Should the DPP issue an arrest warrant for the pope ?

lucozader · 17-07-2011 01:23PM #1

The popes have all been aware of the abuses in the irish church. Shouldn't they be held accountable..

deisedave · 17-07-2011 01:24PM

yea cause thats going to happen

Lawrence1895 · 17-07-2011 01:26PM

No chance this will happen...I rather see this thread been locked

Ghost Buster · 17-07-2011 01:27PM

Yes.
Will it happen?
NO
Why?
Because it cant.

Even if it could it wouldnt because?
Irish catholics and their utterly bewildering Stockholm Syndrome-esque mind set exists.:eek:

Biggins · 17-07-2011 01:28PM

More chance of this thread been locked 100 times before the pope even sniffs an arrest warrant.

Guy:Incognito · 17-07-2011 01:28PM

Did up JP and flog him back to death.

Putting aside the silliness for a minute. Would there even be any legal grounds for Ireland to arrest the current pope?

gigino · 17-07-2011 01:37PM

He may appear here in Ireland yet in civilian clothes to plead on behalf of the accused in the Magdalene Laundries scandal - do not forget the UN committee on torture has requested our government to have a satutory investigation in to these.

He may have civilian clothes left from his youth - or did he only wear Nazi youth + wehrmarcht army uniform then ? He could rip the swastika badge off the arm of the jacket. Recycle , reuse.;)

To answer the OP's question ; yes. If those in the RCC hierarchy thought they would one day be held to account for the cover up, less abuse would have taken place.

mikemac · 17-07-2011 01:41PM

gigino wrote: »

in the Magdalene Laundries scandal -

A scandal alright
But it was families who put their own family members into these.

More concerned with shame and chattering neighbors then keeping their family together.
You can't blame the Church over that

gigino · 17-07-2011 01:46PM

mikemac wrote: »

But it was families who put their own family members into these.

people were told / "guided" by the RCC what to do.

Shame on the RCC for its track record in relation to these laundries. Did you see the excellent documentary on the tv about them ?

ejmaztec · 17-07-2011 01:50PM

The bishops here probably tried their best to keep "Head Office" in the dark over what was going on, which is probably what the hierarchy was also doing in many other countries.

squod · 17-07-2011 01:53PM

Ghost Buster wrote: »

Irish catholics and their utterly bewildering Stockholm Syndrome-esque mind set exists.:eek:

That's bullshit. I'm a catholic and even I wanted the last pope arrested. FFS people this issue is not about religion.

Turkana · 17-07-2011 01:56PM

It is about religion. Childrens arses being raped has a strong link to the vow of celibacy.

arybvtcw0eolkf · 17-07-2011 02:03PM

As the head of the Vatican I think The Pope enjoys the protection of diplomatic immunity from prosecution.

Chuck Stone · 17-07-2011 02:05PM

It would be nice if we seized all their property as the proceeds of crime. Hit 'em where it hurts.

wild_cat · 17-07-2011 02:07PM

Chuck Stone wrote: »

It would be nice if we seized all their property as the proceeds of crime. Hit 'em where it hurts.

.

Son Of A Vidic · 17-07-2011 02:09PM

Don't arrest him, just send in Seal Team Six.

dvpower · 17-07-2011 02:12PM

lucozader wrote: »

The popes have all been aware of the abuses in the irish church. Shouldn't they be held accountable..

What Irish law did he break in Ireland exactly?

(You know, we can't expect the laws of this state to hold sway in other jurisdictions - that would be an unacceptable interference)

Zebra3 · 17-07-2011 02:13PM

Vivienne Abundant Nail wrote: »

As the head of the Vatican I think The Pope enjoys the protection of diplomatic immunity from prosecution.

He doesn't. Same way leaders of other states don't enjoy immunity from war crimes (unless of course they're western or Israeli leaders).

philologos · 17-07-2011 02:14PM

OP: This was tried in Texas in 2005. He claimed diplomatic immunity.

KeithAFC · 17-07-2011 02:14PM

He should be arrested for his crimes and all his friends with him. Won't happen though.

charlemont · 17-07-2011 02:17PM

We should organise a large protest to compete with the sheep if the Pope visits next year.

Should the DPP issue an arrest warrant for the pope ? Yes.

charlemont · 17-07-2011 02:22PM

mikemac wrote: »

A scandal alright
But it was families who put their own family members into these.

More concerned with shame and chattering neighbors then keeping their family together.
You can't blame the Church over that

You have a good point there. Very true indeed.

arybvtcw0eolkf · 17-07-2011 02:22PM

Zebra3 wrote: »

He doesn't. Same way leaders of other states don't enjoy immunity from war crimes (unless of course they're western or Israeli leaders).

Bring Mr.Pope to the war crimes tribunal in The Hague for child abuse?.

I'm pretty sure that unless he waived his rights to its (diplomatic) protection as a head of state (The Vatican) he can not be prosecuted.

Ghost Buster · 17-07-2011 03:42PM

squod wrote: »

That's bullshit. I'm a catholic and even I wanted the last pope arrested. FFS people this issue is not about religion.

