Dublin - Metrolink (Swords to Charlemont only)

MJohnston

I don't really agree that it needs to be uniquely Irish. London Underground (or the older style tiled designs) belongs to London because it's an iconic design for London, but there's nothing specifically local about it. Similarly with those DC Metro stations too.

Unlike somewhere like Paris or Berlin too, we don't have a specifically Irish style of architecture that lends itself to station designs. The only themes you could latch onto would turn the places into a Carrolls or an Irish pub or something.

Just give me a utilitarian, functional station design with the flexibility to add a minimal sprinkling of creativity and personality from local artists.

Thrashssacre

Just give me an actual metro and I’ll be happy enough.

madbeanman

MJohnston wrote: »

I don't really agree that it needs to be uniquely Irish. London Underground (or the older style tiled designs) belongs to London because it's an iconic design for London, but there's nothing specifically local about it. Similarly with those DC Metro stations too.

Unlike somewhere like Paris or Berlin too, we don't have a specifically Irish style of architecture that lends itself to station designs. The only themes you could latch onto would turn the places into a Carrolls or an Irish pub or something.

Just give me a utilitarian, functional station design with the flexibility to add a minimal sprinkling of creativity and personality from local artists.

So I totally respect your opinion and like I said my priority is a functioning metro and part of that is a functional station design. But I do struggle to understand why you would prioritise something utilitarian over creativity and personality from local artists.

Keep in mind that I am not asking for a specifically Irish style in the architectural design of the stations. Im talking about how the interior is "decorated' essentially. I presume you weren't suggesting that we don't have traditional art, because we obviously do. Imagine getting subset involved (if you want to focus on street art that is distinctly Dublin). What if you had an installation of animation by Cartoon Saloon, in a station?

Because Metros are used by massive amounts of people and are a massive part of the public realm of any city, then I think there is a benefit in allowing them to frame the city and act as an extension of the area in which they sit.

MJohnston

madbeanman wrote: »

So I totally respect your opinion and like I said my priority is a functioning metro and part of that is a functional station design. But I do struggle to understand why you would prioritise something utilitarian over creativity and personality from local artists.

Basically because above all else, I want these stations to be cheap enough for the whole project to actually happen. That's the primary thing we all have to keep in mind, sadly, in regards to Irish infrastructure projects.

Utilitarian can be given personality - that's exactly what the Dublin Canvas project is about. We can do the same with these stations, but I'd rather see them built above all else, no matter the design.

Keep in mind that I am not asking for a specifically Irish style in the architectural design of the stations. Im talking about how the interior is "decorated' essentially. I presume you weren't suggesting that we don't have traditional art, because we obviously do. Imagine getting subset involved (if you want to focus on street art that is distinctly Dublin). What if you had an installation of animation by Cartoon Saloon, in a station?

Because Metros are used by massive amounts of people and are a massive part of the public realm of any city, then I think there is a benefit in allowing them to frame the city and act as an extension of the area in which they sit.

No, we obviously have traditional art, and plenty of wonderful modern art derived from traditional methods too. But having installations and art spaces within stations is very different from station design - ie. the architectural layout. You can have creative art installations in any kind of station design, but conversely it's really hard to design a station layout to reflect Irish culture without having to dip into the cliche.

The previous Metro North station designs were about as bland as you could possibly imagine, but if they existed, there would still be room for something like Dublin Canvas.

Lord Glentoran

madbeanman wrote: »

I don’t think that Washington Station says anything about Washington though? Unless it’s supposed to tell you that Washington is a brutalist hellscape (not that hellscapes aren’t architecturally interesting. I mean hellscape in its most positive sense because that pic does look cool.)

I think though that a metro should belong to the people. Like God bless that Copenhagen mess but that’s exactly what I don’t want it to be. (Again I’m not gonna protest about it. I’ll be happy with a well run service that isn’t overly gimped by middle class people who can’t tolerate a tiny bit of disruption to their lives for the sake of making people’s lives in the most populated part of the county better.)

