The Leaving Cert Is A Form Of Slavery

Chaotic_Forces

rebel10 wrote: »

My students have never been reduced to tears. If they were under that much pressure, believe me i'd know. If you feel like that, maybe sort it out with your own teachers, but please stop generalising and name calling. You have never met me, you have never had me as a teacher, you have mis-quoted me throughout these last few pages in an attempt to prove some point. I have yet to get an answer from you regarding my questions about your mis-quotes. I have been polite to you, could you not do me the same? Whatever issues you have with teachers take to your teachers. My students have never had issues with me because they know I care about them and their future too much. If one of my higher level students gets an A1 in the summer, I will be delighted for him, likewise if one of my weaker students gets a C1, I will be delighted for him because they will have achieved what they wanted to achieve and what they have worked so hard for for the last 6 years of their lives.

I finished school several years ago. I also noticed that the transition from the JC to the LC is where the aspect of "STUDY HARDER" comes from. You might give a damn but you're still blind! Unless you constantly make sure no student is overloaded by all the teachers combined, you still have a lot to learn. You're probably a well liked teacher but you're coming across with a superiority complex still.

Nevertheless, you proved what I thought about you. So I won't bother with this talk again.

Chaotic_Forces

Sitec wrote: »

Sounds to me like you got a bad leaving cert by not putting the work in and decided to hold a grudge on the system.

Sounds to me like you have no idea what you're on about. It's been proven time and time again the current system is a failure. Besides, if I didn't put in the effort why would I hold a grudge against the wrong thing?

rebel10

Chaotic_Forces wrote: »

I finished school several years ago. I also noticed that the transition from the JC to the LC is where the aspect of "STUDY HARDER" comes from. You might give a damn but you're still blind! Unless you constantly make sure no student is overloaded by all the teachers combined, you still have a lot to learn. You're probably a well liked teacher but you're coming across with a superiority complex still.

Nevertheless, you proved what I thought about you. So I won't bother with this talk again.

Once again, can you please point out in my posts where i have given you this impression? How can you say in one sentence that I am probably a well liked teacher and then in the next claim I have a superiority complex? I am just asking for the reasons why you have called me names throughout, and yet have failed to provide me with the reasons except for general accusations.

FGR

I don't see what's so bad about the Leaving Cert. I mean the option was always there to repeat if you didn't get the points you wanted. It's not exactly something you'd hang up on a wall though like you'd see with High School Diplomas in the US and the like.

Shame, too..as the long form LC doesn't look too bad..!

deathrider

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LUASiDg-kg4

Oh, come on! You were all thinking it...

marxcoo

I get the impression the thread has gone from arguing that the LC is a redundant system to just an forum for whinging about all the "hard work" you have to do in the LC and how its "not fair"... welcome to the world, in order to get what you want you're going to have to work hard and shock horror sometimes do things you don't love doing. LC is a walk in the park compared to college and work

partyatmygaff

marxcoo wrote: »

I get the impression the thread has gone from arguing that the LC is a redundant system to just an forum for whinging about all the "hard work" you have to do in the LC and how its "not fair"... welcome to the world, in order to get what you want you're going to have to work hard and shock horror sometimes do things you don't love doing. LC is a walk in the park compared to college and work

With hindsight everything seems easy. It's not how easy it seems now but how easy it seemed at the time.

marxcoo

partyatmygaff wrote: »

With hindsight everything seems easy. It's not how easy it seems now but how easy it seemed at the time.

oh I agree but no, I genuinely feel that the LC isn't that hard. It needs to be challenging obviously otherwise it defeats the purpose

partyatmygaff

partyatmygaff wrote: »

With hindsight everything seems easy. It's not how easy it seems now but how easy it seemed at the time.

easy enough so

Fluorescence

partyatmygaff wrote: »

With hindsight everything seems easy. It's not how easy it seems now but how easy it seemed at the time.

It was a cake-walk compared to my college course. 18 months to learn the coursework is so much time compared to the 12 weeks you get per college module (which has arguably as much to cover as much, if not sometimes more than the Leaving Cert).

It's very easy in comparison

PictureFrame

I don't think it's a form of torture at all. I'm in 5th year, leave school at 7am, finish school at 3.45, start evening studying between 4.00-6.00, come home and do my own study from 8-9.30..

