Bad DART Commuting experience today

OK-Cancel-Apply · 02-05-2008 04:00PM #1

Ok, I started a thread not so long ago in which I expressed my frustration which the ticket system, but today I had a quite a generally bad experience with the whole set up.

To be brief, the platform timer (which I could see from the street) gave incorrect info, causing me to miss the first train (I would have legged it had I known it was coming), neither of the ticket vending machines were functioning, nor was there a staff member at the counter. Thankfully, one of the gates was open. The train itself was filthy, and I mean FILTHY - there were half eaten sandwiches all over the floor and seats, as well as a few banana skins, and crumpled/torn free newspapers everywhere. What a disgrace. I can tell that the train had been like this for some time, as the banana skins were brown. Anyway, once I got to my destination, I could see people (as usual) having to back away from the non-functioning turnstiles. I went through the other way to pay for my fare, and the guy was so rude and apathetic.

Look, here's what I'm wondering - instead of spending money on new trains every couple of years, why don't they employ more staff? Or at least start paying them enough so that they feel like their job is worth doing? In Berlin, for example, some of the trains look like they are from the 50's or 60's, but they are CLEAN and shiny, and have been upgraded where necessary. Surely cleaning and upgrading is better than just throwing money at new trains every few years.

paulm17781 · 02-05-2008 04:55PM

OK-Cancel-Apply wrote: »

Look, here's what I'm wondering - instead of spending money on new trains every couple of years, why don't they employ more staff? Or at least start paying them enough so that they feel like their job is worth doing? In Berlin, for example, some of the trains look like they are from the 50's or 60's, but they are CLEAN and shiny, and have been upgraded where necessary. Surely cleaning and upgrading is better than just throwing money at new trains every few years.

This is the CIE way, it would be difficult to change. The RPA were only set up as a way to bypass CIE. Personally I think reforms would have been better. More staff isn't the answer (I suspect IE are overstaffed as it is, semi state etc.) what is needed is new working processes.

Victor · 02-05-2008 06:25PM

Can I suggest you write to Irish Rail, providing as many details as possible?

Write, not e-mail, as its more likely to get a response.

Also www.railusers.ie/forum/

Run_to_da_hills · 02-05-2008 06:39PM

You can't teach an old dog new tricks, once upon a time CIE purchased heaps of 071, 121, 141, 181 and 201 Craven Coaches and AEC Park Royal railcars, these were once brand new and shiny, After about twenty years they became grubby, dirty rattled themselves apart. Fifty years later the whole cycle starts again, they by brand new 22000's 29000's 2800's 2700's 2600's and various dart cpmpelations. In about ten to twenty years time these trains will begin to get grimy dirty and rattly. except for the dart units which will last considerable longer and cleaner because they are electric.

Ham'nd'egger · 02-05-2008 07:40PM

In fairness, rubbish on trains gets there from people who left it there in the first instance. I have seen people leave large amounts of personal rubbish (cans, newspapers, wrappers etc) and even emptying bags on buses once. Sickening to see it but it does happen sometimes. The only thing you can do is to report the litter; cleaning crews are employed and if they are skiving off it needs to be reported. Ditto for timings on boards; what station was it and about what time of the day?

On staff levels, Irish Rail are another victim in State recruitment embargoes so don't expect any large scale job hunting anytime soon to sort out shortages.

K!LL!@N · 02-05-2008 07:46PM

I started using the Dart at the age of 11 when going to secondary school and continued to use it practically everyday until I left Ireland a couple of years ago.

There are so many factors at play when it comes to the problems you've mentioned.

1) With regard to the dirt and filth, while CIE should keep their trains clean it wouldn't be much of an issue if the people using them didn't litter the place so horribly. It's sheer ignorance and it's the "sure if I put my rubbish in the bins they'd be out of a job" attitude that's prevalent throughout society. I've seen all sorts on the Dart ranging from litter dropping to urination. There's only so much can be done when people act this way.

