Average Dates For Cutting Silage!!!

TheClubMan · 13-07-2014 03:05PM #1

Well folks,

I was just wondering what dates do people usually harvest their first and second cut silage in different parts of the country?

I know this year has been exceptional with very good grass growth everywhere but just a rough date.

Interested to see the difference between different soil types and areas of the country.

Kovu · 13-07-2014 03:25PM

South Leitrim here- First two weeks of July if possible. Second cut....what second cut?

severeoversteer · 13-07-2014 03:26PM

first cut at least done by 25th of may
have baled some silage in april before, was famous stuff. you need good drying weather though

once may comes we are making silage right through till September October time,

I don't budget or measure grass, I try and grow as much grass as possible from the outset and buy up more stock to eat it if there are surpluses which is the beauty of drystock

simx · 13-07-2014 05:02PM

Had some in May, June, August and September last year, only did first cut this year couple weeks ago due to reseeding and other reasons, will be aiming for May first cut next year if possible

td5man · 13-07-2014 05:07PM

Third or fourth week of May for first cut and second cut 2 months later.

whelan2 · 13-07-2014 05:38PM

june bank holiday first cut, august bank holiday second cut

freedominacup · 13-07-2014 05:47PM

Aim to have n gone from first cut for 10th of May and second cut 6 weeks later.

munkus · 13-07-2014 05:47PM

South Galway. Single cut, usually close fields second week of April, well grazed at that stage. Cut second week of June.

I'm assuming that guys cutting in May have it closed very early?

freedominacup · 13-07-2014 05:48PM

munkus wrote: »

South Galway. Single cut, usually close fields second week of April, well grazed at that stage. Cut second week of June.

I'm assuming that guys cutting in May have it closed very early?

All silage ground grazed in spring. Closed some paddocks a week before first cut this year.

I said · 13-07-2014 05:54PM

June bank holiday ish

Reggie. · 13-07-2014 07:35PM

I said wrote: »

June bank holiday ish

Same as that and second cut around sept

stanflt · 13-07-2014 08:02PM

east meath

1st week of may-every 5-6weeks thereafter

ps silage made in april this year

Timmaay · 13-07-2014 08:03PM

freedominacup wrote: »

Aim to have n gone from first cut for 10th of May and second cut 6 weeks later.

How is your silage harvested? SP or wagon? And does the relatively early and lighter 1st cut result in any sort of reduced rate? Moving forward I really need to have similar dates to you, later 2nd cuts just don't work with dry land, you end up with the cows grazing heavy covers that got put back in.

mahoney_j · 13-07-2014 08:11PM

Always aim for 20/25 may first cut here.second cut not usually taken but measure aggressively and take a heap of surplus bales from paddocks through sumner..403 in stack so far + 2 pits of verg good first cut and 10 acres of wc wheat and brewers to follow.at the moment I'm covered for feedibg everything from 01/11 to late march.whole crop and I reckon Nother 200 bales to follow.you can never have enough.some lads here think I'm nuts,but I'm keeping fertliser out grass grazed and bales wrapped every week.working well so far.not too bothered if I'm looking at 100 bales or a pit of silage next April.better looking at it than for it.

Greengrass1 · 13-07-2014 08:16PM

mahoney_j wrote: »

Always aim for 20/25 may first cut here.second cut not usually taken but measure aggressively and take a heap of surplus bales from paddocks through sumner..403 in stack so far + 2 pits of verg good first cut and 10 acres of wc wheat and brewers to follow.at the moment I'm covered for feedibg everything from 01/11 to late march.whole crop and I reckon Nother 200 bales to follow.you can never have enough.some lads here think I'm nuts,but I'm keeping fertliser out grass grazed and bales wrapped every week.working well so far.not too bothered if I'm looking at 100 bales or a pit of silage next April.better looking at it than for it.

