'Dublin life is unsustainable' - meet the professionals who left for the Mid-West....

goochy

as I have said before - the physical environment of limerick city and its suburbs is very poor. Dublin has bad areas / eyesores but you can live in Dublin and not go near them.
You come into Limerick from all the main approach roads and you get a bad impression - Coonagh cross - Dock road - Horizon mall site - Tipperary road and Roxboro/ halting site across from Maldron ?? hotel.

the place just feels shabby and poor - too many scumbags who don't give a damn. Look at Waterford - problems with jobs etc. but its a pleasant place.

Mutant z

It's far too expensive to live for a start.

super_furry

If I could do my job outside of Dublin I'd definitely consider it - especially if I could move to Galway - but at the moment and for the foreseeable future, that's impossible.

bazz26

goochy wrote: »

as I have said before - the physical environment of limerick city and its suburbs is very poor. Dublin has bad areas / eyesores but you can live in Dublin and not go near them.
You come into Limerick from all the main approach roads and you get a bad impression - Coonagh cross - Dock road - Horizon mall site - Tipperary road and Roxboro/ halting site across from Maldron ?? hotel.

the place just feels shabby and poor - too many scumbags who don't give a damn. Look at Waterford - problems with jobs etc. but its a pleasant place.

Goochy I was expecting you to chime into this thread at some stage as you just seem to be drawn to any threads that put Limerick in a negative way and are as predictable as the rain.

You must wear blinkers and are a fan of the melodramatic or something because you obviously don't visit the likes of Waterford very often to make that daft observation. Take a stroll outside the Institute of Technology and head over to the nice Ballybeg housing estate across the road to meet the natives, let us know how you get on. Hardly a good impression for new students going to the college there.

As for Cork your current home away from the Pale, the drive in towards Blackpool is hardly a happy sight for visitors either. Take a look at the housing estates on the hill on your right and I'd doubt it would fill you with warm visions. Like most cities in Ireland these are working class areas where unemployment during the recession was high and as a result these places suffer.

Same goes with Limerick - Dock road, Horizon Centre, Connagh Cross all as a result of poor planning during the Celtic Tiger years that were left unfinished and fall into decay during the resulting recession. I think you have been watching too much of Angela's Ashes in that respect.

As for scumbags, yes we have a scumbag problem just like other cities and towns around the country but unlike those places we probably are not as good at hiding them and pretending they are not there.

pigtown

Cookiemunster wrote: »

@Balf. As was suggested earlier in the thread, head over to the M20 thread on the Roads forum and you'll find answers to all these questions (along with arguments against).

I wouldn't bank on that, I have raised the same concerns but the only argument in favour was the safety and time improvements.

Vanquished

bazz26 wrote: »

Goochy I was expecting you...

Don't feed the troll. It's obviously massively insecure. Pity it!

mdmix

Balf wrote: »

I know the M20 has become almost a symbolic project, so it's hard to look at it dispassionately (particularly as the N20 just isn't a good road.)

However, I still find that CBA reads more like an advocacy case than an analysis. For instance, when they say "expanding the catchment areas of Cork and Shannon Airports", what does that actually mean? Presumably, it would make Cork Airport more accessible to people who use Shannon and Shannon Airport more accessible to people who use Cork. There might be some hope, in that, of Shannon attracting some Cork-based business from Dublin.

But I can't really see anything in it for Cork Airport - which I'm not saying is a problem. Just if they mean that the road might create a stronger airport in Shannon, at the expense of Cork Airport but to the benefit of both the MidWest and the South, I'd prefer they said that more plainly.

However, the main thrust of the case seems to be the "spreading out" kind of vision, which hasn't served the country well. "Spreading out" favours Dublin - and partly explains why Galway Airport no longer has scheduled services.

Cork has better european routes and shannon has good connectivity to the US. I don't think either airport could "steal" significant traffic from the other but it would mean less of a commute for the majority of munster and some of the west. i know cork has some flights to the US now but that means nothing to business flyers who currently go to dublin or london for their US flights. as for me, i need to take a full or half day off work if i want to head away for the weekend as travel time to dublin airport can be 3 hrs by bus (depending on traffic) and has longer q's, this means less weekends away i don't have that many holidays. would appreciate the choice of 2 airports, as at the moment shannons weekend offer is poor and cork is not an option by bus

Balf

pigtown wrote: »

I wouldn't bank on that, I have raised the same concerns but the only argument in favour was the safety and time improvements.

I might raise the points on that other thread, but like yourself I didn't see much by way of answer - and there even seemed (on a quick read - hopefully I'll find time for a more leisurely look) to be a suggestion by some that the motorway should have a park and ride facility at each end, allowing transfer to rail/public transport, which struck me as rather odd.

mdmix wrote: »

Cork has better european routes and shannon has good connectivity to the US. I don't think either airport could "steal" significant traffic from the other ....

Leaving aside the problem of extending Cork's runway, I can't especially see why you wouldn't see a consolidation of routes between the two airports. 80% of Shannon's business is UK and Europe; no reason for it to stay there, if the road genuinely makes a change in habit.

