make her think twice about letting them off the lead again.

I totally agree with the advice to stop running - I encountered a jogger in the park while my previous dog was off the lead, instead of either stopping or continuing she ran around a tree screaming that shes always getting bitten by dogs and that shes scared of them. I got the dog on the lead quick enough considering he thought it was a game and was chasing her, tail wagging away, but I wasnt at all surprised at her comment about having been bitten a few times!

I think youve a good attitude too, fair play!

peasant · 31-03-2007 04:01PM

Rigsby wrote:

Peasant, your normally excellent advice has let you down this time with the above statement. Why should dogs and their owners have the monopoly on the beach ? Anybody should have the right to use the beach as they see fit without the risk of injury from dogs owned by careless people. If dogs and joggers dont mix then all the more reason to ensure the former are kept under control. I say this as a dog owner myself.

You are of course right ...in principle.

The OP suggested himself that he might go running elsewhere, so he doesn't seem too put out by the idea.

A beach (at certain times) is a place where you will encounter dogs. So why run there, if you don't particularly like your run being interrupted by them all the time and you don't mind running elswhere?

Beach or no beach ...it is not a good idea to be running past dogs, that are off the lead. Dogs have the right to be off lead as long as they are under control. If you're running you have to stop in order to allow the dog owner to excercise that control.
So if you want to run continously rather than stop-start every five minutes, a place full of dogs is not a good place to do so.

Because if one were to turn your argument around, as soon as one jogger enters the beach, all dogs would have to be put on lead immediatedly ... effectively giving the beach monopoly to the jogger ...which (in fairness) wouldn't be right either.

A sensible dog owner will avoid busy times on the beach to give his/her dogs a run ...a sensible jogger will run elsewhere.

And nobody is put out too much. That's what they call compromise and it works well. Only when people start insisting on their "God given rights" at all times and in all places (dog owners and non-dog owners alike) is when misunderstanding and conflict happens.

And to all the joggers (cyclists and skaters) out there:
Even if the dog is on a lead, please do not run past it very closely, give it a wide berth. Even the most placid dog may react to someone running past ...especially from behind and in surprise.
They can't help it ...they are hunters after all and they have ingrained instincts that they act upon.

Schlemm · 31-03-2007 04:19PM

On the legal side of things, the legislation you can read is the Control of Dogs Act 1986 and you can get it on the internet:
http://www.irishstatutebook.ie/ZZA32Y1986.html
Now obviously a solicitor will know more about this side of things, but it's worth a read anyhoo.
Prob too late to get a swab from the bite but sometimes if the owner challenges your accusations they may need to do some DNA testing of saliva to verify which dog went for you, in case they are going to euthanise the dog and since there was more than 1 dog involved.

Defo agree that the OP has a great attitude in this case, some ppl get very hot headed and reactive. Not all dogs will chase after joggers, so just keep an eye on them if you're out running, I go running myself in the park near my house and it's full of dogs, u just have to be wary if one comes flying for you. The vast majority of dogs are well behaved and under control, u just have to be on your guard.

Don't let the experience put you off, just be aware of what dogs are like and what signs to look out for. The reason they chase after joggers is cos they're predators and it's hardwired into their brain to chase after fast moving objects. This is why dogs often chase cars and run after balls and sticks. If you see a dog hurtling itself at you at a rate of knots, or bearing its teeth/barking/snapping, heading for your ankles, it is a good idea to stop and ignore the dog, don't make eye contact with it and turn away from it. Sometimes pups who are off the lead may be more prone to messing about but they're usually less harmless than adult dogs, but be wary anyways. Now if a dog is trained properly and it's owner is watching out for it, the dog won't chase after you, and if it does it's the owner's fault for not being responsible. That owner was such an eejit to act the way she did and IMO such people shouldn't be allowed to own dogs in the first place.

califano · 31-03-2007 06:31PM

Thanks for all the advice and info. This incident actually happened this morning on Dollymount strand. After reading all entries and thinking about it ive decided not to persue it. Im sure the dogs mean a lot to her so i'd hate to think a complaint could be responsible for the dog to be euthanaised.
I also felt the owners attitude was bad but i wasnt too impressed at myself by kicking out at the dog either even though i got nowhere close!. My actions were part of the reason i posted in the first place. I was just glad all three dogs didnt go all out or me after that!.

