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The International Space Station has a potentialy very serious problem.

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  • 01-08-2010 8:29pm
    #1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,817 ✭✭✭


    Luckily they have spares for the problem but a hasty spacewalk will have to be arranged,this is an unplanned one and no guarantee of sucess.
    These tanks have caused problems since they were recently installed by a Space Shuttle Mission.
    If the Spares have to be used the ISS will come to a premature end if/when they fail.
    More evidence of the folly of NASA still not being given an extra flight before retirement of the Shuttle fleet which they wanted to use to pack more spares on the ISS.

    http://www.cnbc.com/id/38509293

    on further reading on this it is not an overstatement to say this is a major crisis which if not resolved fairly rapidly could force the evacuation of if not all six Astro/Cosmo/nauts,then at least three.
    NASA playing it down a bit but it is that serious!


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Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 9,576 ✭✭✭lord lucan


    NASA holding a press conference on their plan of action tonight.

    http://www.nasa.gov/home/hqnews/2010/aug/HQ_M10-106_EVA_Update.html


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,576 ✭✭✭lord lucan




  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 3,645 Mod ✭✭✭✭Beeker


    Shouls be no problem to fix for them. This is something they planned for but still as ynotdo said any failure of large components will leave the station more vulnerable into the future as replacements will be harder to get with the ending of the Shuttle upmass capability.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,817 ✭✭✭ynotdu


    I did not see the press conference Live but managed to see all but the first six minutes on a NASA TV repeat.
    Journalists being Journalists they pressed for the worst case scenario.
    It is grim and the Spacewalks hazardous.
    Since the Press Conference NASA have changed the day of the first of at least two needed to Friday.
    usually their training and ingenuity Do see NASA through.
    They mentioned this is the first time whats now become the famous 14 must do repairs that could never have waited for a Shuttle Launch and both Spacewalkers trained for this specific task last autumn.
    They did not get round when asked what the other 13 are,but admitted that any of them before a sucessfull repair although highly unlikely would really bring them to the brink.
    In the meantime life is surprisingly normal onboard the ISS,with only small amounts of units powered down and some experiments stopped.

    The Russian section is not affected by this current problem and could if the American section failed take control of the entire ISS but not for long and Crew would have to be reduced and the Station abandoned in the worst case Scenario.
    Good luck to the Spacewalkers,They are going to need it!


    The first Spacewalk begins shortly before midday Irish time [GMT+1~UTC+1] with NASA TV Coverage beginning at eleven AM[still subject to change as they are running tests in the buoyancy chambers on the ground]


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,962 ✭✭✭jumpguy


    I'm wondering, could the current solar activity and the failure of the pump being linking? Could it's electronics have been damaged by the solar flare? It's quite exposed, isn't it?

    Very coincidental this incident has occured the same time as the solar activity.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,817 ✭✭✭ynotdu


    jumpguy wrote: »
    I'm wondering, could the current solar activity and the failure of the pump being linking? Could it's electronics have been damaged by the solar flare? It's quite exposed, isn't it?

    Very coincidental this incident has occured the same time as the solar activity.

    Hi jumpguy always good to see You here:)

    The press conference did not consider it an issue[but a much larger flare could in theory frizzle all electronic devices in space,no satellite TV:eek:,and force any person in Space to be ordered back to Earth.]

    The Pump that needs replacing was expected to function for 100,000 hours give or take.Its electronics had been running 800,000 hours and the actual pump only about 40,000 hours.
    The worrying thing is for whatever reason the back up that is currently keeping the system going was started up at the same time.

    a lot of the language used during the briefing was far above all but an engineers understanding.

    It was obvious though just how hard the ISS main man had been working[He could hardly remember his own name at times,not even the name of the particulor Shuttle due to fly next]

    The troubleshooting team have been working 24/7 since the failure occured.

    Not quite an Apollo 13 but depending on how things go a slow leak version of it is possible.