And I'm sure a case could be made for the opposite - to say Cork would lose out to Shannon.

Assuming everything goes on much as before looks like:
a) talking around the issue, and
b) actually avoiding discussing how the cities could genuinely complement each other by sharing a common resource - whcih doesn't mean "you do the USA, and we'll do Europe". It might mean "you do the airport and port and rugby, and we'll do the third level and hospital and retail".

I'd wonder why that conversation isn't happening.

goochy

I visit Waterford regularly and know all about Ballybeg - but unless you go into Ballybeg you don't know its there - it looks well from the Cork Road.

Corks northside isn't great but its no where near as bad as limericks bad areas and yes its a bit hidden so unless you choose to go there

Unfortunately limericks poverty is too on show - as said before I think the people are great , love the riverside and think the Georgian city centre is much nicer than Cork BUT council/ corporation need to improve things.

like the Maldron has a halting site across the road from it. !

seachto7

Not to go off topic, but the last time I was in Cork, it looked very rundown in places. A lot worse than it used to be. No worse or better than LImerick

vkid

goochy wrote:

like the Maldron has a halting site across the road from it. !

That was a developer issue though no? The halting site was there before the hotel was built.

goochy

cork city centre side streets are a bit grubby I will agree but the place is booming - its suburbs / general overall environment is much better than Limerick or even Dublin.
it might not have lots of posh areas like Dublin - but I drive around the city / suburbs alot due to work and theres very few times where I think about how neglected / shabby areas look.

Shandon / Blackpool as well as Barrack and Douglas streets need work I will agree but overall its well kept - Corks worst area Knocknaheeny isn't even that bad and has Apple on its doorstep .

Making out Limerick is just like everywhere else is not helping things , if you admit things are bad theres a chance something will be done.

bazz26

goochy wrote: »

I visit Waterford regularly and know all about Ballybeg - but unless you go into Ballybeg you don't know its there - it looks well from the Cork Road.

Corks northside isn't great but its no where near as bad as limericks bad areas and yes its a bit hidden so unless you choose to go there

Unfortunately limericks poverty is too on show - as said before I think the people are great , love the riverside and think the Georgian city centre is much nicer than Cork BUT council/ corporation need to improve things.

like the Maldron has a halting site across the road from it. !

Again I think you focus too much on Limerick's bad points but brush off other city's bad points by explaining them away.

As for not knowing BallyBeg is there? It's right on the doorstep of Waterford Institute of Technology where students from afar attend. Stevie Wonder would know it's there. And Cork's northside, it's the first thing you see on the way in from the N20, etc. Head over towards the JL tunnel on the way to the airport and you're met with more questionable housing estates. I guess they are ok though because they are not in Limerick and Limerick has a reputation to be lived up to.

As for the Maldron hotel, that halting site was there long before that hotel was built along with the housing estates at the side of it. That's not to say that makes it ok but I'm still trying to figure out why a hotel was ever built in that area given it's in a suburb of city that isn't close to any tourist attractions or the city centre. I'm guessing they thought it would pull the passing business trade being close to the M7/M20 motorways and next to a few business centres but you cannot even get directly off the motorway to that area. Still open so there must be some sort of demand for it.

seachto7

goochy wrote: »

Making out Limerick is just like everywhere else is not helping things , if you admit things are bad theres a chance something will be done.

I don't get you? LImerick isn't any different as everywhere else. While you can't compare Dublin to Limerick, let's do it, seeing as the Dublin media had a pop off LImerick for long enough.
Dublin is certainly different to Limerick. It's well ahead of Limerick in terms of the amount of scumbags knocking around, for crime, and it's not all that pretty either.
O'Connell st in Dublin is a kip, as is a good half of the city centre.
The Kinehan and Hutch stuff puts anything that happened in Limerick in the shade.
Well off topic though. Limerick has its problems, but in general, I'd say it's no worse than Cork.
I do think people can be extra sensitive when it comes to criticising Limerick.

John_Mc

seachto7 wrote: »

I don't get you? While you can't compare Dublin to Limerick, let's do it, seeing as the Dublin media had a pop off LImerick for long enough.
Dublin is well ahead of Limerick in terms of the amount of scumbags knocking around, for crime, and it's not all that pretty either.
O'Connell st in Dublin is a kip, as is a good half of the city centre.
The Kinehan and Hutch stuff puts anything that happened in Limerick in the shade.
Well off topic though. Limerick has its problems, but in general, I'd say it's no worse than Cork.
I do think people can be extra sensitive when it comes to criticising Limerick.

Gotta agree with that. I was in Dublin for 10 years and the city centre is far far worse than Limerick. You actually feel very unsafe

goochy

as a Dub I have no problem saying Dublin is as bad as Limerick for scumbags and bad areas but as someone who lives in Cork 11 years now - all over cork city area and who plays 5 aside in one of the worst areas I think Cork somehow has got it right - don't know how but they have -

very few derelict sites / buildings outside of city centre side streets- the bad areas of cork are a VERY small part of Cork they don't take over the place as in limerick .
As said before I think theres a lot of settled travellers and lower lower class people there who have no sense of civility.

seachto7

goochy wrote: »

As said before I think theres a lot of settled travellers and lower lower class people there who have no sense of civility.