Nala · 31-03-2007 10:04PM

You shouldn't feel bad for kicking it if it attacked you. You have to defend yourself.

doctor evil · 31-03-2007 10:39PM

I say report it, the owner sounds terrible. A well trained under control animal is not one that will run off while on the lead.

Jesus Wept · 31-03-2007 10:47PM

All Jack Russell terriers should not be allowed to breed in my opinion. Every one of them I have ever encountered are nasty snapping bitting little aggresive dangerous bastards, and no, I have not
been unlucky, this is their character.

And I do not run/have a fear of dogs/have this problem with other dogs/dislike dogs.

peasant · 31-03-2007 11:19PM

All Jack Russels (and their mixes) ??

This one as well?

Jesus Wept · 01-04-2007 12:10AM

peasant wrote:

All Jack Russels (and their mixes) ??

This one as well?

I stated terriors. I'm no dog expert, but I know the type I mean, I'm sure we all do, I can't be the only one to of noticed that they are made up of evil genes.

They seem like a mongrol, I guess they just keep breading amongst themselves and should have their own breed name applied.

They are disgusting in appearance, violent, and dangerous.

Here is a decent example...

With that said, I do like dogs generally, normal ones that don't attempt to draw blood of every human/other dog/creature they come into contact with.

tallus · 01-04-2007 09:13AM

My sister had a Jack Russell that was as tame as anything. Guess she was lucky ?

Saruman · 01-04-2007 09:23AM

If i were you i would report it and ask if someone will go talk to her but not to pursue it further. Just to warn her to keep her dogs under control in future so next time she will have the leads with her. Had she had them with her she should have put them on the dogs after the first attack so the second would not have happened.

Next time it happens, if it does then run at the dogs and they will back down.

luckat · 01-04-2007 09:34AM

Rounders - I walk my dog on Sandymount Strand all the time. It's flocking with runners, and she doesn't chase them or bite them - she's too busy chasing the ball I'm throwing. Runners are simply of no interest.

My suggestion: let it go this time, as it was a snap, not a bite.

When I used to cycle on roads full of aggressive dogs I carried - a couple of small boxes of pepper with me, and if dogs came at me, I threw the pepper at them. It hurt, but didn't do any permanent damage, and gave me time to get out of there.

(This was also the method of Emily Bronte, a doggy woman, when walking her dogs on the moors.)

peasant · 01-04-2007 09:45AM

The-Rigger wrote:

I stated terriors. I'm no dog expert, but I know the type I mean, I'm sure we all do, I can't be the only one to of noticed that they are made up of evil genes.

They seem like a mongrol, I guess they just keep breading amongst themselves and should have their own breed name applied.

They are disgusting in appearance, violent, and dangerous.

With that said, I do like dogs generally, normal ones that don't attempt to draw blood of every human/other dog/creature they come into contact with.

Terriers were once bred to go to ground (terra), i.e. follow rats, foxes and even badgers into their hideouts and kill them.

They are energetic, strong, clever, fearless little creatures ...a very much full-on dog in a little package.

Properly trained, socialised and controlled they are a joy to have and very entertaining.

Their size is their downfall though.
Because every Tom, Dick and Harry ( or should I say Paris, Britney and Samantha?) thinks they can have and keep one. Sure, they're only small, how much effort can it take to control and train them?

The so called "evil" dogs you're talking about ...they're not evil by nature ...they're bored, undisciplined, untrained and uncontrolled.

Hardly their fault, now is it ?

peasant · 01-04-2007 09:55AM

luckat wrote:

When I used to cycle on roads full of aggressive dogs I carried - a couple of small boxes of pepper with me, and if dogs came at me, I threw the pepper at them. It hurt, but didn't do any permanent damage, and gave me time to get out of there.

(This was also the method of Emily Bronte, a doggy woman, when walking her dogs on the moors.)

Whoa !
Be very careful with that sort of advice.
Yes, most dogs will yelp and stop what they're doing when they feel pain (be it pepper or something else) ...but get the wrong dog and you'll "achieve" the exact opposite ...it'll go for you, no matter what the consequences.

A dog running out of a yard after a fast moving object (cyclist, jogger) usually isn't "aggressive" (even though it might sound like it), it's excited.
Stop running/cycling and the excitment is over.

Hurt that dog and it WILL get aggressive, and then you will now what an agressive dog really looks and feels like

luckat · 01-04-2007 11:21AM

Read my post carefully and you'll see that the only advice I give is to let it go.

