Stopping Power and Sniping

Seifer · 17-01-2008 01:55PM #1

Damage modifiers with sniper rifles copied from a gamespot thread:

,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,Head,,,,,Neck,,,,,Torso,,,,Stomach,,,,,,Limbs
M40,,,,,,,,,,,,,,1.5x ,,,,,,,,,1.5x ,,,,,,1.1x ,,,,,,,,,1.1x ,,,,,,,,,,,,,1.0x
M21,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,1.5x ,,,,,,,,1.1x ,,,,,1.1x ,,,,,,,,,1.0x,,,,,,,,,,,,,,1.0x
Dragu,,,,,,,,,,,1.5x ,,,,,,,,,1.5x ,,,,,,1.5x ,,,,,,,,1.0x ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,1.0x
R7000,,,,,,,,, 1.5x ,,,,,,,,,1.5x ,,,,,,1.5x ,,,,,,,,1.1x ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,1.0x
Barrett ,,,,,,,,,1.5x ,,,,,,,,,1.5x ,,,,,,1.5x ,,,,,,,,1.1x,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,1.0x

1.5x = 1 hit kill if they don't have juggernaut and you don't have stopping. You have stopping, it's ALWAYS a one hit kill.

1.1x = One hit kill if you have stopping and they do not have juggernaut. Otherwise, 2 hits.

1.0x = never one hit kill.

Only talking non-hardcore here. Is it a waste to use stopping power as your red perk or is it worth it to ensure that one hit kill? What would you replace it with?

Vegeta · 17-01-2008 01:57PM

good to see this

the barret should be 3 across the board though, even if it hits you in the limb it will take it off so its not like you'd live for long

Seifer · 17-01-2008 02:36PM

I'm not sure what you mean by 3.

I also don't get why he says 1.0 is never a one hit kill as with stopping power it will be. 70 (sniper rifle damage) * 1.7 (damage modifier with stopping power for sniper rifles) = 119. 119 > 100 so it should kill thouse without juggernaut in one shot.

Anyway did some testing using my hardcore sniper build in a non-hardcore server and I don't like it at all. In my opinion you need the stopping power for that guaranteed one hit kill.

Vegeta · 17-01-2008 03:23PM

Seifer wrote: »

I'm not sure what you mean by 3.

By 3, I mean much more powerful than it is

the .50bmg round is a beast of a thing and has a muzzle energy of around 13,000 ft lbs (depending on bullet weight)

the round used in the other rifles is primarily the .308 winchester with a muzzle energy of around 2,700 ft lbs (depending on bullet weight)

Genghiz Cohen · 17-01-2008 03:40PM

C4, Stopping and either Deep Impact or Iron lung.
On hardcore, C4, Overkill and Iron lung/Deep Impact.

Seifer · 17-01-2008 05:50PM

Right, well regardless of round size, all the sniper rifles do the same base damage at all ranges, 70.

C4 is a a bit gimicky isn't it? How do you use it as a sniper?

Hardcore: Claymore, Overkill (m4) and Last Stand
Non-Hardcore: Claymore, Stopping Power and Last Stand

I figure I get more kills with Last Stand than deep impact would provide me with and find the standard breath long enough to take mosts shot.

Steffano2002 · 17-01-2008 08:58PM

I hate Last Stand... That and Martyrdom anooys the hell out of me. :mad:

Holsten · 17-01-2008 09:00PM

I always use stopping power with a sniper, but generally the most kills you get would be headshots, pretty easy with a sniper.

And yes, those two do suck, it's like you're too crap to get a kill when you're alive so you wait till your owned to get a kill.. stupid.

Hercule · 17-01-2008 09:41PM

according to clanbase/ most respectable ladders the following perks/weapons are "LAME" and no self respecting player shud use them - im inclined to agree with most of em. Ive marked ones that should really be allowed with a *

P90 - overpowered needs nerfing
Barret - buggy hitboxes (scroll bug)
Dragunov - buggy hitboxes (scroll bug)
M21 - buggy hitboxes (scroll bug)
Silenced Scorpion - (Infinite range)
Martyrdom - just plain cheap - neds nerfing
Juggernaut - cheap makes ppl too strong
Overkill - unfair advantage over other ppl
Claymores - cheap/skill-less
3 x Flash/stun Grenades*
3 x Special Grenades*
Grenade Launcher attachments - complete no-skill weapons
Last Stand - bugy - i think it makes u weaker :S not sure
Red dot sights* - WTF
ACOG scopes* - these r shoi anyway
Double Tap - cheap overpoweres all guns
Iron lungs*
Deep Impact* - kinda of important to the game 0 shundt have been taken out
C4 x 2 - cheap, ruins S&D
RPG launcher x 2 - crap anyway
Dead Silence - cheap, unfair advantage
UAV Jammer - pointless considering there are no uavs
Helicopter - cheap
Airstrikes - cheap
Slieght of Hand* shud be in
Sonic Boom* - shud be in would add to tactics
Extreme Conditioning* -s hud be in would add to tactics
Eavesdrop - utterly pointless

For a real test of skill play using stock CB perks (stopping power + bandolier) any idiot can get kills with some of the other perks (and they do!)

