Budget Milking Machine Upgrade - Any Opinions?

cjpm · 18-12-2015 10:25PM #1

Following on from the Milking Times thread, I've been thinking about a budget upgrade of the Miking Parlour. HOWEVER if I was going to upgrade it would need to be as cheap as possible (within reason) without compromising the Parlour performance.

Currently (2015) milking 95 cows with a 10 unit machine (2 foot 2 centres) with ACRs and parlour feeders.

Very happy with machine in fairness, although tend to be waiting for cows to finish with the ACRs

Looking like 110 cows for 2016. Might (in a few years, depending on Milk Price) go to 150 cows absolute maximum, thats what the acres around the parlour could manage comfortably.

Have space to go up to 20 or 22 units if i wanted, however I don't think I would go that big...

Was thinking 18 units with ACRs and maybe some sort of locking headrail/sequential bailing to control cows and help speed up cow entry and exit... Eight rows of 18 cows would be 144 cows in total

Thing is my neighbour might be selling an identical parlour, 8 units.

Exactly the same as mine, same jars, vacuum pump and double diaphram milk pump, same electic feeders, does not have ACRS (obviously some might add!)

Now if i was to buy it and stick it onto the back of my machine....:rolleyes:

I could do all the concrete work myself, and a lot of the steel work

What issues would ye forsee with such a plan?

Has anyone seen anything similar done?

I presume the Milk and Vacuum Pumps would have to be plumbed in a parallel arrangement to my own.

Maybe I should go for an electric milk pump in the pit??

Upgraded milk lines, wash lines and vacuum lines would definitely be required...

Adding feeders would be easy enough as my feeder controller can work 18 feeders and would just be a case of extending augers.

I have a plenty big enough Bulk Tank and Wash Troughs already. Plate Cooler, Water Heater and Filter sock would have to be up sized.

Having a suffient electricity supply may be an issue to run the extra motors, although the bulk tank is ice bank so i could set that not to run during milking times. Currently it starts whenever it wants, its 5HP.

Any opinions/personal experiences greatly appreciated. :cool:

jaymla627 · 18-12-2015 10:52PM

cjpm wrote: »

Following on from the Milking Times thread, I've been thinking about a budget upgrade of the Miking Parlour. HOWEVER if I was going to upgrade it would need to be as cheap as possible (within reason) without compromising the Parlour performance.

Currently (2015) milking 95 cows with a 10 unit machine (2 foot 2 centres) with ACRs and parlour feeders.

Very happy with machine in fairness, although tend to be waiting for cows to finish with the ACRs

Looking like 110 cows for 2016. Might (in a few years, depending on Milk Price) go to 150 cows absolute maximum, thats what the acres around the parlour could manage comfortably.

Have space to go up to 20 or 22 units if i wanted, however I don't think I would go that big...

Was thinking 18 units with ACRs and maybe some sort of locking headrail/sequential bailing to control cows and help speed up cow entry and exit... Eight rows of 18 cows would be 144 cows in total

Thing is my neighbour might be selling an identical parlour, 8 units.

Exactly the same as mine, same jars, vacuum pump and double diaphram milk pump, same electic feeders, does not have ACRS (obviously some might add!)

Now if i was to buy it and stick it onto the back of my machine....:rolleyes:

I could do all the concrete work myself, and a lot of the steel work

What issues would ye forsee with such a plan?

Has anyone seen anything similar done?

I presume the Milk and Vacuum Pumps would have to be plumbed in a parallel arrangement to my own.

Maybe I should go for an electric milk pump in the pit??

Upgraded milk lines, wash lines and vacuum lines would definitely be required...

Adding feeders would be easy enough as my feeder controller can work 18 feeders and would just be a case of extending augers.

I have a plenty big enough Bulk Tank and Wash Troughs already. Plate Cooler, Water Heater and Filter sock would have to be up sized.

Having a suffient electricity supply may be an issue to run the extra motors, although the bulk tank is ice bank so i could set that not to run during milking times. Currently it starts whenever it wants, its 5HP.

Any opinions/personal experiences greatly appreciated. :cool:

sequential bailing and cheap don't really fall under the same heading, unless your cows are lunatic ninjas their really is no need for it, a straight run into the parlour from collecting yard with no steps/ramps and a good wide exit at the front of the parlour are the most important things for cow flow no amount of gadgets will make up for this.....
You'll need a 3 inch milk line/vacum line minimum, you'll be able to pair up the vacuum pumps no bother and will probably need to invest in a high capacity electric milk pump along with a air purge system for washing and you'll be sorted

cjpm · 19-12-2015 07:56AM

jaymla627 wrote: »

sequential bailing and cheap don't really fall under the same heading, unless your cows are lunatic ninjas their really is no need for it, a straight run into the parlour from collecting yard with no steps/ramps and a good wide exit at the front of the parlour are the most important things for cow flow no amount of gadgets will make up for this.....
You'll need a 3 inch milk line/vacum line minimum, you'll be able to pair up the vacuum pumps no bother and will probably need to invest in a high capacity electric milk pump along with a air purge system for washing and you'll be sorted