No different than anywhere else. They have a sense of civility in Cork?
Saying that, you could melt into the leafy burbs of Dublin and the city centre would seem like another country in terms of atmosphere, but big city I suppose.
I don't know where you get the lower class and settled traveller thing in Limerick being worse than other places. That's rubbish. Sorry.

goochy

I don't agree I drove into the council estate one afternoon beside roundabout nr kings castle . St johns pk?? It was like Detroit and I was actually scared during day time and I am from dublin and not the posh part. There's nothing in any other city bar a halting site like that place .

Insect Overlord

And how many times have you accidentally driven around Detroit?

Mc Love

goochy wrote: »

I don't agree I drove into the council estate one afternoon beside roundabout nr kings castle . St johns pk?? It was like Detroit and I was actually scared during day time and I am from dublin and not the posh part. There's nothing in any other city bar a halting site like that place .

Jesus you make it sound like Beirut, it's definitely not that bad.

OfTheMarsWongs

goochy wrote: »

I don't agree I drove into the council estate one afternoon beside roundabout nr kings castle . St johns pk?? It was like Detroit and I was actually scared during day time and I am from dublin and not the posh part. There's nothing in any other city bar a halting site like that place .

Perhaps visit the St. Mary's Community Festival this Sunday (1-6pm). Might help change your perception of the estate.

Cookiemunster

Lads, stop feeding the obvious troll and it will eventually go away.

johnnyryan89

OfTheMarsWongs wrote: »

Perhaps visit the St. Mary's Community Festival this Sunday (1-6pm). Might help change your perception of the estate.

This.

I live in the area and I remember the thread well where he describes Limerick as the Detroit of Ireland. St Mary's Park is in one of the regeneration sites but has been made worse by the buffoons who were employed to transform Limerick's council estates and Irish Water have the place constantly like a building site digging up roads and doing a half ass job relaying the roads.

As TheWarMongs suggested try coming to our community festival at the weekend and you'll see how good the community is below here.

goochy

I didn't accidently drive there - its actually part of my job .
Think part of Limericks problem is delusional people who wont face reality - that estate is like Beirut - you guys are just so used to it so don't realise it.

I have said my peace and will be leaving now , I wish limerick all the best but also wish its people would stop accepting mediocrity and thinking that everywhere else is like this when its not. .

panda100

goochy wrote: »

I have said my peace and will be leaving now ,.

You've said your piece, now leave us in peace

Tombo2001

zulutango wrote: »

Seems like an effort to sell Limerick as 'The Midwest', which is lamentable but also understandable. When I worked in Dublin I was amazed at how negative and skewed the impression people had of our city. In my own business we're short-staffed but there's little we can do to attract people to come here. They'd rather pay enormous rents and spend a long time commuting in Dublin than live in Limerick. We have a very big obstacle to overcome, imo.

Don't understand why you have to be so negative about it.

Damned if you do and damned if you don't.

Don't promote the place, you should be.

Do promote the place, you're doing it the wrong way.

As you know well, Ireland is extremely provincial - and if there is a strategy for Limerick, then sure as hell the next questions will be 'but whatabout Nenagh'......

And moreso, the reality is that commuting is more prevalent around the country than it is in Dublin. Jobs created in Limerick are employing people living in Clare, Tipp and Kerry.

BrokenArrows

Thats the stupidest article ever.
I stopped reading after the first sentence or two.

He worked in Dublin and his family lived in Limerick and he traveled to dublin to work during the week.
Of course thats unsustainable just as if if was the opposite way around where he traveled to Limerick from Dublin.

Tefral

I grew up in Limerick, School in Limerick, College in Limerick.

Got sick of Limerick and moved to Dublin for 7 years. Moved to London for a year with work. Quit my job and moved back to Limerick, best decision I ever made.

1. Commute time is now 20 mins each way compared to an hour in dublin and 1.5 hours in London
2. Was paying 1400 a month for apt in Dublin (its now 1900) Paying 600 pounds in london for a room in a house share that was the size of a shoe box. Paying €820 a month for a 3 bed house in annacotty
3. Alongside my family
4. More disposable income compared to Dublin and London

Tombo2001

Tombo2001 wrote: »

And moreso, the reality is that commuting is more prevalent around the country than it is in Dublin. Jobs created in Limerick are employing people living in Clare, Tipp and Kerry.

Really? There's plenty commute to Dublin from Cavan, Monaghan, Louth and Meath. I'm sure there's plenty from more southerly counties but I don't know any personally. :pac: There's people commuting from Armagh that I know as well.

seachto7

goochy wrote: »

I didn't accidently drive there - its actually part of my job .
Think part of Limericks problem is delusional people who wont face reality - that estate is like Beirut - you guys are just so used to it so don't realise it.

I have said my peace and will be leaving now , I wish limerick all the best but also wish its people would stop accepting mediocrity and thinking that everywhere else is like this when its not. .

That is one thing we seem to do in Ireland across the board.