Jesus Mahoney. 600 bales of surplus. Get more cows in will ye.
I made 120 surplus this yr so far. Thatll be about it id say as im soraying off 8 ac for reseed at end of month. have 550 bales of first cut silage taken 5/10july.
That's the date we always cut as it was when I get my school and college holidays. From now in we will be taking first cut in mid may I hope

mf240 · 13-07-2014 08:16PM

Start in may finsh in oct. All bales and bits of scattered land.

What kind of money is the brewers mahoney? And is it hard to get it?

mahoney_j · 13-07-2014 08:19PM

stanflt wrote: »

east meath

1st week of may-every 5-6weeks thereafter

ps silage made in april this year

As sr increases stan do u think you'll still be able to aim for that eArly a first cut stan???.im all for early quality sage but also early spring grass and I feel here by pushing sr on milking block silage will be back a bit hence interest in wc and maize

mahoney_j · 13-07-2014 08:21PM

Greengrass1 wrote: »

Jesus Mahoney. 600 bales of surplus. Get more cows in will ye.
I made 120 surplus this yr so far. Thatll be about it id say as im soraying off 8 ac for reseed at end of month. have 550 bales of first cut silage taken 5/10july.
That's the date we always cut as it was when I get my school and college holidays. From now in we will be taking first cut in mid may I hope

Quota and lack of it is a bitch gg

Reggie. · 13-07-2014 08:24PM

mahoney_j wrote: »

Quota and lack of it is a bitch gg

What about a few sucklers

mahoney_j · 13-07-2014 08:26PM

Reggie. wrote: »

What about a few sucklers

Sure I might as well be feeding the dog as them Reggie.,ye all say there's nothing from sucklers!!!!

Reggie. · 13-07-2014 08:27PM

mahoney_j wrote: »

Sure I might as well be feeding the dog as them Reggie.,ye all say there's nothing from sucklers!!!!

Cheeky

stanflt · 13-07-2014 08:37PM

mahoney_j wrote: »

As sr increases stan do u think you'll still be able to aim for that eArly a first cut stan???.im all for early quality sage but also early spring grass and I feel here by pushing sr on milking block silage will be back a bit hence interest in wc and maize

will prob get earlier on grasing platform as sr increases so that all ground will be in play come mid may
aim to need less silage per cow as median calving date improves
looking at feeding maize/beet/brewers when cows are at grass at the shoulders and replace silage with as much fresh grazed grass as possible
when im buffering like that my base feed to yield will go higher(ie from 25litres to 30 so only litres over 30 will require 0.5kg meal.
this will make sure that margin over feed will still be profitable with low milk price exposure
the benefit of feed to yield is most rewarding when milk price is low

Timmaay · 13-07-2014 09:07PM

mahoney_j wrote: »

Quota and lack of it is a bitch gg

That's 600 surplus bales from the overall farm or grazing block?? What is your overall SR?

mahoney_j · 13-07-2014 09:10PM

stanflt wrote: »

will prob get earlier on grasing platform as sr increases so that all ground will be in play come mid may
aim to need less silage per cow as median calving date improves
looking at feeding maize/beet/brewers when cows are at grass at the shoulders and replace silage with as much fresh grazed grass as possible
when im buffering like that my base feed to yield will go higher(ie from 25litres to 30 so only litres over 30 will require 0.5kg meal.
this will make sure that margin over feed will still be profitable with low milk price exposure
the benefit of feed to yield is most rewarding when milk price is low

Interesting take on it and on feed to yield have to say fully agree.aiming to push constant sr on milking block to 3,6 maby 3.7 and maximise quality grass/silage from milk block and heifer block .ultimTe aim is to have 3 grazing types,milkers maidens and heifer calves .and to measure and graze/bale to max potential with added wc,maize and brewers imported in.winter milk have to say is now shelved due to no decent winter contract and lack of interest compact spring calving with max use of grazed grass and a tonne plus of concentrate is now becoming my motto.take 6 weeks off chill out with wife and family,go skiing and recharge batteries from mid December tol mate jan us now my miotto

mahoney_j · 13-07-2014 09:11PM

Timmaay wrote: »

That's 600 surplus bales from the overall farm or grazing block?? What is your overall SR?