    The robotic arm will aid the two Spacewalkers and it requires coolant but in the event that the other source of coolant failed they figure they can rapidly return the Spacewalker to safety before the need for coolant kicks in.

    Their main concern is can the task be completed over the two planned Spacewalks or might it need a third,also they know the Spacesuits will get Toxins on them from these EVA's and they will have to go through a decontamination procedure once back in the airlock before they could enter the ISS
    If the American section suffered a 2nd of the 'big 14' and had to shut down the crew of six could survive in the Russian section for six days and attempt further emergency EVA's before three would have to leave.
    The remaining three would be a pointless exercise as no Science could take place.and it would without a miracle have to be abandoned shortly afterwards.



    again all of that is the worst that could happen hopefully the best will happen:)

    MIR remained manned for a long time after it had an onboard fire.
    It also survived a resupply ship missing the docking port and crashing into a module forcing that module to be sealed and left for dead.


  • Registered Users Posts: 7,962 ✭✭✭jumpguy


    ynotdu wrote: »
    The Pump that needs replacing was expected to function for 100,000 hours give or take.Its electronics had been running 800,000 hours and the actual pump only about 40,000 hours.
    You must mean 80,000 hours, 800,000 hours is over 90 years! :P

    Hmm, although it was the only system in the ISS to be knocked out, it could've just had a flaw that made it more susceptible to damage.

    Also, as with transporting large objects (using the shuttle), to bring another spare pump to the station, well, there's TWO spare pumps. Unless there's a serious flaw in all the pumps that make them very likely to fail, it'd be pretty unthinkable that both pumps will fail twice, and they'll run out of spare pumps.

    The biggest risk here is the hastily-planned spacewalks, not the prospect of another failure on the ISS. I'd imagine another pump failure would be the equivalent of both engines on a jet failing from two seperate, isolated incidents (even less likely than winning the lotto).


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,817 ✭✭✭ynotdu


    jumpguy wrote: »
    You must mean 80,000 hours, 800,000 hours is over 90 years! :P
    :o

    They most likely will make it look like a piece of cake,even if they have to make up some of the icing as they go along![the STS-125 Hubble repair EVA's were incredible for their ingenuity, I never miss an opportunity to mention that flight!:)]

    It concentrated My mind though how terrible it would be if We did not have our little friend orbiting us and giving us a shining hello when it pass's:(

    1st EVA has been deferred to Saturday at the same time as in a post above

    http://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/station/main/index.html


  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 3,645 Mod ✭✭✭✭Beeker


    Spacewalk underway.

    index.php?action=dlattach;topic=22448.0;attach=241566;image
    index.php?action=dlattach;topic=22448.0;attach=241558;image


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 12,456 ✭✭✭✭Mr Benevolent


    Any big explosions yet?


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,817 ✭✭✭ynotdu


    Not quite Confab:)
    It's clear now though that this Spacewalk has been a failure in that they have not managed to remove the failed pump.
    one of four Amonia lines stuck and ate into their time,there was Amonia leakage which caused a change of plan.
    They are now in the process of what NASA call 'bake out' i.e making sure all traces of Amonia are gone from their suits before re-entering the ISS.
    according to NASA Astronauts have got Amonia on their suits before.
    NASA TV will proably sum it up in a post Spacewalk press briefing some time today if past experiance is anything to go by.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,817 ✭✭✭ynotdu


    NASA TV have given the time for the news briefing it will be 10PM in Ireland.
    NASA TV link:

    http://www.nasa.gov/multimedia/nasatv/index.html

    There are usually many repeats of them afterwards.