I simply state that I used to carry pepper when cycling; I don't advise anyone to follow my example.

eth0_ · 01-04-2007 11:29AM

OP I am shocked to hear you are letting this go! I would go so far as to say it is your social responsibility to report this woman to the gardai. She didn't give a toss that you were BITTEN by her nasty, untrained dogs, and verbally abused you for taking down her reg number.

This will only happen again, possibly to a child and possibly with further damage done.

IMO dogs/horses should be banned from heavily populated areas of the beach, there is too much of a risk to the public.

luckat · 01-04-2007 01:09PM

Risk to the public? My dog has never bitten anyone, nor do I know anyone who's been bitten by a dog on the beach.

99.99999% of dogs are pleasant and well-trained, and kept by sensible owners. Very occasionally there's a fool like the dog owner mentioned. It doesn't mean all dogs, or all horses should be banned.

Hey, I heard of a woman being raped on a beach. All men should definitely be banned from beaches, woods, streets, and anywhere that women walk. They should be brought to work in male-only buses.

**fume**

Rigsby · 01-04-2007 02:43PM

luckat wrote:

99.99999% of dogs are pleasant and well-trained, and kept by sensible owners.

This is far from true in my experience. Once when walking my dog on the leash in St Ann's in Clontarf she was attacked by two airdales who were off the lead. When the owner caught up, far from apologising, I was verbally abused for trying to protect my dog by lashing out ( she is small). He even threathened to sue ME

Also in my local area I frequently come across three not -so -friendly dogs out roaming freely on the street. One always growls as I pass. I know it is the owners and not the dog's fault. Maybe I'm just unlucky, but this is my experience.

Jesus Wept · 01-04-2007 03:43PM

peasant wrote:

Terriers were once bred to go to ground (terra), i.e. follow rats, foxes and even badgers into their hideouts and kill them.

They are energetic, strong, clever, fearless little creatures ...a very much full-on dog in a little package.

Properly trained, socialised and controlled they are a joy to have and very entertaining.

Their size is their downfall though.
Because every Tom, Dick and Harry ( or should I say Paris, Britney and Samantha?) thinks they can have and keep one. Sure, they're only small, how much effort can it take to control and train them?

The so called "evil" dogs you're talking about ...they're not evil by nature ...they're bored, undisciplined, untrained and uncontrolled.

Hardly their fault, now is it ?

No, I guess it's not, but whose fault it is doesn't really occur to me when 99% of the ones I encounter try to maim me.

It does seem that the majority of these dog owners are knackerish scum who don't give a sh1t, or kids whose parents who don't give a sh1t and have given them the dog.

Little-Devil · 01-04-2007 03:58PM

shane_by wrote:

Report it to the gardai. A bite is a bite and the bitch (the owner not the dog) didn't even have the good grace to apologise to you. It's good that you have the car reg which means the guards can follow it up.

I would have reported it even if the dogs hadn't have chased you the second time. The owner clearly has no control over her dogs otherwise she would have called them back. I think in general Jack Russell's have a nasty streak and can be quite aggressive.

I have a mongrel dog myself and when i bring it for a walk i always make sure it has a muzzle and its on a lead, i just wont take the chance with young children walking around or anyone for that sake, not that im saying it would attack, but i always believe its the owner responsibility no matter what the circumstances are and you can’t have dogs running around on free will either.

You might also need a testiness shot if though you say the bite didn't break the skin, no point in taking a chance.

Beelzebub · 01-04-2007 04:49PM

This happened to me while walking in the city centre some years ago. It was a stray labrador cross. It got me on the calf muscle, left teeth marks but didn't break skin. I shook it off and shouted at it then it ran away.
No owner present so nothing I could do and anyway what could I have done?
At least you have the owner's registration.

You can and you should report this.

Between June 1st and September 30th on some beaches it's actually illegal to walk a dog:

http://www.dlrcoco.ie/env/Updated/DOGHORSE.htm#control

Meanwhile pick up one of these or similar: http://www.maplin.co.uk/searchtemplate.asp?criteria=DOG%20SCARER

Good luck and be safe in your running.

iguana · 01-04-2007 06:17PM

Little-Devil wrote:

I have a mongrel dog myself and when i bring it for a walk i always make sure it has a muzzle and its on a lead,

Most dogs need to be walked off lead daily. Depending on the breed they will need a level of excercise that they will not get while on a lead, even if they are owned by Sonia O'Sullivan. Unless you have several acres of a garden.