Overall farm Tim plus. Few bits of silage and 4.5 acres of Italian/crimson
Overall sr 2.2

Timmaay · 13-07-2014 09:50PM

mahoney_j wrote: »

Interesting take on it and on feed to yield have to say fully agree.aiming to push constant sr on milking block to 3,6 maby 3.7 and maximise quality grass/silage from milk block and heifer block .ultimTe aim is to have 3 grazing types,milkers maidens and heifer calves .and to measure and graze/bale to max potential with added wc,maize and brewers imported in.winter milk have to say is now shelved due to no decent winter contract and lack of interest compact spring calving with max use of grazed grass and a tonne plus of concentrate is now becoming my motto.take 6 weeks off chill out with wife and family,go skiing and recharge batteries from mid December tol mate jan us now my miotto

Where to then, when you have everything perfected ha, at the max SR and as high an average yield as is practical? Would you consider a 2nd herd? If a larger block of land showed up locally would you ever consider upping ship and moving?

mahoney_j · 13-07-2014 10:05PM

Timmaay wrote: »

Where to then, when you have everything perfected ha, at the max SR and as high an average yield as is practical? Would you consider a 2nd herd? If a larger block of land showed up locally would you ever consider upping ship and moving?

Tbh it'd be hard to after spending the amount I have on grassland and infrastructure over last few years Tim.a second herd means a hell of a lot more work and investment .im getting to a stage now where I'm comfortable. To a point but that's a dangerous position I have been eying up 80 acres next door for a long time andvi fit ever comes up I want to be ready to pounce.also fad from perfection here still a lot to do just like us all talking to a well established freind of mibe during week and he tells me that every day of the week he enters the yard he is spending 10 k a day in his head!!!!! Proab no different to anybody's!!

darragh_haven · 13-07-2014 10:30PM

In West Cork. First cut done between 15th and 22nd of may every year. All silage ground grazed at least once in spring. Most of the grass variety has a may 25th heading out date

frazzledhome · 13-07-2014 10:46PM

Start mid May and finish with a small third cut in Sept. Cut bales most weeks stop in Aug. 1000 bales of surplus to date. Overall Sr 2.8

Reggie. · 13-07-2014 10:54PM

frazzledhome wrote: »

Start mid May and finish with a small third cut in Sept. Cut bales most weeks stop in Aug. 1000 bales of surplus to date. Overall Sr 2.8

1000 bales :eek:

And what the hell is SR

darragh_haven · 13-07-2014 10:56PM

Reggie. wrote: »

1000 bales :eek:

And what the hell is SR

Stocking Rate (per Hectare)

Reggie. · 13-07-2014 11:00PM

darragh_haven wrote: »

Stocking Rate (per Hectare)

Thanking you sir

freedominacup · 14-07-2014 05:23AM

Timmaay wrote: »

How is your silage harvested? SP or wagon? And does the relatively early and lighter 1st cut result in any sort of reduced rate? Moving forward I really need to have similar dates to you, later 2nd cuts just don't work with dry land, you end up with the cows grazing heavy covers that got put back in.

Wagon by the hour tim so reduced rate due to less time spent picking up. I think we can grow the most of the tonnes that other guys can we just have to harvest some of them early in the season and feed them back. We have around a tonne of bale dm harvested from grazing area. Other than an out farm which provided around 30% of first cut this year nothing was stopped until the middle of April and we continued to "stop" paddocks for first cut right up to the w'end before we cut and something similar for second cut. I wouldn't be counting these tonnes in the surplus harvested from grazing area.

I have a mad notion that a SR of 5 is achieveable with winter milk and all winter forage plus whatever buffers needed for the shoulders bought in. Any thoughts?

