Guantanamo bay

tallaght01

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

Of course the stickies and the crustys and the Irishman abroad all have the correct angle on things.

.

LOL am I not allowed have an opinion on world affairs that affect Ireland because I've left my housing estate more than 6 times in my life? :P

It just continues to get better :pac: :pac:

walshb

tallaght01 wrote: »

LOL am I not allowed have an opinion on world affairs that affect Ireland because I've left my housing estate more than 6 times in my life? :P

It just continues to get better :pac: :pac:

You are entitled to that opinion; but why question those who question asylum seekers and
Guantanamo detainees? Not all these asylum cases are genuine, and even if they were; that doesn't entitle all to be accepted. We have to have some restrictions and cannot allow all to come!

You do not see the already sad state this country is in. Ok, we aren't quite as bad as other countries; but to use that is inaccurate. We cannot at the current climate afford anymore
asylum cases. In more ways than just finances. What about crime, health and over crowding? Financially a problem; and physically a problem!

You seem to think we owe a debt to these folks. Hey, we didn't bloody imprison them; and even if we did; still they don't then simply get to live here. We all have to pay our way in society; but do you believe these people will contribute a single cent to their
stay in Ireland? How many of the asylum cases are really paying their way in Ireland? Most are here on a meal ticket to avail of all they can get, and best of luck to the lot of them! We seem to think it's okay!:cool:


My arse, all expenses paid for as long as they stay here. And, no questions will be asked! And should someone raise the issue, they are met with the 'race' card!:rolleyes:

javaboy

walshb wrote: »

And should someone raise the issue, they are met with the 'race' card!:rolleyes:

You and several others have raised the issue on this thread. If someone has actually called you a racist, please report the post.

Otherwise stop playing the "race card" card.

walshb

javaboy wrote: »

You and several others have raised the issue on this thread. If someone has actually called you a racist, please report the post.

Otherwise stop playing the "race card" card.

What?

I am simply speaking in general terms; nothing to do with boards.ie specifically!

Chill!

javaboy

walshb wrote: »

What?

I am simply speaking in general terms; nothing to do with boards.ie specifically!

Chill!

Ok but you said should anyone raise the issue, they are met with the race. I'm just highlighting the fact that several people have raised the issue here and nobody that I can see has called them racist.

So obviously your original statement is untrue.

walshb

javaboy wrote: »

Ok but you said should anyone raise the issue, they are met with the race. I'm just highlighting the fact that several people have raised the issue here and nobody that I can see has called them racist.

So obviously your original statement is untrue.

No, nobody on boards.ie has called me a racist; again, I meant generally and in the wider world!

FlutterinBantam

That should have been obvious surely.

walshb

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

That should have been obvious surely.

Mate, I thought that too!

K-9

walshb wrote: »

No, nobody on boards.ie has called me a racist; again, I meant generally and in the wider world!

Yet the Liberal, PC'er, student, non tax payer, Irishmen abroad etc. line has been thrown out.

That's the way these threads go!

walshb

Seanies32 wrote: »

Yet the Liberal, PC'er, student, non tax payer etc. line has been thrown out.

That's the way these threads go!

I'm all for thread diversion, within reason obviously!

FlutterinBantam

walshb wrote: »

Mate, I thought that too!

ref. is a bit whistle happy:D

Did you listen Dr Tom Clonans reports on Guantanimo?

Obviously a lot of these posters didn't..

walshb

Didn't, maybe you can post a link for me. Thanks

Anyway, it's common sense to a degree. It shouldn't have
to be spelt out so succinctly.

javaboy

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

ref. is a bit whistle happy:D

I wasn't being whistle happy. I was pointing out that he was wrong, (at least on Boards). I would have made the same point with or without my mod whistle.

I think you're missing my point slightly. I do hate when people play the race card because it does stifle debate. It is annoying but it's not nearly as prevalent (either here or on "the outside") as some people here would like to make out especially now with the economic situation in serious decline. People are far less likely to call you racist for criticising immigrants/asylum seekers when jobs are drying up.

In my experience, you're far more likely to get called a pinko liberal tax dodging PC student type than get called a racist these days.

Nodin

FlutterinBantam wrote: »

I have read extensively on it and read about young UK citizens going out there.

For what? Sun holidays??

I'm referring to those held in Guantanamo. That is what we're supposed to be discussing.