They also develop valuable socialisation skills while off lead that they (and the people around them) are at a disadvantage without. Obviously they won't learn much without an owner who can control and train them properly, but not giving most types of dogs off lead exercise is every bit as much bad ownership as the type of owner the op encountered.

peasant · 01-04-2007 06:21PM

Beelzebub wrote:

Meanwhile pick up one of these or similar: http://www.maplin.co.uk/searchtemplate.asp?criteria=DOG%20SCARER

Don't !

As for why ...see my post above on using pepper.

These "dog scarers" do exactly what it says on the tin ...they scare the dog by creating pain in its ears.
Some dogs react to being scared and hurt by running away ...others react with a full blown attack :eek:
(Same as people, really)

Jotter · 01-04-2007 08:02PM

The-Rigger wrote:

No, I guess it's not, but whose fault it is doesn't really occur to me when 99% of the ones I encounter try to maim me.

.

Im not a fan of little dogs in general as Ive been bitten by plenty and a lot do come across as snappy but I think this is a size issue rather than an evil gene. Little dogs live in a big world so I think you just have to go easy on the approach esp when petting, and I wouldnt be gone on having one as a pet with kids around as imo they dont generally have enough patience, every kid I know growing up (inc myself) has been snapped at or bitten by a little dog. I have a feeling it might be part of natures learning curve or something!
Its not like me at all to stick up for little doggy rats but I did meet 5 lovely JRT's in a country pub across from my parents house, all were full of personality and happy to trot around the pub from person to person, you wouldnt cuddle one mind you but they did make me see beyond the teeth for a change and Id even go so far as to say Im quite fond of them so dont write off all little mutts just yet!

Jesus Wept · 01-04-2007 08:39PM

Jotter wrote:

Im not a fan of little dogs in general as Ive been bitten by plenty and a lot do come across as snappy but I think this is a size issue rather than an evil gene. Little dogs live in a big world so I think you just have to go easy on the approach esp when petting, and I wouldnt be gone on having one as a pet with kids around as imo they dont generally have enough patience, every kid I know growing up (inc myself) has been snapped at or bitten by a little dog. I have a feeling it might be part of natures learning curve or something!
Its not like me at all to stick up for little doggy rats but I did meet 5 lovely JRT's in a country pub across from my parents house, all were full of personality and happy to trot around the pub from person to person, you wouldnt cuddle one mind you but they did make me see beyond the teeth for a change and Id even go so far as to say Im quite fond of them so dont write off all little mutts just yet!

Fair point, I still support the evil gene idea, chance of a Jack Russel Terrior like the one I pictured seems to be 95%+, not sure what the % would be of a non Jack Russell Terrior, but small dog otherwise, far lower!

Gillie · 02-04-2007 10:01AM

peasant wrote:

A sensible dog owner will avoid busy times on the beach to give his/her dogs a run

Sums it up right there!
I personally avoid crowded places with my dog!

As for the legality of dogs in open spaces. There are places where you are instructed to keep your dog on a lead.

That woman is a disgrace! If i'm out with the dog and I meet ppl I will put the dog on the lead. It's manners and not a huge inconvenience to me!

EVERYONE has the right to use the beaches for recreation.
The OP has the right to jog there in peace and the person walking with or without their dogs have the right to do so also. (Bear in mind that there are ppl who verbally attack ppl with dogs even when nothing happens AND even if the dog is on a lead!)

Anyway. Sorry to hear about that experience OP. You have a good attitude though! Good for you.

Beelzebub · 02-04-2007 10:05AM

peasant wrote:

Don't !

As for why ...see my post above on using pepper.

These "dog scarers" do exactly what it says on the tin ...they scare the dog by creating pain in its ears.
Some dogs react to being scared and hurt by running away ...others react with a full blown attack :eek:
(Same as people, really)

Wasn't aware of that. You're speaking from experience? About the sonic device I mean?

golden · 02-04-2007 10:33AM

At the end of the day the lady should have kepted her dogs under control if they do not come to command they should be on a lead, however if the dogs get reported they would be put to sleep so why do the dogs have to suffer just because someone can not control the dogs.

peasant · 02-04-2007 10:51AM

Beelzebub wrote:

Wasn't aware of that. You're speaking from experience? About the sonic device I mean?

No, I've never used one nor have seen one being used.
But I don't need to, to know that on some dogs the infliction of pain will achieve the exact opposite of the intended result.

It's the same as with people. If you meet an obnoxious person in the street and you clout them one ...50 % will do a runner, the other 50% will go on an all out counter attack.

