Left job, non-compete issue with next role.

techguy · 14-09-2014 05:20PM #1

Hey All,

So I voluntarily left my last job with nothing else lined up - I had planned on doing various things such as travel, personal projects etc.

Now, an interesting project has been presented to me which could lead to a decent job in the future so it's worth pursuing.

There are a small number of aspects to the new project which may look similar to my last job which has a broad non-compete clause.

I am not looking for specific legal advice on this issue but more general guidance and the experience of others in the past.

How enforceable are non-competes in Ireland? It's worth mentioning here that the prospective new employer is not based in Ireland.
Where is a good place to get proper legal advice on this? Government bodies? Walk into a solicitors office, how much would they charge?
Obviously I don't want to wrangling with the law. I still have a relationship with my last manager and was half thinking of meeting him and discussing the slight overlap and possibly getting the "written permission" as referred to in my contract. Fat chance of that i'd say but worth a shot? Is this a really daft idea?

So in general what have people done in the past. How advisable is it do absolutely nothing and just motor on with the new project?

Cheers

NoQuarter · 14-09-2014 06:43PM

There is quite a bit of case law on it and the position is clear enough. Rather than pay a solicitor, you could walk into a book shop, pick up a contract law book, skip to the section on "restraint of trade" and have a quick read.

It depends on the job and the parameters of if. Non competes cant be broad but it depends. The classic examples are a global arms dealer and a wall street banker. A 1000 meter non-compete clause could be fine for one but not the other.

Some general advice and not legal advice would be to take on the role if you want. Do you really think your ex employer will have the time and the means to pursue you through the Courts to enforce your non-compete? If not, then take the job. If so, then consider the worst outcome, ie, the courts enforce the contract and you leave the new role.

Sala · 14-09-2014 07:25PM

It probably depends on how important you were whether they'd do anything! Is the jurisdiction of it limited ( since new job is abroad)? And the time? Some clauses can be limited to say a month so it may not affect you anyway

Manach · 14-09-2014 07:29PM

Offhand, it is not really effective as the EU law is very pro-right to work. It would only begin to be an issue if one took a list of clients and was directly poaching work from an old firm by using such contacts.

Bepolite · 14-09-2014 10:26PM

OP I note the use of your term 'broad' in relation to the clause. While specific legal advice can't be given, broad is good. RoT is not looked upon favourably and the broader they are the easier it is to strike them down in their entity.

I'm open to correction but IIRC courts don't look to save any part of the provision if the rest of it falls.

FreudianSlippers · 15-09-2014 08:19AM

NoQuarter wrote: »

There is quite a bit of case law on it and the position is clear enough. Rather than pay a solicitor, you could walk into a book shop, pick up a contract law book, skip to the section on "restraint of trade" and have a quick read.

It depends on the job and the parameters of if. Non competes cant be broad but it depends. The classic examples are a global arms dealer and a wall street banker. A 1000 meter non-compete clause could be fine for one but not the other.

Some general advice and not legal advice would be to take on the role if you want. Do you really think your ex employer will have the time and the means to pursue you through the Courts to enforce your non-compete? If not, then take the job. If so, then consider the worst outcome, ie, the courts enforce the contract and you leave the new role.

It's been a while since I looked at these issues, but IIRC the distance thing is key. Your employer may be able to contract with you to not compete in a specific area (i.e. north Dublin), but the more broad the geographical distance, the less likely the clause is to be valid.

techguy · 15-09-2014 08:45AM

Sala wrote: »

It probably depends on how important you were whether they'd do anything! Is the jurisdiction of it limited ( since new job is abroad)? And the time? Some clauses can be limited to say a month so it may not affect you anyway

The time specified in this case is 12 months. I wouldn't say I was that important to be honest. I did work on some cutting edge stuff but junior all the same.

Bepolite wrote: »

OP I note the use of your term 'broad' in relation to the clause. While specific legal advice can't be given, broad is good. RoT is not looked upon favourably and the broader they are the easier it is to strike them down in their entity.

