Roscommon HOH's sentencing

Femelade

How did this even go on for so long..
I think there should have been more done by the social services..surely people, like neighbours/teachers/doctors saw what the hell was going on there. I know they say they got many complaints, but the fact that they went and checked up on them and let this woman get the better of them is awful..

with regards to the law, would i be wrong in saying the law was actually changed in 2004 but the abuse she delt to her kids was from 1996 - 2004 so she was sentenced by the old law?

walshb

Bambi wrote: »

big difference between rape and child sexual abuse. 20 years ago people would have said about priests what you're now saying about women... and a future generation will hold us accountable for what we refused to contemplate, just as we did of the previous generation. Time will tell I guess.

There is a differnece; but there is no difference in the ratios of men to women on both crimes. Women do not commit incest. Men do. Out of every 1 million incest cases; how many involve women. I would imagine a very very small percentage!

javaboy

walshb wrote: »

There is a differnece; but there is no difference in the ratios of men to women on both crimes. Women do not commit incest. Men do. Out of every 1 million incest cases; how many involve women. I would imagine a very very small percentage!

They either do commit incest or they don't. Which is it? And what's your point anyway?

Mingey

Maybe 7 years is appropriate, it would only cost us too much to keep her locked up. It's not like she could do it again to her kids when she comes out.

K-9

walshb wrote: »

There is a differnece; but there is no difference in the ratios of men to women on both crimes. Women do not commit incest. Men do. Out of every 1 million incest cases; how many involve women. I would imagine a very very small percentage!

So what the hell was this case about?

walshb

Seanies32 wrote: »

So what the hell was this case about?

You don't know?

My point is that for every rape or incest case where a woman is the
perpetrator, there are so so many more involving men. It's just a point
I was making; that's all! Just making a distinction. The case is
still horrific; but very very unusual in its rareness!

Dudess

walshb wrote: »

Out of every million women; I would say 1 is a rapist

Out of every million men; all are capable and susceptible
to the act. Not all will commit the act; but the trait is a male trait!

:eek:
Give up the auld Andrea Dworkin books would ya...

K-9

walshb wrote: »

You don't know?

My point is that for every rape or incest case where a woman is the
perpetrator, there are so so many more involving men. It's just a point
I was making; that's all! Just making a distinction. The case is
still horrific; but very very unusual in its rareness!

I'd say the incest is rare, female abuse on children is very common.

EDIT:8 Years for Shannon Matthews Mum.

http://uk.news.yahoo.com/21/20090123/tuk-shannon-s-mother-jailed-for-8-years-6323e80.html

Biggins

big b wrote: »

Sorry for going off-topic, but I'd have thought you'd be happy with an in-frack-tion

Only if the wife is in a giving mood and with legal consent!

walshb

Dudess wrote: »

:eek:
Give up the auld Andrea Dworkin books would ya...

So, you think my estimate is off?
Actually, it's probably less. Out of every Billion women, one is probably a rapist!

Same with female paedophiles. Very very very rare I would imagine

What's your point?

Dyr

conviction rates are not a reliable indicator for this.

If, for example, no priests were convicted of child abuse in the 60's or 70's then by your logic that means it didnt happen

capiche?

walshb

Seanies32 wrote: »

I'd say the incest is rare, female abuse on children is very common.

EDIT:8 Years for Shannon Matthews Mum.

http://uk.news.yahoo.com/21/20090123/tuk-shannon-s-mother-jailed-for-8-years-6323e80.html

Seansie, I would agree; abuse is common, but sexual abuse is close to nil.

Women just do not possess that trait the way men do. It's so so rare!

Moojuice

walshb wrote: »

Reported and distorted that is. Statistically they were!

Out of every million women; I would say 1 is a rapist

Out of every million men; all are capable and susceptible
to the act. Not all will commit the act; but the trait is a male trait!

Obviously you have the figures to back that up rather than just your obviously biased opinion. How long did it take you to pull those numbers out of the air? I am not denying that the majority of rape cases are carried out by men but it is wrong to say all men are potential rapists. Many cases of abuse by women go unreported due to the massive stigma attached to the idea of men being abused by women. It is hard enough for a rape victim to come forward with the treatment and distain that the legal system and society treats them with.

Your view is a extremist feminist view that, to be quiet honest is doing a diservice to the feminist movement. By your logic we are ALL potential murderers, war mongers, thieves etc.

The HOH case highlights the massive disrepency in the law regarding men and women, and is a direct result of the backward notion that women are quiet, gentle innocent, flowers, weak and subserviant to the strong dominant men, who must be proteted by the latter. Bull****, both sexes are capable of repugnant acts.

walshb

Bambi wrote: »

conviction rates are not a reliable indicator for this.

