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Hearld.ie Appauling Reporting on a Go-Around

Comments

  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,857 ✭✭✭Andrew33


    The Herald? sensationalise a story?? who would think they'd do that???:D
    Absolute rag.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 8,223 ✭✭✭Nissan doctor


    Looks like they let another work experience student write a story.:rolleyes:


  • Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 4,245 Mod ✭✭✭✭Locker10a


    ohh my god of all the aviation related stories in the rags i have read this takes a value-pack of biscuits !!! Jesus has the woman any brains ? This happens evey week in Dublin or in Ireland at least! Even my mother can understand why a plane would need to go around! Yes the same woman who thought the engine of a plane was under the front nose section under the Flight Deck windows!! haha
    Searously though !!! Slow news day !


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,258 ✭✭✭MUSEIST


    That is a truly cringe worthy story:rolleyes:


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 407 ✭✭AfterDusk


    Gutter journalism at its finest...


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,567 ✭✭✭✭Cookie_Monster


    Sounds like a Holywood adaptation of the incident, make it sound more terrifying, add some explosions, make everybody a bit better looking :D


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,525 ✭✭✭kona


    Hahaha pointed for the moon! Im no pilot but If there was time for ATC to tell the pilot to go around, there must have been plenty of distance between the Ryanair plane and the ground.
    Obviously they needed more power, but Id imagine the engines on take off would be at a higher throttle?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 703 ✭✭✭Cessna_Pilot


    Dublin's getting notorious for late landing clearances these days. I don't know how many times coming in there recently I have been so close to calling Point to the moon, I mean Go Around


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,857 ✭✭✭Andrew33


    kona wrote: »
    Obviously they needed more power, but Id imagine the engines on take off would be at a higher throttle?

    I'm not contradicting you, just curious myself, on take off the plane only has to overcome 1G but if the plane is descending and then has to climb away would it have to overcome slightly more than 1G (standard 1G plus counteract any negative G that plane was generating by descending) and therefore need more power?
    then again, the plane is carrying forward speed while descending so this may cancel out the need for more power over a standard takeoff...my head hurts trying to figure that one out:D


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 44 dubberdo


    Andrew33 wrote: »
    I'm not contradicting you, just curious myself, on take off the plane only has to overcome 1G but if the plane is descending and then has to climb away would it have to overcome slightly more than 1G (standard 1G plus counteract any negative G that plane was generating by descending) and therefore need more power?
    then again, the plane is carrying forward speed while descending so this may cancel out the need for more power over a standard takeoff...my head hurts trying to figure that one out:D
    I'd imagine it depends on the rate of pitch change. It would be so gradual you'd hardly feel it. I think you'd feel more on initial climb out off a runway than you would in a go-around situation. Usually tower give a bit of warning if they expect a late landing clearance. It's fair enough I think. Would you rather queue for longer waiting regularly or risk the odd go-around? I'd go for go-around myself...


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,903 ✭✭✭✭Ash.J.Williams


    if ever there was a "made up" witness it was in that article!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,525 ✭✭✭kona


    Andrew33 wrote: »
    I'm not contradicting you, just curious myself, on take off the plane only has to overcome 1G but if the plane is descending and then has to climb away would it have to overcome slightly more than 1G (standard 1G plus counteract any negative G that plane was generating by descending) and therefore need more power?
    then again, the plane is carrying forward speed while descending so this may cancel out the need for more power over a standard takeoff...my head hurts trying to figure that one out:D

    Well on take off you have to accelerate hundreds of tonnes to take off speed in a relatively short distance.

    On a go around there is already momentum there as you say. I presume there are different configurations for take off and landing as regards to flaps etc? Id imagine when you have to do a proper go around, like just before touch down, the attitude of the plane changes and the nose "points to the moon :pac:" and as a result you need to get the air moving over the wings to prevent a stall situation? WHere as if your on approach, while your losing speed you wouldnt need as much throttle as the attitude of the aircraft wouldnt be in such a extreme position?