That's an average of 7 hours in school + 3.5 hours study
= 10.5 a day x5=
52.5 hours a week and an additional 4/5 hours per weekend = 57.5 hours..

It is tough, but it has to be done unfortunately.. :P

Chaotic_Forces

PictureFrame wrote: »

I don't think it's a form of torture at all. I'm in 5th year, leave school at 7am, finish school at 3.45, start evening studying between 4.00-6.00, come home and do my own study from 8-9.30..

That's an average of 7 hours in school + 3.5 hours study
= 10.5 a day x5=
52.5 hours a week and an additional 4/5 hours per weekend = 57.5 hours..

It is tough, but it has to be done unfortunately.. :P

The amount of hours working full time is 39 hours per week.

Aoifey!

PictureFrame wrote: »

I don't think it's a form of torture at all. I'm in 5th year, leave school at 7am, finish school at 3.45, start evening studying between 4.00-6.00, come home and do my own study from 8-9.30..

That's an average of 7 hours in school + 3.5 hours study
= 10.5 a day x5=
52.5 hours a week and an additional 4/5 hours per weekend = 57.5 hours..

It is tough, but it has to be done unfortunately.. :P

Seems a bit much for 5th year? I did maybe an hours homework a night in 5th year, if even that.

Chuchoter

PictureFrame wrote: »

I don't think it's a form of torture at all. I'm in 5th year, leave school at 7am, finish school at 3.45, start evening studying between 4.00-6.00, come home and do my own study from 8-9.30..

That's an average of 7 hours in school + 3.5 hours study
= 10.5 a day x5=
52.5 hours a week and an additional 4/5 hours per weekend = 57.5 hours..

It is tough, but it has to be done unfortunately.. :P

3.5 hours in 5th year is excessive...

Chaotic_Forces

Actually, depending on the subjects and amount of work given, 3.5 hours is short.

Aoifey!

Chaotic_Forces wrote: »

Actually, depending on the subjects and amount of work given, 3.5 hours is short.

If we were talking about 6th year, I might agree. But in 5th year I'd say 2 hours a night would be plenty. Some nights you might get a lot of work and it would take longer, but certainly not every night.

Chaotic_Forces

Aoifey! wrote: »

If we were talking about 6th year, I might agree. But in 5th year I'd say 2 hours a night would be plenty. Some nights you might get a lot of work and it would take longer, but certainly not every night.

In fairness, English and Irish do take up a while. Mainly since there's a huge gap in the quality of writing that's expected. Plus all the reading and then having to memorize it. Two hours should be plenty but it can differ from school to school and even class to class. What might be expected for maths in one class, can vary around the country.

partyatmygaff

Chaotic_Forces wrote: »

Actually, depending on the subjects and amount of work given, 3.5 hours is short.

3.5 hours IS excessive for fifth year.

I got 500ish points in my fifth year Summer exams by studying (Lightly) two weeks before the exams. All I did throughout the year was my homework and not much else. So long as you pay attention in class and do the work you're expected to do properly there is no need to spend 3.5 hours studying in fifth year.

Aoifey!

Chaotic_Forces wrote: »

In fairness, English and Irish do take up a while. Mainly since there's a huge gap in the quality of writing that's expected. Plus all the reading and then having to memorize it. Two hours should be plenty but it can differ from school to school and even class to class. What might be expected for maths in one class, can vary around the country.

Yeah, it does differ greatly from school to school, and class to class. I did Accounting for the Leaving and each nught we'd have an hours worth of work in it (if you did it right).

Still though, generally speaking I'd say 2 hours would be an average for 5th year. And in 5th year it's just homework you'd be doing rather than study. But then again, i did Ordinary Irish, Maths and German so maybe those would be different at Higher level.

Chaotic_Forces

Aoifey! wrote: »

Yeah, it does differ greatly from school to school, and class to class. I did Accounting for the Leaving and each nught we'd have an hours worth of work in it (if you did it right).

Still though, generally speaking I'd say 2 hours would be an average for 5th year. And in 5th year it's just homework you'd be doing rather than study. But then again, i did Ordinary Irish, Maths and German so maybe those would be different at Higher level.