1. Fifty-five percent (55%) of the detainees are not determined to have committed any
hostile acts against the United States or its coalition allies.
2. Only 8% of the detainees were characterized as al Qaeda fighters. Of the remaining
detainees, 40% have no definitive connection with al Qaeda at all and 18% are have no definitive
affiliation with either al Qaeda or the Taliban.
3. The Government has detained numerous persons based on mere affiliations with a
large number of groups that in fact, are not on the Department of Homeland Security terrorist
watchlist. Moreover, the nexus between such a detainee and such organizations varies considerably.
Eight percent are detained because they are deemed “fighters for;” 30% considered “members of;” a
large majority – 60% -- are detained merely because they are “associated with” a group or groups the
Government asserts are terrorist organizations. For 2% of the prisoners their nexus to any terrorist
group is unidentified.
4. Only 5% of the detainees were captured by United States forces. 86% of the
detainees were arrested by either Pakistan or the Northern Alliance and turned over to United States
custody.
This 86% of the detainees captured by Pakistan or the Northern Alliance were handed over to the
United States at a time in which the United States offered large bounties for capture of suspected
enemies.
5. Finally, the population of persons deemed not to be enemy combatants – mostly
Uighers – are in fact accused of more serious allegations than a great many persons still deemed to
be enemy combatants.

http://law.shu.edu/aaafinal.pdf

walshb

javaboy wrote: »

I wasn't being whistle happy. I was pointing out that he was wrong, (at least on Boards). I would have made the same point with or without my mod whistle.

java, it is you who are missing the point. I never ever said that anyone on boards.ie had called me a racist. So, how could I be wrong (at least on Boards?)

You brought up the issue with the race card&Boards. Not me!

javaboy

walshb wrote: »

java, it is you who are missing the point. I never ever said that anyone on boards.ie had called me a racist. So, how could I be wrong (at least on Boards?)

You brought up the issue with the race card&Boards. Not me!

If you specifically meant to exclude boards.ie when you said

And should someone raise the issue, they are met with the 'race' card!:rolleyes:

then why didn't you say so? Otherwise it reads like you're making the general point that you cannot raise the issue at all without being called a racist, when clearly this thread proves otherwise.

Obviously I now know you didn't mean to include boards so fine. I'll leave it at that.

twinytwo

Blue_Lagoon wrote: »

The American Civil Liberties Union filed court actions against the former Bush administration for torturing Gitmo prisoners. But the Bush administration claimed that such practices as waterboarding or being held in open cages like animals was not torture. It appears with Obama's recent executive order closing Gitmo and the secret CIA rendition camps around the world that he considered it torture, and literally said to the news media when signing the orders that he would not tolerate torture.

Geeeeee, former US Vice President Dick Cheney claimed that waterboarding was not torture, but I wonder if he would have survived it given his heart condition? I guess it depends if your are the torturer or the one being tortured?

Im not saying some wernt tortured... he said they all were.. hence i asked can he prove everyone was tortured

walshb

javaboy wrote: »

If you specifically meant to exclude boards.ie when you said

then why didn't you say so? Otherwise it reads like you're making the general point that you cannot raise the issue at all without being called a racist, when clearly this thread proves otherwise.

Obviously I now know you didn't mean to include boards so fine. I'll leave it at that.

Okay, we'll leave it at that then!

twinytwo

Nodin wrote: »

Asylum seekers don't get it, they aren't entitled. Do try to keep up.



Which presumes they do produce 2 or 3 grand and buy a car.



They aren't on that list, and theres no proof whatsover that should they be granted asylum that they go to the top of it.




Yes, I hear that a lot...anecdotal evidence, based on bigotry and ignorance.



Neither are people born here, which, considering the amount of mindless rabid froth flying around in a few threads here, is definitly something that should be looked at.



More nonsense.

im sorry but what hole do you have ur head buried in.... england has a very serious problems with fundementalism.... clearly you dont go out too often.
Is rabies or aids rampant here??.. not the last time i checked so instead of replying with tosh why not reply with a proper answer

Nodin

twinytwo wrote: »

im sorry but what hole do you have ur head buried in.... england has a very serious problems with fundementalism....

Your original statement

You take a look at England where the islamic fundementilists(spelling) is growing because of the amount of asylum seekers there.. it was not the original people that came but their kids or grand children.

is fundamentally flawed, confused and wrong. It's almost a sort of Joycean piece, assumptions and bigotry flowing as one.

You've also been wrong about the 'free cars' "benefits" and most other issues you've touched on. Nor have you had the spine to retract your claims. In fairness, and to give credit though, you are comedy gold.

walshb

Nodin wrote: »

Your original statement



is fundamentally flawed, confused and wrong. It's almost a sort of Joycean piece, assumptions and bigotry flowing as one.