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,576 ✭✭✭lord lucan


    Didn't quite go according to plan. Looks like they may need a third EVA to rectify it.

    http://spaceflightnow.com/station/exp24/100807eva/index4.html


  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 3,645 Mod ✭✭✭✭Beeker


    lord lucan wrote: »
    Didn't quite go according to plan. Looks like they may need a third EVA to rectify it.

    http://spaceflightnow.com/station/exp24/100807eva/index4.html


    I think they should add another Shuttle flight to fix the problem:D


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,576 ✭✭✭lord lucan


    Beeker wrote: »
    I think they should add another Shuttle flight to fix the problem:D

    If the worst case scenario came through and they had to evacuate the ISS then there'd be no reason for the remaining shuttle flights to fly!!:eek:


  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 3,645 Mod ✭✭✭✭Beeker


    lord lucan wrote: »
    If the worst case scenario came through and they had to evacuate the ISS then there'd be no reason for the remaining shuttle flights to fly!!:eek:
    Bad bad Lord Lucan:mad: Thuink positive thoughts:)


  • Registered Users Posts: 9,576 ✭✭✭lord lucan


    Beeker wrote: »
    Bad bad Lord Lucan:mad: Thuink positive thoughts:)

    Or they fix the Ammonia cables but need new ones that could only be brought up by STS-136!;)


  • Registered Users Posts: 30,178 ✭✭✭✭Ghost Train


    ynotdu wrote: »
    Not quite Confab:)
    It's clear now though that this Spacewalk has been a failure in that they have not managed to remove the failed pump.
    one of four Amonia lines stuck and ate into their time,there was Amonia leakage which caused a change of plan.
    They are now in the process of what NASA call 'bake out' i.e making sure all traces of Amonia are gone from their suits before re-entering the ISS.
    according to NASA Astronauts have got Amonia on their suits before.

    here's what happened before in 2001, give a lot of details
    http://www.space.com/missionlaunches/missions/sts98_eva1pm_010210.html


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,817 ✭✭✭ynotdu


    here's what happened before in 2001, give a lot of details
    http://www.space.com/missionlaunches/missions/sts98_eva1pm_010210.html

    Cheers for that Ghost Train,that must have taken some searching to find! TY.

    LL,Beaky.I like the title of the headline in this artilcle.It calls a spade a spade,never mind all that 'NASA SPEAK";)
    Me sticks neck out here and States there will be a third EVA,May'be even a 4th,5th...........:pac:
    also remember there was a planned EVA for last Thursday,part of its purpose was to retrieve a cable that has to be moved to make way for Leanardo on 133,So who knows may'be NOV 1st may become unrealistic:pac:,.The rate things are going the final Space Shuttle flight may take place when the Crew are aged 140!!!

    A little bonus on this article is a short video of the Astronauts hammering the ironicly named 'quick disconnect' mater and the Amonia leaking at the Astronauts and heading towards the camera.
    It also has 50 pics of ISS&Epedition 24 starting with a close up of Amonia all around the quick release [I had to go forward a few pics and then refresh to see it,but that might just be My crazy computer being a bad.bad boy again!:)]

    http://news.sky.com/skynews/Home/World-News/Space-Station-Nasa-Astronauts-Fail-To-Fix-Broken-Cooling-System-On-International-Space-Station/Article/201008215679092?lpos=World_News_First_Technology_Article_Teaser_Region__0&lid=ARTICLE_15679092_Space_Station%3A_Nasa_Astronauts_Fail_To_Fix_Broken_Cooling_System_On_International_Space_Station


  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 3,645 Mod ✭✭✭✭Beeker


    lord lucan wrote: »
    Or they fix the Ammonia cables but need new ones that could only be brought up by STS-136!;)
    Ahhhhh thats better:)


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,817 ✭✭✭ynotdu


    I honestly believed that the second Spacewalk would be delayed beyond it's planned day of Wednesday,but NASA are going ahead with it.
    You can't keep a good Agency down!:)
    They have a main plan and a back-up plan for this EVA described well in the article below.