You are correct that they are not Ninjas, however I do have a slight problem with the stronger ones pushing into the smaller ones feed troughs which I would like to deal with

keep going · 19-12-2015 08:17AM

if you want to do it really cheap,put the machine on the end and run a separate line back to the top of jar,sell the two diaphram pumps and put in electric milk pump.now run a separate vac line from the new pump to that machine .running the two milk lines means machine will probaly wash better than big lines

Sam Kade · 19-12-2015 08:21AM

I can't see that job done cheap, lots of gadgets to dismantle and put back together. You'll also need a technician to pair up the pumps if he doesn't persuade you to get one bigger pump motor. If it was a basic parlour it would be easy to take it out and put it back the same way.

bogman_bass · 19-12-2015 08:43AM

cjpm wrote: »

You are correct that they are not Ninjas, however I do have a slight problem with the stronger ones pushing into the smaller ones feed troughs which I would like to deal with

A few bards of plywood would sort that a lot cheaper

whelan2 · 19-12-2015 08:59AM

We used to have a 10 unit, we put in 5 more units at the back. We had been using 2 parlours- I had an 8 unit on outfarm when I was starting up- so we used feeders and units from there. We put in a bigger pipeline and pump and acrs. 15 units is plenty for 150 cows

cjpm · 19-12-2015 09:33AM

bogman_bass wrote: »

A few bards of plywood would sort that a lot cheaper

I do have concrete troughs with small walls built up between them to keep them divided. However if I make the space any tighter I will really slow cows down leaving the parlour.... And if a cow goes into a trough too soon I will have problems getting them to move up further to the correct positions.

I know seq. bailing is overkill for a budget upgrade alright though, unless I win the lotto in the mean time

cjpm · 19-12-2015 09:35AM

keep going wrote: »

if you want to do it really cheap,put the machine on the end and run a separate line back to the top of jar,sell the two diaphram pumps and put in electric milk pump.now run a separate vac line from the new pump to that machine .running the two milk lines means machine will probaly wash better than big lines

Sounds good and a hell of a lot cheaper than ripping out loads of the existing parlour. Does anyone have any experience of actually using a set up like that?

I am concerned about properly washing big milk lines if I was to upgrade the existing...

Milked out · 19-12-2015 10:35AM

On the mangers a cousin put a locking barrier on top of his concrete trough for cow control. Here the new mangers I put in have a narrow area for tge cow to go into and there is no bullying with it. Also seeing as you can do feeders.and.steelwork.yourself might be no harm to price up a new 18 unit from 2 or 3.manufacturers and see.how it works out with the grant. You know what you want so could get a price quick enuv? Pics of mangers attached

Sam Kade · 19-12-2015 11:00AM

Milked out wrote: »

On the mangers a cousin put a locking barrier on top of his concrete trough for cow control. Here the new mangers I put in have a narrow area for tge cow to go into and there is no bullying with it. Also seeing as you can do feeders.and.steelwork.yourself might be no harm to price up a new 18 unit from 2 or 3.manufacturers and see.how it works out with the grant. You know what you want so could get a price quick enuv? Pics of mangers attached

Would the cows be slow to exit with the extended dividers between troughs?

Milked out · 19-12-2015 01:23PM

Sam Kade wrote: »

Would the cows be slow to exit with the extended dividers between troughs?

It's 2' 6 centres, they got used to it eventually in terms of getting out of the narrow part they kind lift their heads and step back a bit or bend their necks backwards to get past it but they walk away out fine. I was worried about bigger cpws but no problems so far. Only thing that slows em is if there is ration left in a manger but most don't notice it bar the odd fecker that checks every one before going out. Haven't had feeders here for years and they are goin out as fast as when they got no feed

farmerjj · 19-12-2015 01:30PM

My only bit of advice is go big enough, my rule of thumb is at peak have no more than 8rows, the time u save is worth the extra few bob

Panch18 · 19-12-2015 01:55PM

How about going for a double up? No building work needed, minimal disruption

visatorro · 19-12-2015 08:12PM

if you have room for 22 units put them in. use the space. price up extending the parlour look at all your options. baling is for straw and silage not for parlours!! if you want to save a few pound why not go without the acrs on whatever units you put in. you'd manage fine just take off the back ten first and the acrs will look after themselves. don't bother with jars.

cjpm · 19-12-2015 08:46PM

Milked out wrote: »