If, for example, no priests were convicted of child abuse in the 60's or 70's then by your logic that means it didnt happen

capiche?

My logic means nothing. The facts are that men are more likely to commit sex crimes. WE don't need stats to prove or know this. It's a physical and natural trait, terrible as it seemm

walshb

Moojuice wrote: »

Obviously you have the figures to back that up rather than just your obviously biased opinion. How long did it take you to pull those numbers out of the air? I am not denying that the majority of rape cases are carried out by men but it is wrong to say all men are potential rapists. Many cases of abuse by women go unreported due to the massive stigma attached to the idea of men being abused by women. It is hard enough for a rape victim to come forward with the treatment and distain that the legal system and society treats them with.

Your view is a extremist feminist view that, to be quiet honest is doing a diservice to the feminist movement. By your logic we are ALL potential murderers, war mongers, thieves etc.

The HOH case highlights the massive disrepency in the law regarding men and women, and is a direct result of the backward notion that women are quiet, gentle innocent, flowers, weak and subserviant to the strong dominant men, who must be proteted by the latter. Bull****, both sexes are capable of repugnant acts.

Human beings are all potentially capable of anything. That's what makes humans so complex, cruel, brilliant, beautiful etc etc.

I am not saying all WILL commit; I am just saying we are all capable. Relax!

Yes, women are too capable of sex crimes; but it's highly more likely that men will commit these crimes. This has ZERO to do with logic; it's in nature!

K-9

walshb wrote: »

Seansie, I would agree; abuse is common, but sexual abuse is close to nil.

Women just do not possess that trait the way men do. It's so so rare!

Not many stats on it, but it only has become an issue in the last decade.

http://www.child-abuse-effects.com/female-sex-offenders.html

walshb

Seanies32 wrote: »

Not many stats on it, but it only has become an issue in the last decade.

http://www.child-abuse-effects.com/female-sex-offenders.html

Well; it's is on the increase; still will always be dwarfed by men!

Moojuice

walshb wrote: »

Seansie, I would agree; abuse is common, but sexual abuse is close to nil.

Women just do not possess that trait the way men do. It's so so rare!

In fact there has been a rise in the amount of abuse cases by women being reported. As another poster said, conviction rates ARE NOT a reliable indicator. The reason this case is shocking to so many is that it was a women at the centre of it because of the ridiculous notions that women are the 'fairer" sex. As a man I find your statements insulting, rape is a horrific act, one of the most vile things that can be done to another person and the notion that because I am a man I am also a potential rapist is sickening.

It could be argued that it is not the sex of someone that makes them more susceptible to violent crime or crime of any sort but their upbrigning, enviornment and nurture more than likely take precedence. As seen in this case, society sat back and did very little, letting the abuse continue, due to the stupid and backward notion about gender and gender traits.

Dyr

walshb wrote: »

My logic means nothing.

I hear ya

oztots

Are you calling me a potential rapist because i am a man?

Have you never seen girls take advantage of guys? Its been said before women are not as bad as men, and there would be far less cases of women raping men reported.
Just the same as through advertising, marital abuse is something that only men do to women. While in truth there are men who are terrified of the women they live with and are afraid to approach the gards out of shame.

And i think you're trolling, wildly exagerated facts posted over and over.

javaboy

walshb wrote: »

So, you think my estimate is off?
Actually, it's probably less. Out of every Billion women, one is probably a rapist!

We have a humour forum you know. There are ~3 female rapists in the world? :P

Dudess

walshb wrote: »

So, you think my estimate is off?
Actually, it's probably less. Out of every Billion women, one is probably a rapist!

Same with female paedophiles. Very very very rare I would imagine

What's your point?

Oh nothing... just absolutely astounded by your statement

Out of every million men; all are capable and susceptible
to the act. Not all will commit the act; but the trait is a male trait!

The "all men are potential rapists because they have a penis" line which we'd use to take the piss out of our more man-hating lecturers in college. I have hands, that makes me capable of beating a child. Does that mean I'm a potential child-beater? No, because I'd have to have the psychological issues that accompany such crimes. Apply the same to rape.
Also, "Out of every million women; I would say 1 is a rapist", "Out of every 1 million incest cases; how many involve women. I would imagine a very very small percentage!", "Actually, it's probably less. Out of every Billion women, one is probably a rapist! Same with female paedophiles. Very very very rare I would imagine" - these are not proper statistics.