2) The on platform timetable. If you use the Dart regularly you'll get to know that the Darts usually arrive a minute or two before the timer says. I guess it's the "under promise, over deliver" business model at work there. For the most part they have gotten better at being on time over the years. Still not on par with any number of other countries but it's a flawed system and will never be able to deliver the same level of throughput as other systems.

3) The ticket machines don't seem to be the most robust of machines. If they haven't been smashed in by the local yobs then they're either out of change or out of ticket reel.

4) I don't want to tar everyone with the same brush but some of the guys in the ticket booths do as little as possible. If they're not watching tv, reading the newspaper they're doing anything else they can to not be at that window. A loud cough or a tap on the window will usually get their attention.

One of the problems with some of these guys is that they're basically can't be fired. They've been in the job too long and the union has too much power. The guys at my local station used to knock off by 7pm most nights if not earlier. The station would be locked up and the side gates opened. I believe they've started enforcing the opening time policy a bit more in recent years and they're now open closer to the running of the last darts.

5) CIE does not need any more staff or higher pay. They're pretty well paid, probably overpaid for what a lot of them are doing. I have a friend that worked in a ticket booth and his salary was pretty impressive for what he was doing. In fact they could probably do with getting rid of a few and updating their work practices as we already mentioned.

While the Dart has it's many failings I still use it whenever I'm home and much prefer it to buses. At least you're not going to get 3 Darts coming along at the same time and then none for an hour.

Killian

Victor · 02-05-2008 08:43PM

"sure if I put my rubbish in the bins they'd be out of a job"

I'm sure the cleaning staff would much prefer a nicer job for the same pay, doing something constructive.

K!LL!@N · 02-05-2008 08:51PM

Victor wrote: »

I'm sure the cleaning staff would much prefer a nicer job for the same pay, doing something constructive.

That's what I'm saying.
If people didn't have that kind of attitude the cleaning staff could spend their time on other things.

Killian

Rashers72 · 02-05-2008 08:54PM

K!LL!@N wrote: »

At least you're not going to get 3 Darts coming along at the same time and then none for an hour.

Killian

There are still big gaps in the service, especially in the off-peak. However, tha gaps in the evening/weekend suburban services are a complete joke. They claim not enough people want to use the services...lets try something new - provide a frequent, reliable, and punctual service, and let's see if people want to use it. :mad:

Run_to_da_hills · 02-05-2008 08:58PM

One of the biggest plagues to transit systems today is the free garbage papers that are handed out every morning, i.e. the Metro and the Morning Herald. (London Underground has the same problem) These culprits should be made responsible for picking up this trash for Iarnrod Eireann. Ie when they finish handing them out every morning they should be made walk up and down each train and station picking them up.

paulm17781 · 02-05-2008 11:39PM

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

One of the biggest plagues to transit systems today is the free garbage papers that are handed out every morning, i.e. the Metro and the Morning Herald. (London Underground has the same problem) These culprits should be made responsible for picking up this trash for Iarnrod Eireann. Ie when they finish handing them out every morning they should be made walk up and down each train and station picking them up.

They should also be forced to put recycling points at every DART, Luas and major train station.

Victor · 02-05-2008 11:52PM

Metro and Herald AM have agreements with Luas and Dublin City Council to reduce teh amount of litter produced. 40-60% of litter on trains is newspapers and magazines.

The RPA are considering recycling points, although I'm not sure how successful they would be or if they can be put near the OHLE.