KamiKazi · 17-01-2008 09:44PM

Red dot sights*
Iron lungs*
Deep Impact*
Slieght of Hand*
Extreme Conditioning*

The above are all allowed in ED

Seifer · 17-01-2008 10:40PM

And yes, those two do suck, it's like you're too crap to get a kill when you're alive so you wait till your owned to get a kill.. stupid.

That's bs to be honest.
With martyrdom you can both see and hear the grenade being dropped but as a general rule you shouldn't run up to to someone you've just killed.
To avoid last stand all you have to do is just pump a few more rounds in. Both are easily avoidable.
I'm not saying it isn't annoying to be killed by a martyr's grenade but it's part of the game.

the_syco · 17-01-2008 11:51PM

Martyrdom: is gay, because if you and two others are getting a flag, and the one with martyrdom gets killed, you all die, and fail to capture the flag.

Last man standing: needs to be improved. Limb shots, etc, sure, it's ok, but if you get hit by a rocket, and/or you get shot in the head, you shouldn't get the last stand.

Claymores: snipers best friend. You see a sniper, you shoot him. But no, the lame phaggot has to knife me in the back. Pity the claymore gets him:D:cool: I never get those who thinks I'm lame for having one guarding my back. Sure, laying claymores at places not guarding your six are a bit ghey, but meh.

Helicopters & airstrikes: my only gripe on these, is a tactic I'm increasingly seeing. Someone gets the amount needed for a chopper/strike, but instead of calling it in, waits for the first 5 seconds of the next match to call it in. This is ghey, as it'll mean that before you get a chance to capture the bomb in Bloc, a chopper comes in, and wipes your front team out, and then it's chopper after strike, after chopper.

Red dots: something nice to aim for (no pun intended). Prefer them to be earned, rather than to have them straight off the mark.

=-=

Me, I used to use rockets with the sniper, but no longer (use the scope thing: don't have to hold the breath to get a good shot). I use the last man stand for one of the classes where I have an uzi type gun. Why? Because that's the class I'd use for close combat urban settings. Found that said tactic are a favourite for said location settings. Always handy to shoot the knees off someone when they shoot you in the chest.

Martyrdom is banned in most of the servers I visit, due to it's ultra-gheyness.

Genghiz Cohen · 18-01-2008 12:52AM

Some perks are annoying, but they cannot be called unfair.
If you choose something you miss out on something else, something that could come in far handier in the game, and since you have no way to change your perks, you're stuck with a bad load-out.

I don't agree with people cutting bits out of games, it is not the way the game was designed, if you don't like it go and code your own game.

If you fall victim to Last Stand, Martyrdom, Helicopter, a Juggernaut, Deep Impact, Claymores or any other perk or ability, excluding Airstrike which is very hard to dodge without radar, it is your own fault for not preventing it.

Now don't come at me saying "LOL!!1 how do u like it when u get kill3d by a fag martyr, LOLOMG NOOB!!1!11"
I don't, nobody does, but I accept that 90% of the time it was my own fault.

Think about it.

Also, above where I said C4 I ment Claymore. Oops.

Holsten · 18-01-2008 12:58AM

Seifer wrote: »

That's bs to be honest.
With martyrdom you can both see and hear the grenade being dropped but as a general rule you shouldn't run up to to someone you've just killed.
To avoid last stand all you have to do is just pump a few more rounds in. Both are easily avoidable.
I'm not saying it isn't annoying to be killed by a martyr's grenade but it's part of the game.

It's not bull****, why else would you choose a perk that ONLY helps you after you've already been killed, rather than a perk that will help when you're alive?

Why not choose something that will help you get kills when you're alive? Last stand isn't as bad but avoiding a martyr nade can be hard to do, not mentioning the people you don't kill, you just run by and die stupidly.

jonski · 18-01-2008 01:38AM

tbh none of the perks annoy me although some really got me going at the start but once you get into the game and get used to them you get over it . We will be playing in the CB league so I will get used to those weapons and rules same as I get used tot eh weapons and rules of open play . At the end of the day it is a game and and there ain't much point complaining about certain aspects of it , if it's coded in and not disabled on the server then you just have to accept it .