And please stop saying "women do NOT sexually abuse/commit incest" etc because they do. The fact it's rare doesn't mean it's not happening. And we only know about the ones that have been reported - plenty haven't because of the victims fearing ridicule and disbelief, due to the notion that "women do NOT sexually abuse!"

Also, rape is forcing someone to have sex against their will - whether the perpetrator has a penis or not.

K-9

walshb wrote: »

Well; it's is on the increase; still will always be dwarfed by men!

Well clearly you aren't going to accept that it is way under reported, same as male rapists or male abusers.

You seem to think abuse by females is in some way different to other abuse for some strange reason.

walshb

Oh my god, some are easily offended. I am a man and I have never committed and hope that I never will; but to say you are 100
percent incacpbale of committing is wrong. Any man in any
situation is capable.

Look, doesn't simply involve putting on a ski
mask, arming yourself and pouncing on a woman in the middle of the night.
Have you ever heard of a woman saying the word NO; and a guy maybe still
proceeding and next thing a charge is held over him. No means no and in the eyes of the law, a man can be done for .

We are all capable and it depends on our level of restraint. A woman says NO to a man; I would hope the man backs off; but under certain situations, especially when drink is involved, things can get messy and that's when the
fooling around can technically become .

Relax fellas, all I am saying is that is a very gray area and any
man can be faced with a situation where it is a very very fine line
between a crime and NOT a crime.

Just see that it is not so clear cut; even the most decent and entle
of men can find themselves in awkward positions that could lead to a claim
and conviction for

Note, the cOmputeR I am on will not alow me to type the R A P E word; so if
it seems confusing or a word is missing, the word is R A P E

walshb

Seanies32 wrote: »

Well clearly you aren't going to accept that it is way under reported, same as male rapists or male abusers.

You seem to think abuse by females is in some way different to other abuse for some strange reason.

What. All I said was that female s e x u a l abuse is rarer and I would imagine, much rarer than male s e x u a l abuse. That's all. Nothing more. Both are heinous; but men are more likely to commit s e x u a l offences.

Moojuice

walshb wrote: »

Relax fellas, all I am saying is that is a very gray area and any
man can be faced with a situation where it is a very very fine line
between a crime and NOT a crime.

Wow. No its not a fine line, its quiet a clear line actually. No means no. If someone says no, you dont go ahead anyway. If in doubt dont do anything.
You may have been faced with such grey areas but I have not.

walshb

Dudess wrote: »

Oh nothing... just absolutely astounded by your statement

The "all men are potential rapists because they have a " line which we'd use to take the out of our more man-hating lecturers in college. I have hands, that makes me capable of beating a child. Does that mean I'm a potential child-beater? No, because I'd have to have the psychological issues that accompany such crimes. Apply the same to .
Also, "Out of every million women; I would say 1 is a rapist", "Out of every 1 million incest cases; how many involve women. I would imagine a very very small percentage!", "Actually, it's probably less. Out of every Billion women, one is probably a rapist! Same with female es. Very very very rare I would imagine" - these are not proper statistics.

And please stop saying "women do NOT ually abuse/commit incest" etc because they do. The fact it's rare doesn't mean it's not happening. And we only know about the ones that have been reported - plenty haven't because of the victims fearing ridicule and disbelief, due to the notion that "women do NOT ually abuse!"

Also, is forcing someone to against their will - whether the perpetrator has a or not.

Again, I didn't say it never happens, just rare. Oh my god, do you read.
Rare when comparing it to men who commit crimes.

Me say the word do not in BOLD was meant to highlight. I know well there
are cases.

walshb

Moojuice wrote: »

Wow. No its not a fine line, its quiet a clear line actually. No means no. If someone says no, you dont go ahead anyway. If in doubt dont do anything.
You may have been faced with such grey areas but I have not.

I know that and you know that; all I am saying is that men can find
themselves in awkward positions and when drink is involved, the nicest and most gentle men can find their character TESTED. NO means No, agreed.

BTW, it is a fine line it;' one word that technically separates this from a crime.

dodgyme

I think the discussion of attitudes on whether a man is as equally likely or unequally likely to commit certain act reveals the fact that their is a double standard when a woman commits the same indecent act that allows her to go relatively unpunished in comparision to a man. This to me pure hypocrisy, and it stems from the ignorance of comments likely Mary O'Rourke. Its 'sad' if a woman is involved and its 'throw the book at them' if its a man. In this, like alot of cases, the 'book' in question is the statute book, no laws for women because its 'sad' when its a woman!!!

walshb

Dudess wrote: »

Also, is forcing someone to against their will - whether the perpetrator has a or not.

Yes it is, and how many women compared to men have been convicted of this crime. I would say the difference is staggering. Please, don't include
statutory R A P E