    Im sure one of the pilots here could explain it better :)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 742 ✭✭✭mayotom


    That must have been a few years ago, we haven't been able to see the moon through the cloud cover for a long time


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,802 ✭✭✭cml387


    Likely there was a friend or relation of the Herald on board.
    In fairness,I've seen more sensational reporting:
    "passengers shrieked in horror..."
    "Captain wrestled with the controls.."
    "People were crying, it was terrible.."


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 708 ✭✭✭A320


    cml387 wrote: »
    Likely there was a friend or relation of the Herald on board.
    In fairness,I've seen more sensational reporting:
    "passengers shrieked in horror..."
    "Captain wrestled with the controls.."
    "People were crying, it was terrible.."

    Love it,other beauties include....

    ''Jet Blaze Terror'' has to be my favourite headline,quoted when dermot ahern was inside an air corps beechcraft 200 flying out of cork years ago that suffered some problem with an engine!!

    ''I could see the pilots eyes were gripped with fear''
    ''the flight attendants were crying''
    ''I could see inside the plane,the passengers were praying'' and so on....


    One witness said: "I heard the most incredible engine roar and I looked and I saw the Delta Airlines plane ready to take off....of course you did,back to sleep!!!!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,477 ✭✭✭highlydebased


    "Plane plunged 20,000 feet in seconds...."


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 708 ✭✭✭A320


    ''i couldn't feel the oxygen flowing from the mask''


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 703 ✭✭✭Cessna_Pilot


    Had a passenger demanding to have the "pressurization turned on" at flight level 370 last week, thirty minutes into the cruise.
    Suprised Joe Duffy didn't get wind of such negligence:D


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,802 ✭✭✭cml387


    I remember reading a story many years ago about a Royal tour.
    A tabloid hack looked out the window and saw some contrails nearby.
    Immediately leaping to conclusions he filed his story

    ROYAL JET IN NEAR MISS

    The following day the RAF had to explain that the planes were miles apart and no incident had occurred.

    Strangely enough ,the hack's typewriter went missing shortly afterwards. The RAF were able to return it to him eventually, but it was "broken".


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,520 ✭✭✭Killinator


    A320 wrote: »

    ''I could see the pilots eyes were gripped with fear''

    :D:D:D
    Is that when the cockpit door is closed and you have no view of the pilot, when its on the ground getting ready to start up or when its after taxing to the gate....the only other times you might see the back of the pilots head, or his arm,

    Then again maybe they saw him leave to go to the toilet after he'd held it in for several hours, would explain the fear bit:D:D


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 708 ✭✭✭A320


    Killinator wrote: »
    :D:D:D
    Is that when the cockpit door is closed and you have no view of the pilot, when its on the ground getting ready to start up or when its after taxing to the gate....the only other times you might see the back of the pilots head, or his arm,

    Then again maybe they saw him leave to go to the toilet after he'd held it in for several hours, would explain the fear bit:D:D

    Oh its with the door locked in flight,but 'the sun' have their sources,100 % truth

    This should be turned into a journalist slating thread.

    A beauty last week on a jet 2 incident over mallorca or somewhere..... ''The jet misfired'' as opposed to a compressor surge/stall


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,154 ✭✭✭bkehoe


    kona wrote: »
    Hahaha pointed for the moon! Im no pilot but If there was time for ATC to tell the pilot to go around, there must have been plenty of distance between the Ryanair plane and the ground.
    Obviously they needed more power, but Id imagine the engines on take off would be at a higher throttle?

    Actually on most take offs from dry long runways, the takeoff thrust would be reduced from the maximum 'TOGA' (Take Off Go Around) position. This is called the 'Flex' setting. Airlines do calculations which take into account many things including runway length, weather, ground conditions, aircraft weight/loading, obstacles near the airport, etc, so that they can calculate the minimum thrust required to safely meet the climb out requirements in the event of an engine failure. This saves money by reducing engine wear, reducing fuel consumption and also reduces noise.
    However, on the call for a go-around then full TOGA thrust would be selected which would spool the engines up to the maximum calculated speed determined by the engine computers (based on temperature, pressure, etc).
    TOGA thrust would normally only be selected on take off in certain situations such as if the ambient temperature is above a certain value, the runway is shorter, contaminated (e.g. slush, snow, etc), etc.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,477 ✭✭✭highlydebased