With rents of €200/acre min on conacre, 2 runs with a harvester with probably an extra charge for the long draw, 7 plus bags of compound, mahoneys €800 for wholecrop bought in doesn't look expensive. Esp. weighed against the fact that most land let on conacre is spun out, low fertility, fcuked grasses and a lot less acres than are showing on the map with overgrown ditches, dead corners etc. If you get a long lease on ground like this you won't see €400/acre going into a re-seed with digger work to get your acres back, stone picking and anything upto 8 tonnes of lime needed to get it right which will add €100/acre to the cost of renting it for the first 5 years. If you're 2 cutting silage from sward year in year out it'll be getting shook after 5 years and it all has to start again.

An agreed contract to supply your winter feed looks like a lot less hassle for slightly higher cost.

sheebadog · 14-07-2014 05:54AM

freedominacup wrote: »

Wagon by the hour tim so reduced rate due to less time spent picking up. I think we can grow the most of the tonnes that other guys can we just have to harvest some of them early in the season and feed them back. We have around a tonne of bale dm harvested from grazing area. Other than an out farm which provided around 30% of first cut this year nothing was stopped until the middle of April and we continued to "stop" paddocks for first cut right up to the w'end before we cut and something similar for second cut. I wouldn't be counting these tonnes in the surplus harvested from grazing area.

I have a mad notion that a SR of 5 is achieveable with winter milk and all winter forage plus whatever buffers needed for the shoulders bought in. Any thoughts?

With rents of €200/acre min on conacre, 2 runs with a harvester with probably an extra charge for the long draw, 7 plus bags of compound, mahoneys €800 for wholecrop bought in doesn't look expensive. Esp. weighed against the fact that most land let on conacre is spun out, low fertility, fcuked grasses and a lot less acres than are showing on the map with overgrown ditches, dead corners etc. If you get a long lease on ground like this you won't see €400/acre going into a re-seed with digger work to get your acres back, stone picking and anything upto 8 tonnes of lime needed to get it right which will add €100/acre to the cost of renting it for the first 5 years. If you're 2 cutting silage from sward year in year out it'll be getting shook after 5 years and it all has to start again.

An agreed contract to supply your winter feed looks like a lot less hassle for slightly higher cost.

8 tons of lime per acre? Surely a typo!!
If you're willing to import forage sky is the limit with sr.

Greengrass1 · 14-07-2014 06:42AM

frazzledhome wrote: »

Start mid May and finish with a small third cut in Sept. Cut bales most weeks stop in Aug. 1000 bales of surplus to date. Overall Sr 2.8

I know its too late for ye now as you upping numbers next yr so you won't have that pile of suplus all the time but would the likes of a small wagon for yourself and have a small pit be an easier option.
Putting out bales to the amount of cows you have would make ye sick.

freedominacup · 14-07-2014 07:29AM

sheebadog wrote: »

8 tons of lime per acre? Surely a typo!!
If you're willing to import forage sky is the limit with sr.

You obviously wouldn't be horsing it out in one lot but a five tonne deficit wouldn't be unheard of and curing that will take 8 tonnes over 4/5 years. The sky's the limit if you are willing to pay the rents as well. I'm arguing bought cereal forages are better value. I'd still be aiming to get max grazed grass into them but I think 5 is the limit in that system.

Timmaay · 14-07-2014 09:30AM

freedominacup wrote: »

Wagon by the hour tim so reduced rate due to less time spent picking up. I think we can grow the most of the tonnes that other guys can we just have to harvest some of them early in the season and feed them back. We have around a tonne of bale dm harvested from grazing area. Other than an out farm which provided around 30% of first cut this year nothing was stopped until the middle of April and we continued to "stop" paddocks for first cut right up to the w'end before we cut and something similar for second cut. I wouldn't be counting these tonnes in the surplus harvested from grazing area.

I have a mad notion that a SR of 5 is achieveable with winter milk and all winter forage plus whatever buffers needed for the shoulders bought in. Any thoughts?