I never said all irish catholics but i do believe a substantial number act as if they have Stockholm Syndrome. Colm O'Gorman is still villified by many for the nasty damage he did to the holy Catholic Church FFS!!!!!

Artur Foden · 17-07-2011 04:01PM

Not an arrest warrant, but maybe charge/sue/bring to court the Catholic church as an entity in some international court somewhere.

I'd sooner see them arrest the criminal bankers in this country first.

Ste.phen · 17-07-2011 04:23PM

Artur Foden wrote: »

Not an arrest warrant, but maybe charge/sue/bring to court the Catholic church as an entity in some international court somewhere.

I'd sooner see them arrest the criminal bankers in this country first.

I dunno, as screwed as the economy is, i rate greed and incomptence as less worthy of immediate punishment than child rape, beating, murder, inprisonment...

gigino · 17-07-2011 04:56PM

Turkana wrote: »

It is about religion. Childrens arses being raped has a strong link to the vow of celibacy.

And the cover-ups a strong link to a bunch of old frocked celibate men.

Artur Foden · 17-07-2011 05:00PM

I dunno, as screwed as the economy is, i rate greed and incomptence as less worthy of immediate punishment than child rape, beating, murder, inprisonment...

Oh I agree! But the difference is that the pope didn't personally commit those crimes.

But I'm not saying the pope shouldn't be held accountable. It would just be more effective attacking the church itself rather than the pope.

Needler · 17-07-2011 05:04PM

Artur Foden wrote: »

Oh I agree! But the difference is that the pope didn't personally commit those crimes.

But I'm not saying the pope shouldn't be held accountable. It would just be more effective attacking the church itself rather than the pope.

Why should the blame be put on the pope? Does the haulage company get into trouble if a truck driver murders prostitutes?

Its just the whole blame culture thats going on, can't find the person who did it? We'll just scapegoat someone further up the ladder

gigino · 17-07-2011 05:05PM

If McDonalds had a ten-thousanth of the sex abuse accusations of the RCC , then its chairman would resign

Needler · 17-07-2011 05:06PM

gigino wrote: »

If McDonalds had a ten-thousanth of the sex abuse accusations of the RCC , then its chairman would resign

I don't trust that Ronald character at all. The chairmain would probably stay in the states and pick up a hefty bonus for how well he "handled" the thing

nlgbbbblth · 17-07-2011 05:53PM

lucozader wrote: »

The popes have all been aware of the abuses in the irish church. Shouldn't they be held accountable..

No.

They should punish the people who carried out the abuse.

You are trying to deflect blame from them to somebody who didn't actually commit the crimes.

Therefore you have a problem with personal responsibility.

What the f*ck is wrong with you?

Liam Byrne · 17-07-2011 06:11PM

Artur Foden wrote: »

Not an arrest warrant, but maybe charge/sue/bring to court the Catholic church as an entity in some international court somewhere.

I'd sooner see them arrest the criminal bankers in this country first.

As much and all as the bankers and their mates have screwed the country it pales into insignificance compared to raping kids and covering it up.

Liam Byrne · 17-07-2011 06:12PM

nlgbbbblth wrote: »

lucozader wrote: »

The popes have all been aware of the abuses in the irish church. Shouldn't they be held accountable..

No.

They should punish the people who carried out the abuse.

You are trying to deflect blame from them to somebody who didn't actually commit the crimes.

Therefore you have a problem with personal responsibility.

What the f*ck is wrong with you?

Covering up the abuse is also a sickening crime.

zenno · 17-07-2011 06:27PM

the best thing would be to nuke the vatican from the face of this planet but firstly governments would need experts in there to unlock all those large safes and take the money out and give it as compensation to the people that were and still are abused.

then the pope and previous popes should be imprisoned for crimes against children. also why the hell do people still go to church, you do not need to go into a building or associate yourself with these people if you believe in a god/gods. your belief in a god is within yourself not in a building made of stone.

immunity from law is their blessing but the walls are crumbling down around them and the world will be a better place when the vatican and church's burn to cinders. zenno 33.74 :pac:

Zebra3 · 17-07-2011 06:41PM

Vivienne Abundant Nail wrote: »

Bring Mr.Pope to the war crimes tribunal in The Hague for child abuse?

Where did I say that?

_MadRa_ · 17-07-2011 06:58PM

I think it will be hard to arrest the pope, he is not in a country ruled by EU Law.
You will have to lure him out or wait for him to enter a Country with an Extradition policy.

I Suggest Cake, Everyone Loves Cake.

zenno · 17-07-2011 07:24PM

_MadRa_ wrote: »

I think it will be hard to arrest the pope, he is not in a country ruled by EU Law.
You will have to lure him out or wait for him to enter a Country with an Extradition policy.

I Suggest Cake, Everyone Loves Cake.

that's why I brought up the nuke, it's the only way. :pac:

hatrickpatrick · 17-07-2011 10:23PM

mikemac wrote: »

A scandal alright
But it was families who put their own family members into these.