Played a good few different maps and modes on our server tonight with a good few people and really enjoyed it.... all of it . We played free for all on shipment with any and all perks and I nearly wet myself laughing .

Hercule · 18-01-2008 04:05AM

keep in mind just because it was in the game from launch doesnt mean its fair and balanced - things always need nerfing/boosting to keep things fair - otherwise u end up with ppl only using 2-3 tactics in entire game.

Clanbase/ED/TWL all remove crap perks from the game to make it a MUCH more skillful, interesting and competitive game. - everything is removed for a reason - its UNBALANCED

also on martyrdom - its cheap in its current incarnation - it would be a lot more balanced if the fuse on a martyr nade was much shorter and that you could only drop the grenade if you had one in your inventory rather then a grenade spewing out of your ass like the current situation.

If you fall victim to Last Stand, Martyrdom, Helicopter, a Juggernaut, Deep Impact, Claymores or any other perk or ability, excluding Airstrike which is very hard to dodge without radar, it is your own fault for not preventing it.

u cant make a statement like that and tell me a grenade launcher or C4 on a bombsite is fair or "balanced" . also helicopters always chase the top scorers which forces the top 3 players on the team into hiding for 2-3 minutes until the fooking things piss off, such things (80% of the perks on the list that are taken out) require no skill to use - but require huge amounts of skill to avoid making them unbalanced!

^ might seem like a rant - prob because this grinds my gears almost every time i play the game

Static M.e. · 18-01-2008 03:39PM

Im kinda of the opinion to allow everything. Sure its annoying but their you go, its part of the game, if stuff gets nerfed fair enough, if it doesnt so what.

What I would like to see is the Chopper \ Airstrike requirements increased. I would give an Airstrike at 10 kills and a chopper at 15. The 15 Kill chopper should be stronger than the 7 kill chopper.

Cuddlesworth · 18-01-2008 04:06PM

Hercule wrote: »

also helicopters always chase the top scorers which forces the top 3 players on the team into hiding for 2-3 minutes until the fooking things piss off,

That explains so ****ing much, like why I keep getting mauled by the damm things and they leave everybody else alone.

Genghiz Cohen · 18-01-2008 06:25PM

Hercule wrote: »

also on martyrdom - its cheap in its current incarnation - it would be a lot more balanced if the fuse on a martyr nade was much shorter and that you could only drop the grenade if you had one in your inventory rather then a grenade spewing out of your ass like the current situation.

I agree with you there, almost, martyr grenades should have the same fuse as normal grenades, anything else is ridiculous.

Hercule wrote: »

u cant make a statement like that and tell me a grenade launcher or C4 on a bombsite is fair or "balanced" .

Running headlong into a bomb site without clearing it first is the definition of stupidity. Flash/smoke your entrance first, or smoke and find another entrance, people look where the action is. UAV is also very helpful in attacking situations.

Hercule wrote: »

also helicopters always chase the top scorers which forces the top 3 players on the team into hiding for 2-3 minutes until the fooking things piss off, such things (80% of the perks on the list that are taken out) require no skill to use - but require huge amounts of skill to avoid making them unbalanced!

1. If you can call in a heli in the first place, you sort of deserve it.
2. Keeping the top enemy players down gives you an advantage over them is you are less skilled.
3. If they are in fact the top players, they should have no trouble at all taking down a heli, I do it all the time.
4. Even if you don't have an RPG in your current load-out, you would have to be stupid to not have it in at least one of your kits. And as you said they seem to go after the top players, so they should die, giving them a chance to change class and get one with an RPG, take down the heli and continue the ownage.

jonski · 18-01-2008 06:25PM

In fairness , I get choppered , I respawn as LMG and it ain't that hard to take it down , used to annoy the hell out of me at the start though .

FrostyJack · 18-01-2008 06:47PM

If you think all the above perks are stupid and unfair and gay, there is a game called Rainbow 6 out there you should try it has the 1 demensioned play you'll love, for everyone else who wants to have fun and a bit on variety COD4 provides in spades. In levels like Shipment the copper is the most annoying thing, but guess what if you kill 7 people first you get it

Hercule · 18-01-2008 07:45PM

Having to take time out to kill a helicopter that is sometimes only following you is lame - i shouldt have to switch playing style just to accommodate for the fact that some sap was able to kill 7 of my noob teammates in a row - granted shooting down a heli is piss easy with a bit of effort but it really cramps your play for a moment - lets not forget the amount of times ive killed or been killed because my enemies or teammates are dumbasses who are taking the time out to shoot at a heli with their gun facing up into the sky and dont notice whats going on around them. Also i dont use non cb perks even in pub play so rpgs = nono. Im aware that in theory i could single handedly stop an opponent from getting a helicopter - but on a big map its impossible to stop

Running headlong into a bomb site without clearing it first is the definition of stupidity. Flash/smoke your entrance first, or smoke and find another entrance, people look where the action is. UAV is also very helpful in attacking situations.