    NASA TV Coverage Starts just before 12PM in Ireland,EVA begins just before 1PM[GMT+1~UTC+1]

    http://spaceflightnow.com/station/exp24/100810evapre/index.html


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,817 ✭✭✭ynotdu


    Lol at the commentry on NASA TV which has just gone live

    "Welcome folks,You will hear a lot of chat today which should give You a PHD in Fluid dynamics and Plumbing":)

    They are running half an hour behind time still in the airlock making sure they do not get what would be called 'The bends' by deep Sea divers.

    A PHD in six hours!!! an answer to My prayers:)
    MC to Astronaut Tracey Caldwell Dyson: "Tracey You are passing over Your home town"
    Tracey: "OH,Hi Mum and DAD" :)
    So far so good at 2.50 PM.EVA official start time[judged by when the suits go to internal battery power] was at 1.27PM.
    Just as i am typing Tracey is finding it difficult to press a release button.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,817 ✭✭✭ynotdu


    Great News from this Spacewalk.That Pesky Quick release Valve has finally been shifted by Brute force,No Amonia leak,This puts them way ahead of where they expected to be,They still have to disconnect electrical connections and some other tasks before the pump can be finally be removed,but touch wood,This has gone like a dream! Yippee!

    index.php?action=dlattach;topic=22480.0;attach=241906;image

    index.php?action=dlattach;topic=22480.0;attach=241907;image


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,015 ✭✭✭rccaulfield


    Excellent! What a blow it wud be to lose that place!


  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 3,645 Mod ✭✭✭✭Beeker


    From what I have seen so far everything going very well:)


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,817 ✭✭✭ynotdu


    Great shot here of Wheelock at the end of the Robotic arm with the grapple bar that will remove the failed pump Module.
    Tracey can be seen at work at the disconections,Something of interest too is that both are wearing jet packs that in the unlikely event that they became untethered they could bring themselves back to the safety of the ISS.

    index.php?action=dlattach;topic=22480.0;attach=241943;image


  • Registered Users Posts: 30,178 ✭✭✭✭Ghost Train


    sounds good, was watching a bit earlier and all sounded good


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,817 ✭✭✭ynotdu


    The offending pump has now been removed and heading towards its grave on the ISS storage space,Tracey is working on get ahead tasks for the third EVA due Sunday,
    So here is one for the Space historians.
    Traceys Spacewalk last Friday was her rookie Spacewalk.
    There was to have been a routine Spacewalk due for her on Thursday before this crisis.
    So assuming the Sunday one goes ahead that will be three high stress Spacewalks in ten days!

    Has a first time Spacewalker ever had to face being thrown in at the deep end like that before?:)

    index.php?action=dlattach;topic=22480.0;attach=242018;image


  • Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 3,645 Mod ✭✭✭✭Beeker


    ynotdu wrote: »
    The offending pump has now been removed and heading towards its grave on the ISS storage space,Tracey is working on get ahead tasks for the third EVA due Sunday,
    So here is one for the Space historians.
    Traceys Spacewalk last Friday was her rookie Spacewalk.
    There was to have been a routine Spacewalk due for her on Thursday before this crisis.
    So assuming the Sunday one goes ahead that will be three high stress Spacewalks in ten days!

    Has a first time Spacewalker ever had to face being thrown in at the deep end like that before?:)

    index.php?action=dlattach;topic=22480.0;attach=242018;image
    Pierre Thuot and Richard Hieb both performed 3 spacewalks as rookies over 4 days on STS-49. May 10,11 and 13 1992. Not sure if they were high stress but the last sure was as it was also the first and only 3 person spacewalk in history. The flight was the maiden voyage of Endeavour and they were attempting to retrieve and relaunch an Intelsat satellite. Mission was very successful.:)

    There may be others but this one comes to mind. A great flight.

    pfrssts49.jpg

    sts49.gif


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,817 ✭✭✭ynotdu


    The third Spacewalk has been shifted to next Monday and a fourth one is to be added to tie up the lose ends.

    http://spaceflightnow.com/station/exp24/100811eva2/index5.html


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