Dogs will react exactly the same on being threatend/hurt/attacked
Self defence instincts kick in (and it doesn't matter ift hey are triggered by fear or aggression) and the dog will go into attack mode.

Exactly what you wanted to avoid in the first place.

anniehoo · 02-04-2007 11:03AM

Im actually shocked at the so called responsible dog owners here saying not to report this incident as it was only a "snap" not a "bite"! A snap to an adult will be the equivalent of a very very dangerous bite to a child! Any dog with agressive tendencies should not be let off lead if it cannot be controlled! The law states in a public place your dog should be under control (not necessarily on a lead), but should respond to your command to heal if required! This dog owner is probably well used to her dogs behaving like this and no doubt she is continuing to get away with it as people like yourself wont report it! Please report this to the gardaí, even if they dont do anything at least you will be safe in the knowledge that if *god forbid* these animals bit a child, you tried to do something about it!

peasant · 02-04-2007 11:34AM

anniehoo wrote:

Im actually shocked at the so called responsible dog owners here saying not to report this incident as it was only a "snap" not a "bite"! A snap to an adult will be the equivalent of a very very dangerous bite to a child!

I don't want to defend that woman in any way ...what she did (or rather didn't do) was wrong and reprehensible.

But pleeeease, spare us the "won't anyone think of the children" - hype.

A snap is a snap and a bite is a bite.

That little dog was acting the boll*cks, it should definetly have been under control and it shouldn't have been given the opportunity to snap at the jogger.

But snap is all it did.

And I repeat myself ...a snap is a snap!
Human skin breaks very easily, no matter what age or size the human is. Blood flows just as easily out of a fit, adult joggers as it does out of a little child.

So please, don't overhype this.

That snap to a child would have done no more harm than it did to the jogger.

Once again, I'm not trying to defend or belittle what happened, but I'm a bit allergic to things getting blown all out of proportion as soon as somebody mentions children.

Let's stay reasonable here, ok?

anniehoo · 02-04-2007 11:52AM

....mmmm spot the one with no kids!!!

peasant · 02-04-2007 12:00PM

anniehoo wrote:

....mmmm spot the one with no kids!!!

I knew that was going to come next

All right then ...super -mom ...how about reporting all men that smile at children ...they're probably paedophiles !!

Or how about banning lollipops ...I know of one child that suffocated on one.

Or maybe we should all stop driving cars ...jeez ...think of all the children that get killed in traffic every year.

Proportion, my dear, proportion ... and staying within it ...ok?

lightening · 02-04-2007 12:48PM

I got bitten twice as a kid, stitches in one case. (taking a bone off my uncles dog!) I also fell out of a tree, skateboarded in to a wall, fell in to the Shannon, stood on a nail and got knocked down by a car. The walls, trees, roads, and even the Shannon is still there.

I walk my dogs in the park and the amount of kids that are terrified of dogs is amazing. Some of them scream and cry at the sight of a dog. I once heard a parent tell their kid that the dog would bite them! What's that about? Why are suburban parents getting so overprotective? The kids are going to grow up scared.

(oh, and fair play to the OP, I wish all joggers were like him/her)

Jotter · 02-04-2007 02:55PM

anniehoo wrote:

....mmmm spot the one with no kids!!!

I have an 8 mth old son and a 7 yr old stepson and I said not to report dog. the dog was small and yappy and it snapped or nipped. If the dog was a threat to society it would have bitten and the OP wouldnt have jogged on theyd be in too much pain. the owner was the problem here, reporting the dog for biting would have ment the dog could be destroyed, the owner is free to keep the rest of her dogs and or get a new one so whats the point in that? I think legislation needs to be brought in with regard to dog ownership but thats a thread for another day!

Gillie · 02-04-2007 03:04PM

If the dog had bitten and was reported then he could be destroyed!
If he only snapped then maybe not.

Either way that woman should have had control of the dog.

fits · 02-04-2007 04:00PM

Jotter wrote:

I think legislation needs to be brought in with regard to dog ownership but thats a thread for another day!

Well sign the petition mentioned in another thread, if you havent already. Legislation really does need to be brought in. The dog (and cat and horse to a lesser extent) situation in Ireland is appalling.

random_banter · 02-04-2007 09:42PM

TBH I would reccomend that you report the incident to the gardai/dog warden. The woman clearly has no control over her dogs and doesnt understand their behaviour, and if she needs a warning from the dog warden to get her ass into gear, so be it.