On the mangers a cousin put a locking barrier on top of his concrete trough for cow control. Here the new mangers I put in have a narrow area for tge cow to go into and there is no bullying with it. Also seeing as you can do feeders.and.steelwork.yourself might be no harm to price up a new 18 unit from 2 or 3.manufacturers and see.how it works out with the grant. You know what you want so could get a price quick enuv? Pics of mangers attached

Thanks for the pics, tasty job. :cool:

I have heard that locking stall work tend to slow cows exiting with 2'3" centres as they really have to manoeuvre themselves to get out their heads

Milked out · 19-12-2015 09:36PM

cjpm wrote: »

Thanks for the pics, tasty job. :cool:

I have heard that locking stall work tend to slow cows exiting with 2'3" centres as they really have to manoeuvre themselves to get out their heads

Cousins place cows are right angles to pit, troughs seem high and locking stalls seem to allow cow to lift head and pull back, wasn't there in a while now and not sure of measurements. He has 20 units and can leave off first 10 and hold second 10 if he wants.

cjpm · 19-12-2015 10:50PM

Panch18 wrote: »

How about going for a double up? No building work needed, minimal disruption

My pit is narrow, combined with the jars rules out doubling up. I'm not a huge fan of it to be honest.

I do intend doing building work regardless as my current machine is squeezed into the parlour, last jar is an inch from the back wall. The cows enter through 2 small doors, and for me to go out to the collecting yard I have to squeeze through a gap at the end of the rump rail and go out either of the doors.

At the very least I will be blowing down the back wall and creating good wide entrances, hoping to roof some of the collecting yard too.

Markcheese · 21-12-2015 11:27PM

Is your plant room big enough for two of everything ? I think I 'd be looking at running two vacumn pumps, two milk pumps/lines two plate coolers ect ect.
As was said above , the extra acrs can come later , and if possible ditch the recording jars _awkward bloody things...
Main thing will be the alignment and size of the doors to get cows in and out ,quickly and easily, and to be able to draft them easily, the less stress on everyone the easier it gets ..

cjpm · 08-03-2016 12:35PM

What would be a reasonable price for a second hand parlour. 10 unit dairy master with jars. No stallwork or feeders included. Just the bare machine and units??

keep going · 08-03-2016 01:22PM

cjpm wrote: »

What would be a reasonable price for a second hand parlour. 10 unit dairy master with jars. No stallwork or feeders included. Just the bare machine and units??

Vac pump 250 300 pulsation control box 200 diaphragm pump 200 electric with level controller 300, lines worthless, relays 50 to 100, not sure about jars but at a guess 100 a unit all in.wether its worth more depends on what you want to do but as a job lot 1500 to 2000

tilting tim · 10-03-2016 04:29PM

I find this set up great for managing cows in parlour, no movement until you release them, ran off air compressor, rope running length of parlour to open and shut

Panch18 · 10-03-2016 05:20PM

tilting tim wrote: »

I find this set up great for managing cows in parlour, no movement until you release them, ran off air compressor, rope running length of parlour to open and shut

The locking barrier is great for controlling cows and heifers

But not for cow flow, cows have to do too much twisting and turning to get out

Timmaay · 11-03-2016 12:04AM

Panch18 wrote: »

The locking barrier is great for controlling cows and heifers

But not for cow flow, cows have to do too much twisting and turning to get out

Went from horrible big concrete managers in the old parlour to bog standard steel ones in the new parlour (both 2ft6 centres), and it's night and day the difference, cows just don't bother trying to rob meal off a cow ahead or behind them as they know it's too hard to get in at the manager. The only issue are the usual heifer training, but I can only imagine the frustration of trying to push a nervous and anyways flighty heifer into a headlock manager like above!

kowtow · 11-03-2016 08:31AM

Panch18 wrote:

But not for cow flow, cows have to do too much twisting and turning to get out

Panch18 wrote:

The locking barrier is great for controlling cows and heifers

Our problem with a tiny herd is we have lots of different sizes and we often milk on one side of the parlour only. We also frequently have one or two cows in alone.. tying up individuals is a royal PITA if they are not going to slide back down the rail and you have no big girls left to squeeze behind them!

Am toying with a zig zag rail even though we already have angled troughs. I know it's normally one or the other but isn't that a cow flow thing? Cow flow isn't really the problem here so much as random sides/ cows.

tilting tim · 11-03-2016 09:31AM

It will slow cow flow but they will get the knack of it fairly quick and in general doesn't make a huge difference, have heard of lads splitting the parlour in half on more units (2 9 gates rather than 1 run of 18) and open the front ones when 9 have finished.
I find it easy to train heifers, run them through a few weeks before calving, give them meal and no bother, big thing is the control when they calve and you're on your own

Budget Milking Machine Upgrade - Any Opinions?

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