Make it belong to Ireland or belong to Dublin. Totally agree with not having it overrun by ads either.

We could have the station interiors pebble dashed and painted with grey Snowcem. That would make them uniquely Irish.

salmocab

Lord Glentoran wrote: »

We could have the station interiors pebble dashed and painted with grey Snowcem. That would make them uniquely Irish.

With immersion tanks for every passenger

caff

No need to have one style have each station different. Maybe run a competition between architecture students throughout the country?

lawred2

Is this metro still happening?

salmocab

caff wrote: »

No need to have one style have each station different. Maybe run a competition between architecture students throughout the country?

That unnecessarily drives up costs.

CatInABox

lawred2 wrote: »

Is this metro still happening?

So far, yes.

Next up is a report on the public consultation, with details of all submissions. Then they'll take those on board, use them to make any alterations, and then finally proceed to seek planning permission. This should happen in Q2 2020, with approval expected in 2021.

cgcsb

CatInABox wrote: »

So far, yes.

Next up is a report on the public consultation, with details of all submissions. Then they'll take those on board, use them to make any alterations, and then finally proceed to seek planning permission. This should happen in Q2 2020, with approval expected in 2021.

Glacial pace, it must be said. We're still almost a whole year from planning being sought after 45 years of talk and reports

Muahahaha

Is a year to wait for planning permission a bit long? You'd think ABP would be able to turn it around in 6 months or less. Its frustrating how long this stuff takes.

FreudianSlippers

lawred2 wrote: »

Is this metro still happening?

I'd personally be worried about it going ahead if the world does go into recession by Q2 next year; US & Germany on the brink, I'd expect our government to do entirely the wrong thing and scrap capital expenditure in that case, making things worse.

donvito99

FreudianSlippers wrote: »

I'd personally be worried about it going ahead if the world does go into recession by Q2 next year; US & Germany on the brink, I'd expect our government to do entirely the wrong thing and scrap capital expenditure in that case, making things worse.

Cancel on the basis that thousands will be out of work, therefore less cars on the road.

Then it will be repackaged in 2032 as MetroIink-Lite and we'll start all over again. Indian filmmakers will travel to Dublin to document the Green Line's overcrowding.

CatInABox

More ground works going on.

https://twitter.com/GraemeMcQ/status/1163443572470964225

Yes, I know it doesn't mean much, but still, it's good to see.

Thelonious Monk

FreudianSlippers wrote: »

I'd personally be worried about it going ahead if the world does go into recession by Q2 next year; US & Germany on the brink, I'd expect our government to do entirely the wrong thing and scrap capital expenditure in that case, making things worse.

This is what I’ve always said. Not a chance in f*cking hell this is happening in my lifetime. The people who matter here drive their range rovers to work, I’d say FFFG would love a reason to pull out of this as any TD on the line probably doesn’t want any disruption to their constituents, as we’ve seen on the south side part of the proposed line, and every TD outside of Ireland hates money being spent in Dublin and just want bypasses and more roads built in their constituencies. Our whole system means this can never happen in the relatively short windows between rececessions.

Qrt

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

This is what I’ve always said. Not a chance in f*cking hell this is happening in my lifetime. The people who matter here drive their range rovers to work, I’d say FFFG would love a reason to pull out of this as any TD on the line probably doesn’t want any disruption to their constituents, as we’ve seen on the south side part of the proposed line, and every TD outside of Ireland hates money being spent in Dublin and just want bypasses and more roads built in their constituencies. Our whole system means this can never happen in the relatively short windows between rececessions.

In all fairness, the south side section was scrapped because of the canal, and the disruption was much worse than thought.

They’re still planning it.

plodder

madbeanman wrote: »

That Stockholm one is particularly gorgeous. It really seems distinctly Scandinavian.