You've also been wrong about the 'free cars' "benefits" and most other issues you've touched on. Nor have you had the spine to retract your claims. In fairness, and to give credit though, you are comedy gold.

Hey, Nodin, are you saying asylum seekers are not receiving benefits?

Nodin

walshb wrote: »

Hey, Nodin, are you saying asylum seekers are not receiving benefits?

I'd suggest you read through what I was responding to. However they don't receive full wellfare benefits. They get 20 Euro a week, and 10 child allowance.

twinytwo

Nodin wrote: »

Your original statement



is fundamentally flawed, confused and wrong. It's almost a sort of Joycean piece, assumptions and bigotry flowing as one.

You've also been wrong about the 'free cars' "benefits" and most other issues you've touched on. Nor have you had the spine to retract your claims. In fairness, and to give credit though, you are comedy gold.

do tell me so where do they get the cars and what do they live on etc etc sure ya they live on 30 quid a week... you cannot even give me a straight answer... i will pray for you

http://ie.youtube.com/watch?v=O4xnmRg60Z0

why would i retract something that is true... when people living in ur coutry set your flag on fire... then i think you have a problem

walshb

Nodin wrote: »

I'd suggest you read through what I was responding to. However they don't receive full wellfare benefits. They get 20 Euro a week, and 10 child allowance.

And who pays for their accommodation and food and clothes?
And when they get sick? Who pays the doctor?

You are takin' the proverbial piss

K-9

twinytwo wrote: »

do tell me so where do they get the cars and what do they live on etc etc sure ya they live on 30 quid a week... you cannot even give me a straight answer... i will pray for you

http://ie.youtube.com/watch?v=O4xnmRg60Z0

why would i retract something that is true... when people living in ur coutry set your flag on fire... then i think you have a problem

http://www.irishrefugeecouncil.ie/advice/rights.html

Your earlier post about refugees entering the country is wrong btw.

dr.bollocko

twinytwo wrote: »

im sorry but what hole do you have ur head buried in.... england has a very serious problems with fundementalism.... clearly you dont go out too often.
Is rabies or aids rampant here??.. not the last time i checked so instead of replying with tosh why not reply with a proper answer

I would caution all late comers to this thread yet once more to endeavour to attack the post and not the poster.
This is a hot topic and not one I want to see closed or resulting in bans so please make an argument without thinly veiled abuse or trolling language or face a holiday from AH.

K-9

walshb wrote: »

And who pays for their accommodation and food and clothes?
And when they get sick? Who pays the doctor?

You are takin' the proverbial piss

Once recognised as a refugee they can work.

Until then, they can't so they can't pay for a doctor as they are not allowed to work.

walshb

twinytwo wrote: »

do tell me so where do they get the cars and what do they live on etc etc sure ya they live on 30 quid a week... you cannot even give me a straight answer... i will pray for you

http://ie.youtube.com/watch?v=O4xnmRg60Z0

why would i retract something that is true... when people living in ur coutry set your flag on fire... then i think you have a problem

And a lot on that video have no criminal history and we are expected to import that here?

The Guantanamo bay detainees may also have no criminal history; but spending all that time locked up may well turn every one of them into a criminal. They get out and figure, feck this; we've spent all that time locked up for NOTHING., well now lets at least do something to rid us of this hatred and anger towards the WEST!

walshb

Seanies32 wrote: »

Once recognised as a refugee they can work.

Until then, they can't so they can't pay for a doctor as they are not allowed to work.

What's your point? I know that. All I was asking, was who paid all their expenses whilst they were asylum seekers? We did!

Everything paid for in full and no waiting either, no queuing, no hospital trollies, no having to go abroad for medical procedures etc etc. All laid on in full!

So, nobody can say that these asylum seekers do NOT receive benefits!

The other thing is that Ireland has such a rigorous and complex refugee asylum
process; which suits the refugees down to the ground. They can sit back, do nothing, with
everything paid in full and relax. The longer and more complex the process, the longer they will
receive state aid! It's a freaking holiday for them!

wes

walshb wrote: »

And a lot on that video have no criminal history and we are expected to import that here?

The Guantanamo bay detainees may also have no criminal history; but spending all that time locked up may well turn every one of them into a criminal. They get out and figure, feck this; we've spent all that time locked up for NOTHING., well now lets at least do something to rid us of this hatred and anger towards the WEST!

What people may or may not do in future has no bearing on the here and now.