I'm open to correction but IIRC courts don't look to save any part of the provision if the rest of it falls.

Actually I take that back. There are some fairly specific points in it which is ok but the section that would be relevant to me seems quite broad really. It's actually bordering on unfair and I would say would that it would be quite restrictive.

I'll do more reading and also investigate the RoT issue. There appear to be plenty of cases online.

Thanks everybody.

Sala · 15-09-2014 01:18PM

techguy wrote: »

The time specified in this case is 12 months. I wouldn't say I was that important to be honest. I did work on some cutting edge stuff but junior all the same.

Actually I take that back. There are some fairly specific points in it which is ok but the section that would be relevant to me seems quite broad really. It's actually bordering on unfair and I would say would that it would be quite restrictive.

I'll do more reading and also investigate the RoT issue. There appear to be plenty of cases online.

Thanks everybody.

That seems quite a long time for a junior person. What about the territory - does the old company have offices in the country you'll be moving to them - i.e. would you be moving to a direct competitor?

techguy · 15-09-2014 01:38PM

I thought it wasn't too bad to be honest. Actually for my college placement the employer had two years down.. For an intern, in hindsight that was outrageous!

I thought 12 months would be standard.

No, they don't have offices in the country. And it wouldn't be a competitor, probably viewed more as a potential customer in previous employers eyes.

conorh91 · 15-09-2014 01:50PM

In this jurisdiction, the Irish courts prefer "garden leave" to non-compete.

Even in a highly specialised area of work (employee in patent law, iirc), the Courts have declined to enforce non-competes.

There was a bit of hype surrounding non-compete clauses when some NAMA employees skidaddled to big property companies, but the general consensus (from people who seem to understand this area of law very well) is that non-compete clauses would have been unlikely to have been of assistance to NAMA, being unenforceable in practice.

I'm not aware of any Irish case law which would be of consolation to any employer whose employee has just left them for a competitor. It would be a very hard sell to convince the Court to enforce the clause, in almost any profession.

techguy · 15-09-2014 01:52PM

conorh91 wrote: »

In this jurisdiction, the Irish courts prefer "garden leave" to non-compete.

Even in a highly specialised area of work (employee in patent law, iirc), the Courts have declined to enforce non-competes.

There was a bit of hype surrounding non-compete clauses when some NAMA employees skidaddled to big property companies, but the general consensus (from people who seem to understand this area of law very well) is that non-compete clauses would have been unlikely to have been of assistance to NAMA, being unenforceable in practice.

I'm not aware of any Irish case law which would be of consolation to any employer whose employee has just left them for a competitor.

Cheers, interesting. I guess I really need to head over to the Law Society where I'm assuming there will be lots of reading material on this. Am I correct?

Grolschevik · 15-09-2014 02:06PM

techguy wrote: »

the Law Society where I'm assuming there will be lots of reading material on this. Am I correct?

Yeah, but only for members!

Best bet would be a large public library like the Ilac library:
http://www.dublincity.ie/main-menu-services-recreation-culture-dublin-city-public-libraries-and-archive-locations-hours-2

You can access their online catalogue from that link, see what they have.

conorh91 · 15-09-2014 06:54PM

techguy wrote: »

Cheers, interesting. I guess I really need to head over to the Law Society where I'm assuming there will be lots of reading material on this. Am I correct?

You might get some guidance from the main Irish case on non-competes, which is Murgitroyd v Purdy.

http://www.courts.ie/Judgments.nsf/597645521f07ac9a80256ef30048ca52/24bfaa177a6e270b802570c7004ffba3?OpenDocument

As far as I am aware, the legal status of non competition clauses, as described by Clarke J in his judgment, has not changed.

The last section of the judgment, "Enforceability" is the bit that will be of most relevance to you.

Left job, non-compete issue with next role.

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