    bkehoe wrote: »
    Actually on most take offs from dry long runways, the takeoff thrust would be reduced from the maximum 'TOGA' (Take Off Go Around) position. This is called the 'Flex' setting. Airlines do calculations which take into account many things including runway length, weather, ground conditions, aircraft weight/loading, obstacles near the airport, etc, so that they can calculate the minimum thrust required to safely meet the climb out requirements in the event of an engine failure. This saves money by reducing engine wear, reducing fuel consumption and also reduces noise.
    However, on the call for a go-around then full TOGA thrust would be selected which would spool the engines up to the maximum calculated speed determined by the engine computers (based on temperature, pressure, etc).
    TOGA thrust would normally only be selected on take off in certain situations such as if the ambient temperature is above a certain value, the runway is shorter, contaminated (e.g. slush, snow, etc), etc.

    Only the airbus has FLEX (along with MCT- Max climb thrust). Boeing you calculate the derate and enter it into the FMC. If you do not wish to use derate then select same in FMC.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,525 ✭✭✭kona


    bkehoe wrote: »
    Actually on most take offs from dry long runways, the takeoff thrust would be reduced from the maximum 'TOGA' (Take Off Go Around) position. This is called the 'Flex' setting. Airlines do calculations which take into account many things including runway length, weather, ground conditions, aircraft weight/loading, obstacles near the airport, etc, so that they can calculate the minimum thrust required to safely meet the climb out requirements in the event of an engine failure. This saves money by reducing engine wear, reducing fuel consumption and also reduces noise.
    However, on the call for a go-around then full TOGA thrust would be selected which would spool the engines up to the maximum calculated speed determined by the engine computers (based on temperature, pressure, etc).
    TOGA thrust would normally only be selected on take off in certain situations such as if the ambient temperature is above a certain value, the runway is shorter, contaminated (e.g. slush, snow, etc), etc.

    What percentage would T/O and TOGA thrusts be. Obviously a plane taking off is heavier than landing?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,477 ✭✭✭highlydebased


    kona wrote: »
    What percentage would T/O and TOGA thrusts be. Obviously a plane taking off is heavier than landing?

    TOGA is max thrust 100-102%. Hint is in the name- Takeoff-Go around ;)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,941 ✭✭✭pclancy


    Partial LOL and partial Cringe, I hate reading those stories. They do nothing but incite fear.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,601 ✭✭✭donkey balls


    About ten years or more ago there was a headline in one of the red top rags about a flight having to make an emergency landing,And the pax thought they were going to dye as the flight deck crew could not speak english:rolleyes: HELLO english is the first langauge in aviation.
    Speaking of so called aviation experts anyone know what that gerry byrne journo guy did before writing for the sindo as an aviation expert i.e what back ground does he have to comment on things aviation.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 20,009 ✭✭✭✭Run_to_da_hills


    Doors falling off helicopters are another thing press get excited over. :p

    http://www.herald.ie/news/pilot-error-blamed-for-door-falling-off-cullens-helicopter-1787448.html


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,154 ✭✭✭bkehoe


    Only the airbus has FLEX (along with MCT- Max climb thrust). Boeing you calculate the derate and enter it into the FMC. If you do not wish to use derate then select same in FMC.

    You seem to indicate that the Airbus is different to the Boeing in this case...it is not (just because the boeing doesn't have a flex throttle detent doesn't mean it's not a flex takeoff ;) ); both rely on assumed temperatures, both enter the assumed temperature into the FMGS/FMC, and you select the type of takeoff in the FMC. The only difference is the thrust lever detents that the Airbus has for the corresponding thrust settings which makes life a tad easier. ;)

    Derating is somewhat different to a flex takeoff. You can even have a combination of a derated engine and with a flex temperature applied to it on certain aircraft.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 708 ✭✭✭A320


    Doors falling off helicopters are another thing press get excited over. :p

    http://www.herald.ie/news/pilot-error-blamed-for-door-falling-off-cullens-helicopter-1787448.html

    I dont care what any report said,it was definitely cullens fault,dougal in the father ted episode come to mind!


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