PeeDiddyPaddy · 03-05-2008 12:55PM

Those free snooze papers are an environmental disaster - there are some attempts being made to collect them in some of the DART stations but as per usual it is a half hearted attempt - there is a dodgy ol cart with a sign hangin off it asking people to recycle the papers. The train stations never mind the trains are absolutely filthy mankey dirty also - was in Connolly lately and was just waitin for a rat to jump out - has any detergents ever been seen anywhere near anything to do with Iarnrod Eireann ? As for the digital displays informing us of the next train a coming - do you know that there are fiber optic cables lining the streets of Dublin linked up to the bus stops of our fair city but the unions have blocked them ever been connected up as they fear that they might have to run to the farcical timetables.

dsane1 · 03-05-2008 11:55PM

re free newspapers .Perhaps there should be a plastic bag type levy put on them .......lol

Run_to_da_hills · 04-05-2008 12:44PM

dsane1 wrote: »

re free newspapers .Perhaps there should be a plastic bag type levy put on them .......lol

If there was no one would take them. :rolleyes:

Propellerhead · 04-05-2008 08:45PM

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

If there was no one would take them. :rolleyes:

Exactly!

jjbrien · 05-05-2008 12:06PM

Propellerhead wrote: »

Exactly!

what about a deposit system they take €1 off you and when you drop your paper back to them you get it back would solve the litter problem

as for the dirt of connolly i have never seen a cleaner there the floor looks like it was never mopped and the toilets dont get me started on them

paulm17781 · 05-05-2008 12:37PM

jjbrien wrote: »

what about a deposit system they take €1 off you and when you drop your paper back to them you get it back would solve the litter problem

It's a good idea but there would probably be huge insurance costs if the vendors were carrying cash. It just amazes me how people seem to think it is ok to leave them on the floor of the Luas rather than go to the effort of carrying it off and putting them in a bin.

jjbrien · 05-05-2008 01:05PM

paulm17781 wrote: »

It's a good idea but there would probably be huge insurance costs if the vendors were carrying cash. It just amazes me how people seem to think it is ok to leave them on the floor of the Luas rather than go to the effort of carrying it off and putting them in a bin.

maybe when the dta come on stream they can have litter wardens like what they have in england which is run by the british transport police or even just have the conductors giving out fines to people i was on a mullingar bound train last month where the last stop was mullingar when everone got off the train the whole thing looked like a big tip this train was horrid and it had to make a return journy to connolly in this state. its like the people who dont clean up after them selves in mc donalds every other country manages to do this.

they give out the same free metro in Toronto and New York and nobody would dare leave them behind when they are finished with them.

MOH · 06-05-2008 01:05PM

K!LL!@N wrote: »

2) The on platform timetable. If you use the Dart regularly you'll get to know that the Darts usually arrive a minute or two before the timer says. I guess it's the "under promise, over deliver" business model at work there. For the most part they have gotten better at being on time over the years. Still not on par with any number of other countries but it's a flawed system and will never be able to deliver the same level of throughput as other systems.

Killian

I've been on platforms twice recently where the display showed 4 or 5 minutes, looked down the track a few seconds late rand the train was coming, display had magically changed to 2 minutes. (I've also been on 3 DARTs in the last week that left early)

jjbrien wrote: »

what about a deposit system they take €1 off you and when you drop your paper back to them you get it back would solve the litter problem

what if you want to bring the paper into work or home with you?

paulm17781 · 06-05-2008 01:36PM

MOH wrote: »

what if you want to bring the paper into work or home with you?

Swap it the next day for the current one. Paper is worth €1 and cash or old paper can be given. I don't see this ever working though, insurance.

Proper collection points and all DART, Luas and major transport points should have stands or something for these. People can take ones left there or leave them there.

The free sheet garbage really must be the worst thing to happen to Dublin since the bag levy removed so much unsightly rubbish. This morning the Luas looked like they were cleaning up after a pet, not that a bunch of apparently civilised humans had made this mess.

kmick · 06-05-2008 01:46PM

In all seriousness there is no point complaining about public transport in ireland - everyone agrees in most cases it dire. So do yourself a favor and buy a bike.

paulm17781 · 06-05-2008 02:42PM

kmick wrote: »

In all seriousness there is no point complaining about public transport in ireland - everyone agrees in most cases it dire. So do yourself a favor and buy a bike.

Thank God you arrived, with your silent attitude things are bound to improve.

Bad DART Commuting experience today

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