Higher Irish is annoyingly difficult since it's taught the same way as English which means "lots of short stories, poems and a book to learn about!". :pac:

Accounting would take a while, though. I remember doing the accounting part of business studies for the juniour cert and it was so damn long.

I suppose if you're just taking homework into account... then yeah two hours would be fine but you have to also consider that some students are stuck with bad teachers and either have to take up grinds or hope to learn themselves at home.

partyatmygaff wrote: »

3.5 hours IS excessive for fifth year.

I got 500ish points in my fifth year Summer exams by studying (Lightly) two weeks before the exams. All I did throughout the year was my homework and not much else. So long as you pay attention in class and do the work you're expected to do properly there is no need to spend 3.5 hours studying in fifth year.

Summer exams? As in the ones made out by the teachers? Yes, there's a reason you did good in those, you had them based on what you were taught and not the entire subject (unless you were taught all six subjects fully in 5th year but... I doubt it's possible).

Aoifey!

Chaotic_Forces wrote: »

Higher Irish is annoyingly difficult since it's taught the same way as English which means "lots of short stories, poems and a book to learn about!". :pac:

Accounting would take a while, though. I remember doing the accounting part of business studies for the juniour cert and it was so damn long.

I suppose if you're just taking homework into account... then yeah two hours would be fine but you have to also consider that some students are stuck with bad teachers and either have to take up grinds or hope to learn themselves at home.

I can see how Higher Irish would take a long time, it looks impossible to me but then again I was never good at Irish, or any languages for that matter (except English).

I don't think many students get grinds until 6th year though. i know some do, mainly in the likes of Maths, but as a rule it's 6th year when they do. If you're going for 500 + points you may have to study throughout 5th year, but for less than that I'd say just doing homework would be okay. I did fuck all anyway and didn't do too bad.

Chaotic_Forces

Aoifey! wrote: »

I can see how Higher Irish would take a long time, it looks impossible to me but then again I was never good at Irish, or any languages for that matter (except English).

I don't think many students get grinds until 6th year though. i know some do, mainly in the likes of Maths, but as a rule it's 6th year when they do. If you're going for 500 + points you may have to study throughout 5th year, but for less than that I'd say just doing homework would be okay. I did fuck all anyway and didn't do too bad.

Look at it this way: you're good at English, so you more than likely did higher level English. You could (in this example), easily get an A1 but you don't want to put in that much effort, compare to the kid who pushes themselves to get that A1 but is clearly struggling.

While it's a cakewalk for you compared to the poorer student, the teacher will more than likely try to push you to do the best of your ability, even though you're just too lazy to bother which is wasting time for the poorer students in the class, which means they lose out and have to spend more time at home making up for it. That's the studying can take so long because it's not by choice but essentially a necessity if you want to do well.

Aoifey!

Chaotic_Forces wrote: »

Look at it this way: you're good at English, so you more than likely did higher level English. You could (in this example), easily get an A1 but you don't want to put in that much effort, compare to the kid who pushes themselves to get that A1 but is clearly struggling.

While it's a cakewalk for you compared to the poorer student, the teacher will more than likely try to push you to do the best of your ability, even though you're just too lazy to bother which is wasting time for the poorer students in the class, which means they lose out and have to spend more time at home making up for it. That's the studying can take so long because it's not by choice but essentially a necessity if you want to do well.

Well I was by no means one of the smartest in my class. I'd probably be around the middle in most of my classes.

However, in my experience, most the teachers used to concentrate more on the poorer students. In things like Maths they could spend an extra 10 minutes each class going through some of the questions very slowly for the few who did not understand. I know it might not be like this in every class or every school, but there are a lot of teachers who concentrate on helping the poorer students as long as they are genuinely struggling and not just messing while they explain it the first time.

Then again, there are those who would just leave a poor student fall behind and never bother trying to helo them, but in my experience these are in the minority.

Jesus Juice

The title sounds like a Composition title from the Leaving Cert English Papers...

catman103

I don't think the leaving cert is the best solution, but doing it this year it seems as if it has gotten a lot better than years past. How annoying the lc is, it's not going to be changing drastically any time soon, simply improving slightly... If anything it is a test of discipline within the students.