With rents of €200/acre min on conacre, 2 runs with a harvester with probably an extra charge for the long draw, 7 plus bags of compound, mahoneys €800 for wholecrop bought in doesn't look expensive. Esp. weighed against the fact that most land let on conacre is spun out, low fertility, fcuked grasses and a lot less acres than are showing on the map with overgrown ditches, dead corners etc. If you get a long lease on ground like this you won't see €400/acre going into a re-seed with digger work to get your acres back, stone picking and anything upto 8 tonnes of lime needed to get it right which will add €100/acre to the cost of renting it for the first 5 years. If you're 2 cutting silage from sward year in year out it'll be getting shook after 5 years and it all has to start again.

An agreed contract to supply your winter feed looks like a lot less hassle for slightly higher cost.

And then add in pricking around with 5 or 6 small parcels of land within afew miles of your farm, back and forward all day wasting time and diesel. I've just worked out I've bought in close on 2/3s of my winter fodder this year, that's largely opportunities purchases with the good harvest this year, but if I can do it more consistently moving forward it would save me a hell of alot of messing around.

Reggie. · 14-07-2014 09:37AM

Timmaay wrote: »

And then add in pricking around with 5 or 6 small parcels of land within afew miles of your farm, back and forward all day wasting time and diesel. I've just worked out I've bought in close on 2/3s of my winter fodder this year, that's largely opportunities purchases with the good harvest this year, but if I can do it more consistently moving forward it would save me a hell of alot of messing around.

Often thought of making silage to supply others if ya know what I mean. Wonder if there's a future in it

C0N0R · 14-07-2014 11:00AM

Reggie. wrote: »

Often thought of making silage to supply others if ya know what I mean. Wonder if there's a future in it

Definatly a future in it, it's something I would look into if I wanted to expand, purchase it on a kg of dry matter basis at a certain m.e is the only way it can be done fairly. And it has to be done fair otherwise its a waste of time and also a commitment to supply for a number of years to.

To answer the original question, first cut as soon as possible in late May weather and land permitting. Second cut six weeks later weather permitting, if I got a decent window in the weather id be mowing here now. Surplus paddocks baled as and when.

Greengrass1 · 14-07-2014 11:07AM

Reggie. wrote: »

Often thought of making silage to supply others if ya know what I mean. Wonder if there's a future in it

Will you make money out of it? If you put your whole farm into growing silage it will use a lot if major minerals and as well lads want to buy good quality grass and if you want to sell 3 cuts of silage in the yr you need good grass to get it.
You would need to do a de with farmers you sell to that they give you back say 5k gallons of slurry for every acre of ground they buy so its less fert cost on you and you keep your organic matter right

frazzledhome · 14-07-2014 03:14PM

Reggie. wrote: »

Often thought of making silage to supply others if ya know what I mean. Wonder if there's a future in it

I for one will be looking for a silage supplier in 2-3 yrs time.

Timmaay · 14-07-2014 03:26PM

Greengrass1 wrote: »

Will you make money out of it? If you put your whole farm into growing silage it will use a lot if major minerals and as well lads want to buy good quality grass and if you want to sell 3 cuts of silage in the yr you need good grass to get it.
You would need to do a de with farmers you sell to that they give you back say 5k gallons of slurry for every acre of ground they buy so its less fert cost on you and you keep your organic matter right

I'd tend to agree. The grass silage I bought in was largely just an extra cut that the owner didnt need, against them purely selling just cuts off the land. As GG said, you will need to bring organic matter back in. What would work much better would be to operate closely enough with the likes of a dairyfarmer, he buys a cut of silage off you, and you also let him graze heifers on the land during the shoulders, alongside wintering them if you have the sheds/slurry. Once this deal works longterm it solves the problems that freedom mentioned, conacre that lads wont put money into, or farmers renting land longer term at 200e/acre and then spending another 200quid between reseeding/drainage etc only to lose it 5yrs later.