I definitely think that you could do so much with what we have. If you wanted to lean into Oirishness you could make it all Celtic. If you wanted it to be more representative of Dublin then it could perhaps tell the story of Dublin. Station X takes on a particular theme relevant to the local area (like was suggested on the previous page; 1916 stuff in the O’Connell station or park themed stuff in the St. Stephen’s Green station)

I do also like the idea of the Dublin canvas peeps getting on board. Many of those designs do brighten up the city

I think Griffith Park should be named "Botanic Gardens" instead. Imagine the fun you could have with station design around that name.

CatInABox

plodder wrote: »

I think Griffith Park should be named "Botanic Gardens" instead. Imagine the fun you could have with station design around that name.

The names of all the stations are quite unimaginative in my opinion. Why go for "Glasnevin" when it could be called "Cross Guns".

Sam Russell

CatInABox wrote: »

The names of all the stations are quite unimaginative in my opinion. Why go for "Glasnevin" when it could be called "Cross Guns".

Or Whitworth, or Royal Canal, or ......

Zebra3

CatInABox wrote: »

The names of all the stations are quite unimaginative in my opinion. Why go for "Glasnevin" when it could be called "Cross Guns".

To make it easier for people to understand where stations are located.

Donaghmede > Howth Junction.

Navan Road > Phoenix Park.

Busman Paddy Lasty

Or Whitworth, or Royal Canal, or ......[/quote]

...... the nearby townland of Slutsend

Alvin Holler

Sam Russell wrote: »

CatInABox wrote: »

The names of all the stations are quite unimaginative in my opinion. Why go for "Glasnevin" when it could be called "Cross Guns".

Or Whitworth, or Royal Canal, or ......

Whitworth road pretty much connects this proposed station and drumcondra station so that would pretty confusing.

And sure people might be looking for Mullingar if they get off at royal canal station.

Sam Russell

Alvin Holler wrote: »

Whitworth road pretty much connects this proposed station and drumcondra station so that would pretty confusing.

And sure people might be looking for Mullingar if they get off at royal canal station.

Well, you could go for the 'or ....' then.

CatInABox

The crayonism of our elected officials has put the entire Metrolink project at risk. Absolutely shameful that people with no transport planning expertise are able to overrule those with years of experience.

MetroLink threatened by new plan - minister

prunudo

By all means look for additional lines but they should be stand alone lines not spurs and not be allowed to delay the implementation of the current north south line any further.

designshexagon

Additional spurs to Knocklyon and UCD are not bad ideas as such but it makes no sense to risk completely derailing the entire project when these branches can be built afterwards. With the tunnel ending just before Ranelagh, there should be space to eventually extend the tunnelling south-west and south-east without affecting the original Metro North. The last thing this project needs is another hold up.

prunudo

Spurs are a terrible idea, they limit capacity on the 'shared' section, ultimately leading to capacity constraints in the future.

designshexagon

I've seen spurs that work well and some that work badly. Certainly you cannot have trains leaving every 2 minutes on a spur line. However, I have seen spurs work decently in cities such as Brussels where the spur lines have trains leaving no less than every 5 minutes and no more than every 10 minutes allowing trains to leave every 2-3 minutes or so on the shared section.
But I agree that they are not ideal and, if possible, separate lines as opposed to 2 spurs would be a better option. But this debate should absolutely not hold up or end Metrolink. What's more important is at least having a metro in the city. Southside extensions and lines should be discussed once Swords-Charlemont is fully on track.

plodder

CatInABox wrote: »

The crayonism of our elected officials has put the entire Metrolink project at risk. Absolutely shameful that people with no transport planning expertise are able to overrule those with years of experience.

MetroLink threatened by new plan - minister

Presumably, the minister will just overrule it, and what are they going to do then? Say their 'democratic mandate' has been squashed? I've never voted for one. Is it time to get rid of these joke "assemblies" maybe? How many people know about them, and how much do they cost us?