Advice like this is only useful to very new players - common sense tbh.
Planting c4 near bombsites if managed by good players correctly would be unbeatable in competitive play . I have played over 50 competitive wars/scrim already so dont try to tell me that "ah throw a flash or a smoke in to distract em" will do the job - only complete muppets fall for low tactics like this.

Genghiz Cohen · 18-01-2008 09:47PM

Hercule wrote: »

Also i dont use non cb perks even in pub play so rpgs = nono.

Talk about being prepared.

Hercule wrote: »

Advice like this is only useful to very new players - common sense tbh.
Planting c4 near bombsites if managed by good players correctly would be unbeatable in competitive play . I have played over 50 competitive wars/scrim already so dont try to tell me that "ah throw a flash or a smoke in to distract em" will do the job - only complete muppets fall for low tactics like this.

So you wouldn't "fall" for getting flashed or having a smoke used against you, eh? You wouldn't "fall" for being blinded and deafened, or having your view of a section of the level cut off, not being able to see your enemy?

Hercule wrote: »

only complete muppets fall for low tactics like this.

Yes because their are so many tactics that don't involve flashes. Like shooting them, WITH BULLETS!!!! *gasp*

FrostyJack · 18-01-2008 10:23PM

who are taking the time out to shoot at a heli with their gun facing up into the sky

As opposed to pointing at another player and getting shot in the back? So you always introduce yourself to the guy your about to kill? I pretty sure the use of a helo to distract your enemy in order to kill them is another reason why COD4 is so good.

Hercule · 19-01-2008 12:45AM

So you wouldn't "fall" for getting flashed or having a smoke used against you, eh? You wouldn't "fall" for being blinded and deafened, or having your view of a section of the level cut off, not being able to see your enemy?

ive maybe gotten killed after being flashed 5-6 in total times in 50+ scrims - its not as big a deal as it is in counter-strike where u have flashbangs flying back and forth for a long amount of time -flashbangs just alert ppl to your presence in many situations

Yes because their are so many tactics that don't involve flashes. Like shooting them, WITH BULLETS!!!! *gasp*

^ now your just being silly :rolleyes:

have you actually played a cod4 match or is pub play the pinnacle of your gameplay? - if it is then believe me the game is well suited to lack of perks, a far more balanced, competitve and interesting game.

Seifer · 19-01-2008 01:08AM

Holsten wrote:

Why not choose something that will help you get kills when you're alive?

Because as I said I found that I get more kills by picking last stand than by picking deep impact or iron lung. Other than them none of the other yellows are going to increase my kill count. I'm not saying I spend the match lying on my back but that there are less oppurtunities to wall bang someone than to last stand them, I find.

Hercule wrote:

Clanbase/ED/TWL all remove crap perks from the game to make it a MUCH more skillful, interesting and competitive game. - everything is removed for a reason - its UNBALANCED

I really hate this idea of boiling every shooter down to just running around with your gun to make it "competitive". What's the point of having different games if you're going to remove the elements that make them different?

Interesting about the heli attacking the top 3, didn't know that but now can assure myself that the baxtard things don't hate me personally.
They probably should widen the gap between airstrike and heli at least since it's pretty god damn easy to get two kills with it...

Genghiz Cohen · 19-01-2008 01:55AM

Hercule wrote: »

have you actually played a cod4 match or is pub play the pinnacle of your gameplay? - if it is then believe me the game is well suited to lack of perks, a far more balanced, competitve and interesting game.

I have played a few matches, but (as with all multi-player games I play) the seriousness takes from the overall enjoyment, sure it was new and exciting first, but it got old pretty quickly.

Seifer wrote:

I'm not saying I spend the match lying on my back...there are less oppurtunities to wall bang...They probably should widen the gap

...I'll just go and get my coat.

BostonB · 21-01-2008 01:32AM

I think a lot depends on your connection and the server, and the people you are playing against. In some games your shots seem to have no effect. So I generally will switch to a class with faster rate of fire and using nades a lot more.

Stopping Power and Sniping

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