In any case, probably the biggest killer to trying to sell grass silage is distance! Its very expensive to transport water, which the likes of 1st cut with 20-30% dm mostly is, so unless you got farmers within say 2 or 3 miles interested then forget about selling silage.

Milked out · 14-07-2014 03:45PM

Timmaay wrote: »

I'd tend to agree. The grass silage I bought in was largely just an extra cut that the owner didnt need, against them purely selling just cuts off the land. As GG said, you will need to bring organic matter back in. What would work much better would be to operate closely enough with the likes of a dairyfarmer, he buys a cut of silage off you, and you also let him graze heifers on the land during the shoulders, alongside wintering them if you have the sheds/slurry. Once this deal works longterm it solves the problems that freedom mentioned, conacre that lads wont put money into, or farmers renting land longer term at 200e/acre and then spending another 200quid between reseeding/drainage etc only to lose it 5yrs later.

In any case, probably the biggest killer to trying to sell grass silage is distance! Its very expensive to transport water, which the likes of 1st cut with 20-30% dm mostly is, so unless you got farmers within say 2 or 3 miles interested then forget about selling silage.

To be honest I'd prefer to rent ground longterm than buy grass silage as you'd have more control. If I was buying in forage, maize or whole crop may be better options I'd say but with winter milk our system may get more of a return from it

just do it · 14-07-2014 06:22PM

mahoney_j wrote: »

Interesting take on it and on feed to yield have to say fully agree.aiming to push constant sr on milking block to 3,6 maby 3.7 and maximise quality grass/silage from milk block and heifer block .ultimTe aim is to have 3 grazing types,milkers maidens and heifer calves .and to measure and graze/bale to max potential with added wc,maize and brewers imported in.winter milk have to say is now shelved due to no decent winter contract and lack of interest compact spring calving with max use of grazed grass and a tonne plus of concentrate is now becoming my motto.take 6 weeks off chill out with wife and family,go skiing and recharge batteries from mid December tol mate jan us now my miotto

Best mission statement I've read from a farmer. Not enough value is placed on clear goals and time off.

just do it · 14-07-2014 06:37PM

Would have been mid-June with second cut 10 weeks later i.e. late August. That's not uncommon around here. Suckler lads only know about bulk!

With reseed this year cut on May 30th and would have taken 2nd cut 6 weeks later but weather didn't oblige. Looking at the forecast it will be 8-9 weeks at the earliest. Joys of being on the West coast!

With reseeding programme and improvement of paddocks to allow them to be mowed I could see 1st cut being in late May, small 2nd cut 6wks later, and start taking surplus bales of paddocks.

severeoversteer · 14-07-2014 06:48PM

all dairy farmers I know are getting out of winter milk

so if I was a dairy farmer I would get into it:D

Greengrass1 · 14-07-2014 07:01PM

severeoversteer wrote: »

all dairy farmers I know are getting out of winter milk

so if I was a dairy farmer I would get into it:D

I think were going to stay in it. I will miss that money big time if we do

mahoney_j · 14-07-2014 07:08PM

Greengrass1 wrote: »

I think were going to stay in it. I will miss that money big time if we do

Cash flow is no reason to stick with it gg,I don't know ur winter contract but without a good obe its unviable.even in my situation for the next few years where my borrowings are high milking year round for cash flow just didn't make sense.compact spring calving with max use of grass and supplementation with high solids will pay more

Timmaay · 14-07-2014 09:48PM

GG go actually do out a cash flow plan and you'll be fine, I'll agree with Mahoney it's the weakest excuse ever for sticking it out. Winter milk is fine if you have a big enough scale, ie 50 or 100 autumn calvers, but for the most case having the likes of 20/30 autumn cows is just not worth the extra work load of having more groups of animals and 2 sets of calving and breeding seasons. It only real use is for herds with poor fertility or herds growing rapidly who don't want to cull for fertility.

Actually talking about cash flow, anyone else doing the teagasc cash flow planner course? I got my 1st meeting this wed.

Average Dates For Cutting Silage!!!

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