I'm a dog owner myself, and I know all of the posters here seem like very responsibe owners- we all know our own dogs well and can predict their behavior to some extent I would presume?

For example I have a huge, gorgeous, energetic 1 year old black lab. He's wired! He's also got the most gentle nature and has never shown any sign of having any aggressiveness, never growls, snaps or bites, anything. But he is very exciteable and gets very hyper when people visit the house, he meets new dogs etc he goes mental, runs up to them and jumps up and down etc. For someone who isnt used to dogs, this could easily be interpreted as aggressiveness and a person could easily get a fright, but I am aware of this and so I am careful.

Since I know his behaviour well I know that if he were to be let run free on a beach he would DEFINITELY run up and get excited over a jogger like the OP, and as a result I walk him at quiet times of the day, and early in the morning or late at night on the beach, or in open areas to run free. I always have my eye on him and at the first sign that hes going to get excited over someone he's called straight back to me and is on the leash so I can have greater control of him. I'm hoping that he's starting to calm down a bit and we are continously practicing letting him run away then calling him back to sit etc and basic obedience, and he is improving which is a relief! Anyway we are very careful with him, as his own friendliness could land him in alot of trouble with someone who isnt used to his excitement.

The woman on the beach who lets her dogs run wild like that needs to get some cop on (she doesnt understand her own dogs behaviour and doesnt know when to control them) and if this comes in the form of a warning from the gardai/dog warden then so be it. And I also agree that could well have been a child running around on the beach and i'm sure it would have been viewed as a more serious incident then!

iguana · 02-04-2007 09:57PM

lightening wrote:

I walk my dogs in the park and the amount of kids that are terrified of dogs is amazing. Some of them scream and cry at the sight of a dog. I once heard a parent tell their kid that the dog would bite them! What's that about? Why are suburban parents getting so overprotective? The kids are going to grow up scared.

I live in an area which is generally believed to be the most multi-cultural square mile in the world. So at least half the people I encounter are from cultures where dog owning is either unheard of, or taboo as touching an unclean creature ( a dog) can have you banned from heaven. It can be absolute hell.

I get screamed at by people 40ft away to keep my dogs away from them, even though my dogs are on their leads and I am not going in their direction. People scream and run around in crazy circles, stomping their feet up and down which makes my dogs think they are playing a game, especially when they were younger. And they are only 9 months old now, so pretty much still pups, but they have learned to ignore people now, unless they think an exciting game is going on.

I honestly believe that how to act around a dog should be thought in schools or on entry to a country with high dog ownership. Just basic things such as screaming and running away is just about the stupidest thing you can do around a dog as you will only attract it to you. I've actually started giving people who are open to it a few impromtu lessons when they freak out, to varying degrees of success.

To top it off, I have had complete dumbasses who have uncontrolable, aggressive dogs scream at me to keep my dog away because their dog attacks. They don't seem to think that if their dog is aggressive, they should be the one taking measures to control it. A lot of these guys seem to be appearing now that the weather is improving as apparently they don't walk their dogs in winter. And these muppets don't do any favours to the people who own dogs or those who are afraid of them.

lightening · 03-04-2007 08:56AM

iguana wrote:

I get screamed at by people 40ft away to keep my dogs away from them

That's mad, are your dogs German Shepards or Rothweilers? I had to shepard two African girls around a playful boxer in Marino once, they were terrified of him, really scared, one of them was shaking.

stovelid · 03-04-2007 09:17AM

The-Rigger wrote:

All Jack Russell terriers should not be allowed to breed in my opinion. Every one of them I have ever encountered are nasty snapping bitting little aggresive dangerous bastards, and no, I have not
been unlucky, this is their character.

And I do not run/have a fear of dogs/have this problem with other dogs/dislike dogs.

My best mate had a jack russell for years and he was fine. Prone to get very excited and very quick to chase people/cats/cars but a good natured dog and never bit.

Saruman · 03-04-2007 09:37AM

peasant wrote:

Don't !

As for why ...see my post above on using pepper.

These "dog scarers" do exactly what it says on the tin ...they scare the dog by creating pain in its ears.
Some dogs react to being scared and hurt by running away ...others react with a full blown attack :eek:
(Same as people, really)

Im curious.. would a Dog even know the source of this pain? I mean it emits a noise but i would not think the dog would associate the noise with a human.... I could be wrong.

Bitten by a dog, Whats the protocol?

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