More concerned with shame and chattering neighbors then keeping their family together.
You can't blame the Church over that

Actually you can. Where did the stigma come from? Where did the shame and chattering neighbors come from? Where did out fear of our own sexuality come from? Where did our hideously repressive attitude to sexuality come from?

Oh yeah, you guessed it...

lucozader · 18-07-2011 08:03PM

it's not just sexuality

there was a lot of violence from the religious as well

dazco · 18-07-2011 08:13PM

Needler wrote: »

Why should the blame be put on the pope? Does the haulage company get into trouble if a truck driver murders prostitutes?

Its just the whole blame culture thats going on, can't find the person who did it? We'll just scapegoat someone further up the ladder

Well if the haulage company knew about, covered it up and simply switched the driver to a different route where he went on to murder more prostitutes, then yes, the haulage company should get in trouble.......

philologos · 18-07-2011 08:24PM

lucozader wrote: »

it's not just sexuality

there was a lot of violence from the religious as well

"The religious" is a phrase I'd leave out of this discussion. That phrase encompasses a whole lot more people than this discussion pertains to.

If you mean that in the past that churches have been involved in violent acts I'd agree that lamentably that's true, just as many people in non-religious movements perpetrated violence on a huge scale.

Honestly, I'd deplore the act of violence as much as any man. I'd deplore the chronic abuse of children as much as any man. However, I don't see the reason why a belief in Christianity or a belief in any other faith should be in the dock. Rather I believe institutional corruption in every shape or form whether in the State or in churches, or in schools, sports teams and so on should be in the dock. This is also an Irish domestic problem in secular society as well as a huge problem in the RCC on a global scale.

Ghost Buster · 18-07-2011 08:28PM

philologos wrote: »

"The religious" is a phrase I'd leave out of this discussion. That phrase encompasses a whole lot more people than this discussion pertains to.

If you mean that in the past that churches have been involved in violent acts I'd agree that lamentably that's true, just as many people in non-religious movements perpetrated violence on a huge scale.

Honestly, I'd deplore the act of violence as much as any man. I'd deplore the chronic abuse of children as much as any man. However, I don't see the reason why a belief in Christianity or a belief in any other faith should be in the dock. Rather I believe institutional corruption in every shape or form whether in the State or in churches, or in schools, sports teams and so on should be in the dock. This WAS also an Irish domestic problem in secular society as well as a huge problem in the RCC on a global scale.

Fixed that for ya. !
Youre right but this was a time when the entire breath of irish Society was under the crozier of the church. When individual Gairdi could be abused and read from the pulpit for attempting to carry out their duty 'against' the church. Things have changed.

philologos · 18-07-2011 08:54PM

It's very much a problem in the present as well unfortunately in regular society. That's not excusing any abuse that took place in clerical situations, but it is a call for objectivity. Now must be the time when we collectively put out foot down and draw lines in the sand as to what is acceptable and what isn't in Irish society.

Run_to_da_hills · 18-07-2011 09:40PM

The Pope position is no different to that of Rupert Murdock, Ratsinger is the CEO of the Catholic Church who should held full responsibility for all the actions committed by this corrupt institute.

If Rupert Murdock can be summonsed to UK parliament for questioning about its company being involved in criminal activities there's no reason why the Pope can't be summoned over here to face the music.

Manach · 18-07-2011 09:43PM

So perhaps Elizabeth II should have been arrested for the death of Irish citizens during the troubles. Or officials from the HSE for deaths of minors in their care. This thread is let another rabble-inspired anti-Catholic rant.

Liam Byrne · 18-07-2011 09:49PM

Manach wrote: »

So perhaps Elizabeth II should have been arrested for the death of Irish citizens during the troubles. Or officials from the HSE for deaths of minors in their care. This thread is let another rabble-inspired anti-Catholic rant.

I seriously object to your claim above.

"Rabble-inspired" is a phrase that relates to absolutely NONE of my opinions.

If someone is "anti-catholic" then it's because of the actions of said organisation.

Would you object to an "anti-Mafia" rant ?

Ghost Buster · 18-07-2011 10:00PM

Manach wrote: »

So perhaps Elizabeth II should have been arrested for the death of Irish citizens during the troubles. Or officials from the HSE for deaths of minors in their care. This thread is let another rabble-inspired anti-Catholic rant.

Theres a programme on RTE around 9 pm called "THE NEWS". Give it a go and you might just figure out why folk are anti The Roman Catholic Church.
IT does not take intensive enquiry to uncover The HSE's failings and they are addressed and not covered up.
Poor analogy

Run_to_da_hills · 18-07-2011 10:25PM

Manach wrote: »

So perhaps Elizabeth II should have been arrested for the death of Irish citizens during the troubles. Or officials from the HSE for deaths of minors in their care. This thread is let another rabble-inspired anti-Catholic rant.

Most people are Anti Catholic because the institute is rotten to the core and it has shown its true colours with all the child buggery that has been exposed and the churches attempt to suppress it right to the top..

In my fathers time it was a great privilege to have a clergy member in your family, now its an embarrassment. The chickens have finally come home to roost.

Should the DPP issue an arrest warrant for the pope ?

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